I just fell heir to several hundred 173gr pointed & flat-nose Laser-cast bullets with gas checks in .309" dia. I'd like to load up some for my 30-06. Any suggestions for loads around 1700-1800 fps?

Thanks, Bud W

Try between 28 & 31 grains of any flavor of 4895 powder.

quote:

Originally posted by M Pursell:
Try between 28 & 31 grains of any flavor of 4895 powder.

I'd suggest a 1/2 gr of Dacron as a filler (not tamped down as a wad) also.

Larry Gibson

Bud, the reason I mentioned 4895 is I figured you probably had that on hand. If not, what powders do you keep?

I'll never forget the first 30-06 cast bullets I shot. One load was using 4064 around 2400 fps and it felt about like a 30-30. Next load was around 1600 fps using Unique and I thought I had a missfire. Very little noise and recoil.

I use jacketed bullet data for my cast bullets. No leading, very accurate. But I'm shooting a 208 grain gas checked bullet, sized .311.
Jim

quote:

I just fell heir to several hundred 173gr pointed & flat-nose Laser-cast bullets with gas checks in .309" dia. I'd like to load up some for my 30-06. Any suggestions for loads around 1700-1800 fps?

For the velocity you want try 20-21 grs of Sr 4759 or Alliant 2400 should work. I got some of their 170 gr bullets years ago to compare to my castings, they were a bore rider with a .297 nose(too small for .300/.308), my cast have .300/.301 nose, the laser cast didn't shoot very good about 3-4 moa IIRC. Seat them out as far as you can and still close the bolt, lightly engrave the rifling, you may get lucky, they might be from a different mold than the one size fits all 30-30's I got. Good luck.

Thanks all for your input -- Mark; I have 4895 as well as 4064, 4227, 2400, 4320, 4350, 3031 and 4198 plus some old ball and pistol powders. Any of these better suited?

Bud

quote:

Originally posted by Bud W:
Thanks all for your input -- Mark; I have 4895 as well as 4064, 4227, 2400, 4320, 4350, 3031 and 4198 plus some old ball and pistol powders. Any of these better suited?

Bud

They're all good. The 4350, and maybe the 4320, may be a tad slow. Some will argue about that. Any of the rest of them can be made to work.

Starting loads from the Lyman manual are;
2400,20gr,1751fps
3031,30gr,1636fps
H4895,28.5gr,1706fps
4198,25gr,1717fps

The others aren't listed in the Lyman manual for a 170 gr, but that doesn't mean they won't work. Still, something in the above loads should work for you.

Thanks Mark... I'll try two or three of the loads to find which my Enfield likes best!

Bud W

I think that it would be better to stick with the faster burning powders. I guess that's all relative... Faster slow rifle powders.(Now I've confused myself)
For full power, high velocity loadings, the slow powders have a tendency to have a much larger secondary pressure spike.
There is some interesting reading on it on www.mountainmolds.com forum. I think he used WW748 and 760 for loads in the 30-06. The loads with WW760 showed much higher secondary pressure spikes. When he switched to the WW748, the secondary spikes were considerably reduced. I think this has something to do with the reports of barrels splitting at the muzzle when shooting cast bullets.
(It's late and I don't know if this will come across very clear or not.)

For a nice plinker load, I've used the Lazer cast 165 plain base with 10 gns of WC820. Low noise, almost no recoil and small groups at 25 yds.

What is the fastest velocity we can get from some sort of lead alloy w/ gas check in 7mm or 30-06? I could swear I saw something listed around 2200 fps but maybe I got that confused with 7mmBR Remington jacketed ammo. The price of commercial jacketed bullets is getting reedikulous. I have some 168gr 7mm lubed cast lead gas checks which cost $8/100 at a 2006 gun show. That would now run me about $35 locally from a suburban maker plus postage. That's about a 4 X price increase which beats the gold market. As I said on other sites, Invest in Lead, Not Gold!"

Cost or availability of some materials is going to be a problem for some people. For those with the equipment, and that includes Corbin style presses with hydraulic capacity, it should be possible to cobble together a wide variety of bullets with fewer worries about availability or costs. I cast lead balls for blackpowder but I'm going to set up for casting rifled projectiles and back that with a Corbiin swaging press.

Have you ever read C. E. Harris's article "Cast Bullet Loads for Military Rifles"? If not, let me know and I can PM it to you. It's rather lengthly or I'd post it here. It's an excellent read, and might be helpful.

Thanks, I can use that as I will be getting deeply into the casting subculture - except I would also give thought to doing shot. By the way I noticed I made an error in lead 7mm prices in my post as I had it at $9/100 when I paid $8/100 for 7mm gas checked 168's or whatever (since corrected). I like to go upstairs and fondle the bag lovingly like a miser.

The next issue, after finding a suitable place to shoot rifles, is to ask permission to set up a bullet trap. Probably a better bet for pistols many of which have grain weights equal to or a bit higher than most mid-caliber rifles.

One things I would have done was to weigh those bullets to see if they are all the same within a grain or so.Many commercial bullets have a lot of weight variation.

There was an article in eitheer Rifle or Handloader magazine, I forget which one, by Al Miller where he achieved 2500 or 2600 FPS shooting cast bullets from a 30-06.
With all due respect for Mr. Miller though, I wasn't too keen on some of his methodology.
Based on personal experience, I do not like using cereal fillers like corn meal or Cream of Wheat. (COW)
Using COW in a straight case like the 45-70, I found that it would pack literally into a solid slug of the stuff. When I had a misfire with one round in the 45-70, I broke the round dowm and had to use a screwdriver to dig the COW put of the case. it was like a rock. If that happened in a bottle necked case like a 30-06, pressures could/would rise way out of safe levels. Mr. Miller used COW in his 30-05 high velocity cast bullet loads.
Paul B.

One of the earlier posters mentioned 20-21 grs of IMR 4759....

I have been using 19 grs. of 4759 in G.I. brass with the 173 gr. Lyman 311467 GC bullet sized .311" and lubed with any Alox/beeswax mixture in my pre-war M-70 30-'06 for about 40 years now. It delivers just about exactly 1,725 fps and near MOA acuracy. Recoil seems about the same as a .22 LR, though of course it must actually be somewhat more. The load is also very quiet and doesn't have much muzzle-flash from my 24" barrel.

I'd recommend it worth your time to buy and try some of the 4759, It bulks up quite well in the case (which is why it is sold in half-pound cans and 4-pound kegs), lights easily, burns cleanly, and gives power easily adequate for any deer that a .30-30 factory load would deal well with. Plus, the smaller charges make the powder more economical than many others.

I have been useing C.E. Harris load of 16 gr. 2400 (I use 17 gr. as that's what my Lyman Pistol powder measure throws and I have been getting 1 hole groups outa my '06 with 170 gr. cast and 240 gr. cast outa my .358 Win.
I was shooting the .358 Win today and got many 50 yd. groups of 1/4" to 5/16" ! Yes you read it right----not bragging (maybe a little) but truthfully the loads shoot GREAT !
Give the load a try-you have nothing to loose unless you don't have 2400 powder !

Hip

that load that larry recommended
is a real good one, and don't forget the dacron.
it settles dpwn the ed and sv.

24 grains of IMR 4198 works well for me in the 30-06 with 170 grain to 200 grain gas-checked bullets.