Guys,

I have recently acquired an H&H Paradox 12 bore. The bores are excellent, but that's due to the fact that they have been honed out over the years to keep them pit-free. They now measure L. .745 & R. .754 The rifling on both measures .687 land to land.

The standard projectiles for this gun are .725.

Am I going to have to make custom projectiles for this gun to get it to shoot??? I have concerns about gas sealing - is that founded?

I am uneasy about shooting the H&H box standard through this gun.

Any help appreciated,

JW

You will find that Holland's themselves are remarkably helpful to owners of their guns - even if acquired years afterwards. I'd give them a call or send an e-mail. We would all I am sure be interested in what they have to say!

There is a great article in DGJ from Ross Seyfried about how he got his Paradox to shoot. The article said to use slugs that are just under bore size for best results. Basically the reason a Paradox can be made so light and still work well is the slugs moves down the bore with very little friction until it hits the rifled choke which imparts the spin. If you have ever shot a slug shotgun from the bench the recoil is brutal! The Paradox has much lighter recoil by comparison.

My Paradox's bores measure .737. I got the 12 bore Paradox mould from NEI which cast slugs at .742 with a weight of 765grs out of 20-1 alloy. I had a couple push through dies made that were .735 and .734. The .735 slugs regulated perfectly in my gun. I have also used the new manufactured Holland rounds and they shoot ok but cross slightly at 50yds. I think they measure more than .725 but I'll have to check.

All the Paradox measurements I've seen have bores of .735+. Graeme Wright's new edition has a much expanded Paradox section that is a must read.

Good luck with your gun. If you are ever in Dallas I'd be happy to assist.

Congratulations on your recently acquired H&H Paradox! Contacting H & H can confirm year of manufacture and possibly some other info.
Twenty years ago they directed me to Australia where there was and is much interest in Paradox guns, other British S X S rifles and shotguns. Graeme Wright's book Shooting the British Double Rifle is recommended. The info in the book more than confirmed what I learned from a gentleman in Australia concerning loading and shooting the H & H Paradox. I recommend that you read the book several times before you gather componets for loading. One of the differences is Wright uses Winchester-Western wads with the petals cut off instead of using just card wads in place of the plastic wad. The plastic wads have worked for me. Again I suggest you read the book and Ross Seyfried's article on the Paradox.
You 1st might try the .734-737" slugs to see how they group. If necessary, have a mold .740 or .743". Experimentation will probably help improve accuracy. Remember to not use too hard of an alloy so as not to cause a ring in front of the rifling. Roll crimping has been the easiest way to secure the slug in the case for me. Now if you purchase a roll crimp tool, you may want to find a machinist who can carefully grind out/remove metal in the center of the roll crimp tool with out removing the roll crimp sides. There is a very clear photo in the book showing an opened roll crimper.If your Paradox was made for 2.5" cases load that length cases.

Best recommendation on loading cartridges-- follow receipes that are working-meaning they have been checked for acceptable pressure. Again the book discusses proof pressures.
This assumes your Paradox is nitro proofed in excellent working condition. It is always a good idea to have a qualified gunsmith conversant with British standards check your H & H before loading and shooting. Just be very careful who you choose to check your Paradox. Ask alot of questions 1st.

Mine was made in 1913, steel barrels, nitro proofed. Sights for 50/100yds and 150 yds.
Again I really recommend you get Wright's book. It provides a great wealth of info.
Jim

If you need any help tom armbrust of ballistic research has done alot of testing for the 20,12,10 and 8 parodoxes. psi and volocity. he has loads the 12 standard and magnum parodox

Will Tom Armbrust or Sherman Bell be publishing paradox load recipes along with the pressures each receipe generates?
Thanks!
Jim

Grat stuff guys....really appreciate the help!

Will get busy and post up results in not too distant future.

JW

have you checked with Steve Brooks about making a custom mould just for your Paradox Gun? He can copy the original design within .0005" and scale it up.

Rich

Will do Rich - Thanks!

Where can he be reached?

JW

www.brooksmoulds.com

Rich

I agree, check the wall thickness. If the bores are still in spec, even the old blackpowder 2 1/2" chamber "beaters" are still able to shoot. This one the 59th paradox made bores 737.5 R 737L chokes .691R 690L

What is the cost of the new Holland & Holland 12-Bore Nitro Paradox Cartridges?
Thanks!

$35 for a ten pack.