I am tooling up to do some hunting next fall with my Dads old M36 Marlin. I killed my first deer with it 40 years ago, so its kind of a nostalgia thing.

I want to use a cast bullet 31141, but the experience I had when I have shot deer with it before with hard bullets was that the bullet didn't expand at all, it kind of broke up into buckshot like chunks as it passed through the deer.

I'm thinking I may try a two part bullet this time. I plan to pour a measured small amount of pure lead into the nose, and then finish filling with linotype. Anybody messed with these before could give me some pointers before I reinvent the wheel?

Two part bullets are made with a lock and key type of mechanism that is swaged together. You had the right idea the first time, but needed softer lead. 30: or 40:1 would be best. Or pure lead if you shoot paper patched bullets. Soft lead will not break, it just mushes up and kills stuff.

your two part bullet will not hold together - sorry but I give you very little chance of success with that method. It would almost certainly break up as bad or worse than the first bullets you described.

Large flat noses help a lot too.

Brent

It can be done, and there are several ways to do it. Lyman once offered and may still offer, moulds to cast two pieces to epoxy together. Other makers, including Mountain Molds I believe, offer moulds with which you cast a nose piece first which is then placed in the cavity into which the harder alloy will be poured.



LBT once offered a metering casting pot which allowed the casting of the base before the nose had solidified. This method minimizes the separation problem.



The poor boy's method, which I have used successfully in cast .45-70 HPs is to melt pure lead bullets of the appropriate weight in a casting dipper suspended over a propane torch. While it is getting to temp, you are busily casting from your regular pot. The process depends on the mould and the alloy being as hot as is practical. When the lead is ready, it goes into the mould, followed by the rest of the alloy as rapidly as possible. That bullet gets dumped into a separate container, and you continue casting as next one melts.



It's slow and tedious, but it works. You only need about 10 bullets to confirm that POI is not seriously affected and 15 or 20 for hunting with.



An easier method, which I have not yet tried myself, is said to be annealing the noses of heat treated bullets. If I have it right, bullets are cast from an alloy of half lead, half WW, with some premium birdshot added. They are GCed, sized and heat treated. Then they are placed in a pan with water up over the front driving band and annealed with a propane torch. Base stays hard and the nose becomes as soft as the alloy allows.

I was just talking about this very subject to a mate the other day. Interesting replys.

Forster used to make a 'hollow pointer' to use on cast bullets. I've used mine on pistol bullets to finish of wild bore and it worked fine in combination with hard bullets.

bilmac. I have said 2 part mold from mountain molds and highly recomend it. Dan says it's tediously slow, but I can make about 50 in an hour. The temps. are important, but the results are worth it in my opinion. When the nose portion is inserted into the mold, use a small dowel to push it firmly to the front before pouring the rather hot base metal. I've done impact tests with these, and my results made me very happy indeed. I put together a .358 Win. about 2 yrs ago specifically for cast shooting, sent Dan @ Mountain molds a chambercast and requested a 2 part .358 mold around 235 grs. with a meplat of approx. 60%. The result I got from him is an excellent mold ( the best I own ) that throws a boolit of 234 grs. My impact tests with a nose of BHN approx 10 and body of approx. BHN of 15 ( lyman #2 ) @ 100 yds. 2.5" group @ 2100 '/sec. Usually arond 1.5"-2" with one piece boolit. Expansion test was excellent and retained weight was approx. 200- 210 grs. Following Dans method of construction, the base cannot be torn from the nose with a pair of pliers, rather the nose is ripped apart first. The joint between front and back is barely visible as a slight difference in colour, certainly not a seperation line. I shot my black bear with a 71/84 mauser this yr. although I was hoping to use the .358, maybe next yr. Dan's a modest person regarding his product, in my opinion. There are certainly other ways of going to be sure, but for the price of one of his molds, you not only get a 2 part mold but also a mold made specifically for the chamber of your gun, life is good. Good luck with whatever you choose. Ron.D

Ross Seyfreid wrote an article on softnose bullets about 18 months back. He suggested making a mini-dipper out of a small pistol case like a 32 ACP, pouring a mini dipper of pure lead in first, then filling the remainder of the cavity with a hard alloy. I haven't tried his method but it should work and the advantage is that it can be done with any mold. The disadvantage is that you'll need two pots.

The softnose molds work great, providing the nose is long enough. If the nose is less than one caliber long then it can be very challenging to set in the cavity straight.

I made my first softnoses by casting bullets of pure lead, sawing off the nose with a hacksaw, filing the cut smooth and flat, and then using that as a softnose. It took me an entire weekend to make 50 rounds. But they worked great and 50 rounds of hunting bullets will last a long time.

What if you drill a hole in the nose of a "hard" bullet (making a hollow point) and fill it with pure lead?

Think that would be effective?

Sounds to me like your problem is simply too hard bullets.

There used to be an outfit that made a little pot just for this trick. Somehow it would throw a metered amount of lead, and then you poured the remainder of the bullet from your regular pot. I was thinking along the lines of making a little dipper, but that might cool too much on the way to being poured. What leftover suggested about melting a measured amount in an old fashoned bullet casting dipper might work better. The mass of the dipper would hold the heat, and it is already designed to pour into a sprue plate.The question of how to use close to the same amount of lead each time would not be a big problem as I have a spool of lead wire I was going to make jacketed bullets out of. It is soft, and it would be a simple matter to cut the same length for each bullet.

A question I've always had about pouring hot lead on hot lead is does the lead mix, or is the nose already set before the body is cast. A more accurate bullet would probably be cast if the nose was still molten and there was a little mixing at the junction. My hypothisis is that this would result in no fault line between the two like might occur if the nose had hardened.

Thanks for the suggestions guys a dozen heads are always better than one. I don't think I'll go the special mold route as I may only hunt a year or two with this rig before I'm off on some other adventure like taking my critters with a pistol caliber in a lever gun.

The way I do it is melt what ever weight and hardness nose I want in a mould on a hot plate then pour the rest when it's molten. Suggest rubber band the handles when doing this. Have done this with both iron and alum moulds without a problem as far as warping or anything else. Melting lead in a mould and cooling is a slow process. A damp cloth speeds cooling. ben.

Taking deer with cast bullet is nothing unique or new--they done it over a hundred years ago. Use a jacketed bullet and reduce risks.

Heat is the key in casting these. You want the first melt hot so that when the second is pour in it will fuse with the softer lead. These bullets act like a Nosler partition. If you want ot see how they work I think the moderator on Graybeardoutdoors.com cast bullet sections sells them. He might have some good info on keeping up production numbers.

Hcliff

I tend to agree with the too-hard bullet theory, in your first experience. Personally, I've never found anything wrong with plain old air-cooled wheelweights, for hunting bullets. They're hard enough to go plenty fast, with a gas check; and soft enough to expand(or at least "rivet") on game. Plus, in the .30-30, you can shoot full-house loads with cast bullets. It has more to do with where ya hit em! It's kinda like John Nosler(?) said to an irate customer: "After recovering your game, at what point did you determine the bullet failed?"