Have had a good cast lino bullet load for 7x57 in that I have the 160gn bullet at 2415fps over 39gn ADI 2209 (H4350) and WLR giving me 1 1/4 - 1 1/2 for 5 shots at 100yds and with a 150yd zero has a usable 250yd range. Have wanted to use a cast bullet on meat but not with the straight lino so have cast doner bullets of a 50/50 pure lead and a 90/10 ww/lino alloy I had lots of. Made a jig to cut a 65gn portion from the nose and used this to set into the front of the mould and topped up with the straight lino. By re-melting the resulting bullet while still in the mould I have got a one piece soft nosed lino bullet,(not unlike the partition) that still runs at 2415 with the same good hunting accuracy. Have the utmost confidence in this bullet now and will try it out on goat in the new year.

Von Gruff.

That should work just dandy Von Gruff.
I would think that bullet would work on any animal the you would use a jacketed 160 gr. bullet on. If you don't mind a few questions.
1. What mold are you using?
2. Do you water drop the bullet out of the mold?
Thanks

It is the Lyman 287641 Silh GC mould.
I do not water drop.
There were a few extra complications to getting this bullet shooting efectively in this particular rifle. It had worked reasonably well in previous 7x57 but this new rifle is a custom 1908 with 25in barrel and the bore is .0005 under the dia of the nose riding section of the bullet as dropped so the solution has been a few more steps in the sizing process but the results are worth it. First thing was to take a Lee push through die and lap it out to .2855 for .0015 over groove dia which means there is only .0005 sizing of the drive bands and that was not enough resistance to set the GC square or even fully onto the shank. I took a standard 7/8 bolt and had it cut and squared to use as a blank in the press and with an alloy tube opened up to go over the stem of the Lee set and long enougn to support the bullet so with a GC on it can be seated up against the blank bolt in the press. They are all run through then the standard push through set up has the GC crimped properly and SQUARE to the drive bands. The mould drops the bullet with the nose - bore riding part of the bullet .0005 bigger than the dia of the bore and can push the bullet back into the case with the prefered oal, so I took an unused die from my Lyman lubrisizer ( a .357) and had the top opened out to except a neck sizer button (Wilson or Redding), turned the stem down to enter the apropriate button and shortened the dia so a thin washer would hold the button in under the lubrisizer locking nut. I can now size just enough of the nose to .0005 under bore dia so the propper oal can be achieved. With the front of the front drive band flush with the mouth of the case the correct bullet base to case neck - shoulder junction is met. There is .0005 engraving of the remaining nose of the bullet which I believe aids accuracy and as designed the soft nose is about the length of the nose that is sized down so there is no contact and no chance of leading at this velocity. I dip lube the base in a hot 75/25 bees wax/vasaline lube and push them through a cut down case to clean the excess off. I also dip lube the nose of the bullet in thinned LLA after loading just because there is at least as much nose - bore contact as there is drive band - land/groove contact.

Von Gruff.

Von,
Thanks for your reply. It's sounds like you really have to jump thru some hoops to size that Lyman to fit your rifle. When you say that you use a Wilson or Redding neck sizer button are you referring to their neck sizing "bushings"?

I have a 7X57 and a 7-08 that I would like to shoot cast in next summer if I get the time. I still need to make throat impact impressions but I already know that the 7X57 has a very long throat just by using the Stoney Point OAL tool with jacketed bullets. I think that I may have to get a two different molds to fit these rifles. I'll know more after the throat impressions are made.
I would like to hear how your cast bullet performs on game once you take it hunting. I have seen pictures of your 7X57 posted in the past and I must say it it a beauty.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Low Wall:
When you say that you use a Wilson or Redding neck sizer button are you referring to their neck sizing "bushings"?

