AR Colleagues,
Getting ready to fire up the lead pot again and I was wondering what other are using or like for the cast bullet lubricants. I ran out of my standard Lyman Alox and looking at the midway Web site I see that there are now over 20 lubes available including the liquid formulations.

What do you use and why do you like it? I will be casting and loading for my 30-30 Winchester but also for a 416 Rigby which I would like to push pretty hard for velocity while watching for accuracy and leading. I'd like a lube that is not sticky during storage of bullets and don't mind if it is hard and needs heated as I have a heater on my Lyman 450.
Thanks in advance for you input.
Paul

You will not read nor hear anything unfavorable about felix lube also called Felix World Famous Bullet Lube. Felix came up with a recipe and you do cook your own. Anhydrous lanolin and beeswax being the two ingredients that are not always available---everything else is common stuff. To get this recipe go to www.castpics.net and it is posted there. If you do not want to go to the trouble of making lube, there is another lube that you never hear any bad reports about. It is Lar45's lube and I think he posts here. He also posts at the Cast Boolit site. You can contact them at lsstuff@aol.com everything you hear is favorable including his price and I do know he stands behind his stuff---great folks to deal with from all reports. I did shoot with a guy that was using his lube and no problems.

Giday Paul, I have been making my own lube for years now and find it works as well as the comercial stuff I used to use.
Like you I run a big bore fairly fast with a 350gn Gc HT 90/10 ww/lino at over 2400fps from my 404 and have no issues at all. I also run a 160gn softnosed bullet in my 7x57 at similar velocities for hunting with excellent results.
I simply take 2/3 bees wax to 1/3 vaseline for normal to high velocity although I do up the bees wax portion to about 80% for the fastest loads. Use it in my lubrisizer although in colder weather have to run the heater but for low volume prep I find dip lubing ( as apposed to pan lubing)and usin a fired case with the base cut of as a cookie cutter to be entirely satisfactory. Low cost without all the various ingredients that may or may not be necessary, at least I havent found them to be.
Where I can see the necessity for some special ingredients for the likes of BP and specialised instances, most of the so called necessities are sometimes IMO an answer to an un-asked question.

Von Gruff.

Carnauba Red ... cheap relatively low smoke and supports very high velocities!

http://www.lsstuff.com/lube/

I use it for pistol and rifle stuff ... .308, .366, .376, .417, .459, and .476"

quote:

Originally posted by mstarling:
Carnauba Red ... cheap relatively low smoke and supports very high velocities!

http://www.lsstuff.com/lube/

I use it for pistol and rifle stuff ... .308, .366, .376, .417, .459, and .476"

I've made my own lube succesfully for fun, but the lubes from WhiteLabel are great & cheap, tought to beat. I like the Carnuba w/ a heater or the BAC w/o.

I enjoy using the Super Molly lube from Lyman. Pushing around 1500fps with no leading and cleaning easy. I could probably push normal jacketed fps with this lube with out leading. I have yet to load them that high, but give me a few weeks and I will let you know how it turns out.
As for smoke, its not heavy but it can be thick if extra lube is present. Just back your chono. up about 5 extra feet. For colder temps it can be rather stiff. Best to use heater after temps get below 35 to 40*F.

I like LBT Blue. It's done every thing I could ask of it and does it well with no leading or any other issues.

It will run 515 grain 470 NE bullets at 2350 fps with less recoil than 500 grain jacketed bullets at 2150 fps.

I've got lots of bees wax and just ordered the other ingredients to start making Felix lube.

For commercial, lbt blue, for home made beeswax and lithium/moly axle greese.

I've done accuracy test with various commercial lubes, and it is an educational experience.

More than anything, I use 50% Alox 2138F/50% Beeswax, which I believe is what you were using. It is a little sticky, but works great. I've pushed bullets up to 2200fps with it.

CDD

SPG

LBT or Apache Blue. Any of the hard lubes are junk.

I have shot up about 40 sticks of Thompson's Red Angel and have been thorougly satisfied with how it performs... It takes heat to flow, but in my estimation it is good stuff, despite what DWright says about it being junk.

