Hi Fellows,
Just now seen the brown truck at the front gate. Recieved 3 jugs WC820 [1 for me 2 for buddies] and 1 jug WC820f. Looking for a subsitute for AA7 in contender and B.F. 30-20 & 32HR with Seaco 117grBB & LY130gr carbine bullet. Both the 30-20's shoot any 165-200gr with 9 to 9.5 WC820 my lot. Rang a few rams at 200yds with RCBS165sil, went to LY190gr and have'nt rung one since. please remember these loads were fired in a contender and B.F. falling block with my lot of 820 and are too hot for older rifles and all revolvers. I figured 820f would be close to AA7 burn rate which works real well with lighter bullets. I have'nt read any reports on 820f so the first chance I have to ck. it out I'll give a range report. I also got 200LC68 30-06 match brass from Jeff @ $15 per 100. Damned good brass, unfired and deprimed. Won't be long before there is no more, I can't find 7.62 match now. Having a ball shooting cast bench rest matches at 2 local clubs. Kind of informal and laid back. Proud of my results since I don't go extreme B.R. measures. Shoot 3 classes now military issue[03-a3], heavy iron sight[30-06 1 inch bull bbl douglas on 03 action] and heavy scope[.308 heavy bbl shilen on 1909 Arg action with Tasco 8-32. Well post getting long for a one finger typest that can't spell.
Later,
Pb Head

My lot of WC 820 came with instructions to use AA #9 [loading] data. In practice I find it to be smoewhere between AA #9 and H 110. Btw, in samll doses, say 15-16grs. it makes a dandy CB rifle powder in the 6.5 Swe. Mau. up to the 8mm Mau. Hope this helps, ...Maven

Hey Maven,

Didn't realize you were a NY boy.

Greetings from Putnam County.

Headstamp

My jug of WC820 is lot# BAJ 47320
Is this the fast or regular?
It seems to take 1-2gn less than 296 for similar velocities in my 454 with 300gn+ bullets. It seems to be a bit bulkier than 296. I run out of powder space sooner than I'd like to.
The biggest case I've tried it in is my 30-30. It seemed to do pretty well in that though. Could you use it in larger cases like 45-70 or 470NE?

The WC820f is faster then other lots of 820. According to Jeff you compare to HS7 data. I have tried the old 820 in 30-06 and 8MM at 14 to 16gr and it does just fine with bullets between 180-215gr. It's also my powder of choice for .357 long range sillywet, 11-11.5gr behind 180 Seaco TC or RCBS 200 gc out of 10 in. contender. I just hope this new fast lot works as good on light bullets as the other lots worked with heavy bullets.

Lar45,

My keg of WC-820 is the same number 47320 BUT does not have the BAJ in front of the number. SO, it might not be the same lot number. Regardless, my WC-820 loads at AA #9 data, that would be a few grains less than H-110 or 296. All I have loaded so far using this data (#9) has be O.K. Your label, on the gallon jug, should indicate starting data. I suspect that unless your WC-820 has the “f” after the WC-820f, it is not HS-7 data powder. Good-luck…BCB

Headstamp, Born & raised in NY State. Have lived in NY all my life except 9/66 - 8/70 when I was in graduate school in Phila. ...Maven

Ok, so Hodgdon does NOT recommend reduced loads with H110, and Winchester does not recommend reduced loads with 296 . . . and folks tell us they are the same powder.

Others tell us we can use H110 data for "normal" speed WC820.

My question . . . How come we can use reduced loads with cast bullets, and Hornady even recommends it for 300 grain condum loads in 45-70?

Just curious . . well curious, and a couple of years ago a company goofed and sent WC820 instead of the powders I had ordered so I have a lot to use and would LOVE to use it behind leadhead loads in a bunch of different things!

LouisB

I've used my WC820 in 44 mag loads down to 800fps without any problems.