It is the bushings I am talking about. This only came about because of the .0005 difference in nose dia compared to the bore size. I considered getting a custom mould made as I did for my 404 (which incidently has shot a 350gn lino GC at 2363fps into .33 @ 55yds - aperture) but as the Lyman design is good I decided to see if I could get it to shoot first. I am known for persistance( it has been called pig headedness by the uncharitable) and as part of my shooting passion is the handloading and casting side, I find it an added bonus to be able to tinker like this. I am never sure whether it is the shooting of the full cartridges or the playing with the empty cases that brings the most satisfaction. I do know there is a sense of acomplishemnt then anticlimax when I finally get a particular load sorted and have to think 'what next'. I have a safe full of loaded ammo each for that special ocasion or "need"
I have to say though that with a 120gnGS HV at 3235fps, a 160gn Woodleigh at 2715fps and the 160gn softnosed cast at 2415fps most of everything else is redundant.
I have a friend with a 7 08 and he shoots the 140gn sucesfully although his is, by definition, a much shorter range option as he uses a softer alloy at lower velocity, and while I cant deny the effectiveness of the 1800aprox vel, the curved trajectory will bring its own restrictions. For mine at 2415fps I am 1.2in high at 100, zero @ 150, -3.3 @ 200, and -9in @ 250, still with 1784fps.
As to the design, this long bore riding section being slightly bigger than the bore has been a good thing as in previous rifles it was a tight sliding fit and accuracy topped out at around 2000fps. So being able to tailor the size to bore has been an advantage, and with the drive bands sized as they are I have the fit that brings about the needed accuracy at the velocity I felt was needed for the open ground I usually hunt goats in where a couple of hundred yards is not unusual although I have taken a few at almost the end of the barrel as well, as happened with the 404 a month back.

Von Gruff.
edit -- sp

von gruff since you are sizing down both the nose and body and seating the gc's in a separate step.
this might help you some a softer alloy will pour you a smaller boolit.
i would try 50-50 ww's and pure with about 1% tin added.
water drop these.
wait 14 days and measure their diameters.
now if they are correct the hardness should be near 18 bhn, [now you say the nose is too hard]
with some practice you can de-temper the nose section back to it's original alloy hardness about 8-9.
you stand the boolits up in a pan of water to about the depth you wanna soften them pass a torch over them till you see them take a color change then let them cool down fully do not tip them over or you will re harden them.
it takes some practice but you will see immediate results and if you sweat them or mess them up re-cast them.
you now hve a seamless two-part expanding hard based boolit.

Lamar thanks for the input but I think you miss the intent of my posts. I did try casting in softer alloy but couldnt get the velocity I wanted with accuracy. I have tried a number of aproaches to get where I am now with a softnosed bullet at 2400fps+ having decent hunting accuracy. Even with a softer alloy the difference in bullet dia is not enough to not require nose sizing from this mould and in this barrel. As I said I could have got a custom mould made but I like this design and wanted to see if I could get it to work up to my requirements, which it ultimately has and it is part of my casting - handloading pleasure to include these steps in getting such a good result. I have 70 cast and loaded which should see me through this hunting season and the results on meat will indicate whether I continue with this aproach. I cant see how an improvement could be made on a 160gn soft nosed, hard shanked bullet at 2400fps+ and a few hours extra in casting and sizing is not a detractor.

Von Gruff.

von gruff.
the alloy change with the water drop i was suggesting will give you the base bhn of 22 which you are using i suggested it so that the nose de-tempering,would not have the two part alloy.
the method you use is what i refer to as the bruce b. method.
it works pretty well as long as you get no oxidation on the softer alloy you are using for the nose.
i was just suggesting an alternative.
my testing with the 7mm showed very good penetration but rather poor nose expansion ,unless the alloy was softened on the nose then the expansion had a tendency to stop the penetration,or to redirect the path of travell [tumbling]
i hope your shooting goes well for you.
Lamar.

Lamar I have not tried the anealing method. How do you get a consistent anealing of the nose. I have oven HT bullets before but not water dropped. I understood that sizing after HT either oven or water dropped would effect the HT. When oven treating I would size then HT then GC and lube. Especially for the 404 Jeffery I found the hardness of the HT bullet to be almost press breaking and so softnosing was the next step in a sucession of trials for this 7x57 that stopped when I had sucess. No doubt the anealing would have been on the list if S/N hadn,t worked as well as it has.
I believe that first a load with exceptable accuracy and velocity must be found before the softnosing by whichever method can be attempted. As I said I tried with a softer alloy but couldn,t get either requirement in this particular rifle although I did not try water dropping which may have lead to a different result. Hope to contact a station owner this week for permission to hunt goat on his high countery in the next couple of weeks and will give the softies a try.

Von Gruff.