Well, the problem with hard lubes is that you will get chunks of it that break off, while some of it will stick to the bullet, creating an out of balance bullet in flight. Good lube should all fly off the bullet the moment it exits the end of the barrel, leaving a balanced bullet. I have done extensive testing before i started a cast bullet business years ago to determine what works best in the field for accuracy. I have found this to be true, and have watched them in flight under correct conditions, vere off course, and found chunks of lube still stuck in parts of the grooves.
Also got back plenty of feedback from customers using my bullets, claiming the best long range accuracy they have ever achieved. My 6" Ruger GP 100 will group about 24" for a cylinder full, at 325 yards. How well can you do with your bullets? Also, 40 sticks lasted me about 1 week. How bout you?
Exceptable performance is always subjective.
Cheers.

lbt is a great lube but is way overpriced. Lars corduba or bac is just as good at about a 1/3 the price. Personaly i think corduba is a bit hard and bac is a bit soft. I usually use corduba cut with about 1/3 5050 beeswax alox or the same ratio using felix lube. I used to use alot of felix lube mixes but just dont have time right now to make lube and to be honest you cant make it yourself any cheaper then lars will sell it.

i'm no guru, but with 40 years of casting experience i've come to rely upon liquid alox and lee's push-thru sizers.

no leading at 1800 fps on gas checked rifle designs and rested accuracy as good as stick-lubes at 200 yds.

lee markets the stuff and even supplies a bottle with each inexpensive sizer kit they sell.

i retired my $$$ rcbs sizer with all its die sets in favor of liquid alox and lee sizing kits to save me lots of time and effort.

Over the years I've come to try a lot of commercial and home made brews for smokeless cast loads. I shoot loads form 250 fps up through 2600+ fps and keep coming back to Javelina (NRA 50/50 beeswax alox formula). It always works across a broad spectrum of velocity and temperatures and always gives the best accuracy. Yes, the harder lubes that require a sizer heater are less messy when handling the bullets but they don't always work under all conditions. I have run many lube accuracy tests from 800 fps up through 2600+ fps in many cartridges and keep coming back to Javelina.

For BP loads I make my own of beeswax and olive oil at 6/5 parts mix. I also use SPG occasionally. Both work as well or better than anythin else with BP loads. The also work fine for smokeless loads up through 1800 fps.

Larry Gibson

quote:

Originally posted by mstarling:
Carnauba Red ... cheap relatively low smoke and supports very high velocities!

http://www.lsstuff.com/lube/

I use it for pistol and rifle stuff ... .308, .366, .376, .417, .459, and .476"

For the last few years
I have also been using it for almost all my rifle loads

His 50/50 is priced right for those that don't make their own

John

I just use Lee Liquid Alox for handgun bullet lube. After umpteen years of doing what they say to do, I found that I was getting much smaller groups and much less leading with unsized bullets and a tumble lube of LLA.
Now, after giving up casting about 8 years ago, I buy my bullets but I still tumble lube them. I am contemplating, if I can ever afford to buy more bullets, to try to buy them as-case and non-lubed since I will lube them anyway.
It just works better for me and is faster and a lot less pain then running a Lubrisizer...

I'm kinda partial to speed green, I've used it for pretty much everything and it works great.

900fps to 2400fps, works for me.

Felix lube, hands down, tweak the proportions for your temperature range. DWright speaks the truth, and Felix lube is one of the only lubes I've tried that is soft enough to jettison completely right at muzzle exit but still handle 45,000 CUP. It also leaves a very consistent film behind in a balanced load that minimizes or eliminates "purge flyers", and works in light pistol loads too.

Gear

quote:

http://www.lsstuff.com/lube/

Carnauba Red works great for rifle and pistol, price is right and Lars is great to deal with.http://www.lsstuff.com/lube/

Wonder if KY jelly would screw things up?

quote:

Originally posted by CDD:
More than anything, I use 50% Alox 2138F/50% Beeswax, which I believe is what you were using. It is a little sticky, but works great. I've pushed bullets up to 2200fps with it.