Lar45,

I am using 15 grains of the WC-820 and the RCBS 44-250-K for a muzzle velocity in my SRH of right at the one grand mark. What load and bullet are you using to get the 800 fps velocity? That should be a dang nice shooter with NO recoil...BCB

BCB, I used 13 gns WC820 and a 250 Keith for 860fps out of my 7.5" Bisley. I didn't try below that. 20 gns gave me around 1350 and 22 went 1440. My most accurate seemed to be 21 gns at 1360fps and 1.25" at 25 yds. I didn't do alot of work with these, just loaded and took them to the range.
I really like this WC820, I wish I'd have found out about it years ago.

.......Go to the Castpics website for WC820 (various lots) load data. Check any of the pistol rounds listed for load data.
Castpics.

WC820 is an extremely useful full power type powder and as is also a PITA to use through a measure :-). In an article from "Handloader" magazine on loading cast lead in the 40-90 Sharps, the author mentioned exceptional results with "A certain Lot of surplus WC820". Not lot number nor any load data forthcoming from him. Maybe since it wasn't a recognized canister grade propellant?

..........Buckshot

There is a very fast lot of WC820 out there. A guy on the 1911 forums was running on about the results he was getting in .45 acp. With charge weights in the 9 to 10 grain range it would seem to be burning like AA#7 or Blue Dot. I never went there as the guy couldn't produce any chrony or pressure data, and at 9 grains a shot it would be more expensive than Titegroup. BD

I got around to trying a few loads of 820f in the wifes 30-20 BF. It appeared to shoot the same group size and about 1/4 in lower at 25yds. Thats compared to 7gr of AA7 to 6gr 820f both with 117gr seaco. No signs of pressure at all. Could'nt get ft per sec, battery dead in my speed-o-meter. A couple of years ago a bunch of us at our bowling pin shoots were shooting 18gr of 820 behind 250gr Keith .44mag revolvers. In cold weather we started haveing what I call pooffers. The powder did'nt ignite and the bullet would lodge an inch or so down the bbl. When you pushed the bullet out you found the powder in a clump like it was wet although it was'nt. This would happen 2-4 times a night. I switched to 9.5unique or now 7.5bullseye. Never any trouble in any other cal with 820. It burns clean and never leads up my bbl.
Pb Head

Sounds like you needed a mag primer with those 44mag loads.

I've got a batch of WC820 pulldown that seems to load like AA#9 in the .44 Mag with ~240 grain lead bullets. There's an awful lot of variation in this powder from lot to lot. One thing I wonder is how old some of these lots are. Ball powders generally have a surface layer impregnated with dibutyl phthalate as the deterrent. DBP is a viscous, oily liquid at normal ambient temperatures that's a solvent/plasticizer for nitrocellulose. It's been shown that in double base powders it slowly migrates into the interior of the grains during storage, reducing the concentration of deterrent on the surface so the powder becomes effectively a faster burning, less "progressive" one than when it was made. The end of service life of stored ammunition using these powders may be reached when the pressure becomes excessive.

Deterrents don't migrate in single-base powders, but over time the nitrocellulose in them breaks down to smaller molecular weights and the powder becomes less flexible and more brittle. The actual burning rate and energy content change very little, but the grains may contain hairline cracks and are more likely to fracture on firing, especially at high loading densities, which increases the burning surface area and runs the pressure up.

It seems counterintuitive that old stored powders get "hotter," but that's what's been reported from tests under both accelerated aging at elevated temperatures and normal long term storage conditions.

I love these cheap surplus powders and they're mostly what I use. But it's important to remember that they're not quite the same as the powders of similar designations listed in the loading manuals. (And WC820 is NOT the same powder as 296 or H110, though some lots may have similar characteristics.) You need at least a Chrony and some common sense to use them. If I'd loaded my .44 with my WC820 to recommended 296 levels (as suggested by the vendor at the time I bought it) I'd've gotten some nice proof rounds for sure!