I like the 45 70 but hear the Marlin wont chamber the 500 grainers is that still true? I also like the 444 Marlin round. Which one of these rifles are more accurate for cast bullets? I cast a 320 grain which I like for my 44 mag pistol. Would the 444 shoot this accurately at 100 yds? Does Marlin make a longer 45 70 say 20 inch barrel? Does Marlin still make a 444 with ballard rifling? Accurate meaning 2 inches at 100yds. Any help would be appreciated thanks

Be happy, get the Ballard rifling 45-70. Mine has a 26" barrel. Special run Cowboy Model they made.
the .444 will have a very slow IIRC 1:38" twist.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

I realize that the 45 70 is more versitle round for hunting. My question again is If I had 2 marlins side by side say 24 inch barrels one in 444 ballard and the other in 4570 ballard which one is going to group better at 100 yds. What would be the winning cast bullet in weight and type in both rifles? Which would be better for reduced plinking loads? Yes I do reduced loads in 06 3030 8mm and 6.5mm with cast bullets no gas check and no filler. I have great sucess and can do as good as 2 inches at 100 yds! Im looking for a rifle that will handle cast bullets with no gas check for fun and gas checks for higher velosity loads and maybe a few jacketed bullets but cast bullets for the most part.

if you shoot light loads meaning light bullets and slow velocity you will be very disappointed with most .444s because the twist is one turn in 38 inches. I have never figured out where that retarded twist came from but a 20" twist works great in handguns and Contender carbines.

Whats the twist in the 45 70?

1:20 or 1:18" Either way it will shoot even the 500gr Lyman 457125 (std 500gr for 45-70) sub 2moa at 100 from the 45-70. You are about maxxed out with the 265gr Hornady or similiar length cast.
It's a hyper-44 magnum for powder.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

I have one of those older 1-38" twist micro-groove models and it actually does very nicely with reduced loads & lighter slugs.

I bought mine after reading an article In 10th ed. Handloaders Digest .444 Formula for Survival by Robert K. Sherwood. I found that the 8 gr. load of Unique with a round ball hit the same place as a 265 Hornady full power at 25 yds. You put a .440 round ball thru a .430" sizer and coat the top with LLA after loading. I also have great success with 12 grains Unique and the Lee 200 gr. RF.

I was using Blue Dot in 20.5 gr. doses with the Lyman 429244 but in light of the big Blue Dot scare going on now, don't know what to tell you.

Only one load of his in the article that ever gave me trouble was one using 10 grains of Unique and a .410 WW plastic wad over the powder filled with 1/2 oz. shot and a roundball crimped on top of that gave me any trouble. It caused extrememly difficult extraction. Don't know what was the culprit there?

So, for a plinker, the .444 is one fun gun! Ask my son who killed many many soda cans using those 200 grain Lee slugs at the tender age of 8.

Hey Newtire how bout 44 mag bullets say 200 gr or 240 gr anyone tried with 444 ballard rifling? Whats the blue dot scare? I use it all the time

They changed the new .444's to 1 in 20 but not the .44 mag.
Be aware the so called "Ballard rifling" is still only .003" deep like the micro groove so use an oversize boolit.

Are you looking for target work or hunting work? For target work I'd look at other rifles.

For hunting work I'd say you'd find either rifle will be just fine. While you might not be able to chamber a 500 gr bullet in the 45-70, I really can't see using anything heavier than 400 gr in a 45-70 lever gun. Such a load will cleanly take any NA game, and the added velocity flattens the trajectory a fair bit.

Now that they've put a barrel with reasonable twist on the 444, that's a good option. Think of it as a 3/4 power 45-70. And barring AK, I figure a 300 gr. @~2000 fps is plenty. If you already cast for a 44 mag, your molds will do double duty.

Im looking for accuracy period would like 2in at 100 but would love 1 and a half. I live in Ky so all im shooting is whitetail wont allow bear hunting yet but they are a comin up! I was on another forum and a guy was thinking like me . He was thinking 44 mag lever which I once had and looked at a 444. He wanted accurate downloads for plinking 44 mag style. He also wanted full blown loads that get the job done for hunting like me. thats what I want and since I cast 3 different weights up to 325 grain or so for the 44 mag Im seriously thinking 444 now! I once owned a 44 lever and it seemed like a pop gun to me didnt do much and wasnt accurate. Im sure there are accurate ones out there. The 444 looks like some serious medicine for me. Im sure the 45 70 is lots more powerful and probably a better round but if I can get 2 inches at 100 and still plink I think thats what I want. whats the best barrel length for what I want 22 24 ?

Just go to this guy's website if you want to know about .444's. He's killed some mighty big critters with his.

http://www.ranchdogmolds.com/

Either caliber will do much better than 2", 100 yard groups. Many will do sub-inch with quality loads. As mentioned above, the new Ballard rifled bbl's are a bit shy on the "deep cut" ad line pitch. Shoot your boolits big.

Beartooth Bullets sells a 525 gr "PileDriver", and J.B. Young sells a 550 gr "Crater" that are designed for the Marlin action.