CDD

And where are you getting this lube as the 2138F Alox has stopped being manufactured years ago? The Alox company also changed hands since then. Unless the companies that used the 2138F Alox had a huge stockpile of it, it's no longer available.

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman1:
Wonder if KY jelly would screw things up?

That would be slick stuff there Ray! I think Joe uses it for chap stick.

Carnuba Red in rifles and Lyman Orange in handguns. Been using it a while and no problems. I especially like the carnuba red if I'm going to be hot rodding any big bore stuff although many people like the liquid lubes, I just don't like the mess.

I don't need to shoot 1/64" groups at 100 yds with rifles, 1" is fine....

I just made 4 lbs of 50/50 alox 350 and beeswax, has anyone tried this combo?how does it work?

Plus One! for Lars Lubes.

Rich

For many years, I made up my own lube. I mostly used NRA 50/50 Beeswax/Alox 2138f. However, after I discovered Lars White Label Carnauba Red it has been my smokeless powder lube for many years. It shoots as well as NRA 50/50 but is much less messy to handle. Further, it has a higher melting point and in the hot summers does not create problems with powder contamination (yes, it HAS happened). It works as well for target velocity pistol as well as for high speed rifle use. Carnauba Red is so inexpensive that I cannot justify making my own.

When loading for Black Powder Cartridge Rifle use or Black Powder Cartridge Pistol use, I mix my own Emmert's Lube. Emmert's lube consists of 50% pure natural beeswax, 40% Crisco, and 10% Canola Oil. In recent years I have modified this a bit and have changed from Canola Oil to Anhydrous Lanolin. The lube's life is extended and it sticks to the bullet better when stored.

Dale53

quote:

Originally posted by Dale53:
For many years, I made up my own lube. I mostly used NRA 50/50 Beeswax/Alox 2138f. However, after I discovered Lars White Label Carnauba Red it has been my smokeless powder lube for many years. It shoots as well as NRA 50/50 but is much less messy to handle. Further, it has a higher melting point and in the hot summers does not create problems with powder contamination (yes, it HAS happened). It works as well for target velocity pistol as well as for high speed rifle use. Carnauba Red is so inexpensive that I cannot justify making my own.

When loading for Black Powder Cartridge Rifle use or Black Powder Cartridge Pistol use, I mix my own Emmert's Lube. Emmert's lube consists of 50% pure natural beeswax, 40% Crisco, and 10% Canola Oil. In recent years I have modified this a bit and have changed from Canola Oil to Anhydrous Lanolin. The lube's life is extended and it sticks to the bullet better when stored.

Dale53

Lars does made good lube and at a fair price too.

I haven't seen anyone else mention it so I'll throw it in. A mix of 45% Lee Liquid Alox, 45% Johnson Paste Wax and 10% mineral spirits. Tumble lube and it dries to a hard, shellac like finish. No sticky mess and no visible leading.

quote:

Originally posted by budman461:
i'm no guru, but with 40 years of casting experience i've come to rely upon liquid alox and lee's push-thru sizers.

no leading at 1800 fps on gas checked rifle designs and rested accuracy as good as stick-lubes at 200 yds.

lee markets the stuff and even supplies a bottle with each inexpensive sizer kit they sell.

i retired my $$$ rcbs sizer with all its die sets in favor of liquid alox and lee sizing kits to save me lots of time and effort.

I have never tried the liquid lubes. How do you keep it in the grooves? I've been using 50/50 beeswax & alox, but about out of the supply I bought in the '70's. So, looking toward the next purchase. I have some of the older Lyman sticks, but never liked it as well as the 50/50 mix ones.

Thanks

quote:

Originally posted by Skipper488:
I haven't seen anyone else mention it so I'll throw it in. A mix of 45% Lee Liquid Alox, 45% Johnson Paste Wax and 10% mineral spirits. Tumble lube and it dries to a hard, shellac like finish. No sticky mess and no visible leading.

+1 on the 45-45-10 Skipper. That lube works great! 1800fps 300 rounds in a single day, no lead at all (bore scope)

I use carnuba red on everything
it wurks