Borrowed a mold for 20ga foster-type slugs, and fixin' to get ready to load. I have applicable data, but with a SNAFU! The slugs don't fit! They are a nominal 0.595" outside diameter. Bore at muzzle of gun is right at 0.600". The slug will drop through the barrel with no problem. Thing is, there's no room for the 0.025" thick wad petals. And the I.D. of the wad, at the base of the petals, is about 0.510". Ain't no way it's gonna all fit! The slug is a fair slip fit in the AA hulls I wish to use, slightly looser than a wad. What have I failed to consider here? Surely, the wad petals ain't supposed to fit up INSIDE the foster's hollow base, are they? What gives, guys? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Bug.

I believe that type of slug is made to use a wad and not a shotcup. The LEE is made to use a modern shot cup type wad. A friend of mine used to cut the "petals" of of the wad to use that kind of slug. You may be able to find felt and over powder wads at some of the shotgun reloading component sellers.

Ed B

I am loading 12 ga. R/B in my Model 12 and just cut the petals off. That seems to work fairly well. derf

Ed B is correct. The Foster type slug is designed to have a base wad, but not a plastic sleeve. It is intended to ride loosely in the barrel and pass through a choked barrel without damaging the choke. Thus, it can't be a tight fit. The "fins" on the body of the slug are intended to impart spin. Whether they do or not, and if they do...is it effective? I don't know the answers to those two questions. I have read that the fins do not impart much spin, and what spin is imparted isn't all that effective in stabilizing the slug. I suspect that latter observation is true. If the foster type slug was effective at stabilization, and thus accuracy, why do most shotgun manufacturers now sell rifled slug barrels? Lyman makes a slug that is intended to fit in a standard shotshell plastic wad. I cannot speak for LEE and their design. Pilgrim

The fins on the foster rifled slugs is not to impart spin but to let the slug squeeze through the many different chokes on many shotguns easier.
Because the fins are at an angle on the slug the manufactures call them rifled slugs because they look that way.

I've owned the Lyman slug that you use with a wad and have done a vast amount of experimenting with it. I had it in the 20 gauge. Whenever everything is right it performed amazingly well out of my H & R rifled slug gun. To boil it all down for this slug the single most important thing is to make sure to use new cases or ones only fired once. The reason for this is that plastic hulls become very rough inside after more then one or two firing and this roughness tears up the wad pretty bad. Try this experiment: Take a new loaded shell, pull the crimp open, dump the bb's, then grab the pedal of the wad with a pair of needle nose pliers and pull it out. Comes out very easy.
Now try that same thing with a shell you know has been loaded more then at least twice. The wad is very hard to pull out. I discovered this by shooting this slug on my range and finding the wads laying on the grass. This was easy to do as my range has a mowed lawn. When the shot was on target the wad I found was intact, that is all four pedals and not tore up bad. When the shot was bad the found pedal was in really bad shape, one or more pedals gone. I was on track with this but I'm not the soul person to discover it. I called the Hornady ballistic lab and told them of this. They were knowledgeable about it and said they've been preaching to skeet shooters that old shell casings tear up the wads and affected the patterns and told them they would be better off with new cases or nothing more then once fired. After I learned all this I resorted to new cases and once fired and had no more problems. Now the foster slug is a totally different situation. Lee in fact won't make a 20 gauge smooth type foster mould, like lyman, because they said they couldn't get the 20 gauge to shoot good. Something to do with the wad getting pushed into the hollow of the slug that they said didn't occur with the 12 gauge. Hope all this helps.

Joe

Bug, I had your problem, but in 12 gauge. The Lyman slugs were too skinny to shoot nekkid and too fat to go inside the wad. My solution was to make up a drive through sizing die. That works fair as long as my supply of CIL wads holds out.

I still don't have a slug load that I am really happy with.

Bug,

The slugs are as they are supposed to be. They are not made for use inside a plastic wad. On firing the slug is supposed to bump up to bore diameter and the swage down again as it passes through whatever choke is in the barrel. They are intended to be used with a built up (fiber) wad column.

I have read that some do stuff the wad petals inside the hollow base with good results. But I've never seen pressure tested loads for this application. Try disassembling some factory foster slugs. Some have a wad or two over the powder and then a granular filler. The filler actually fills the hollow base ensuring expansion on firing. These tend to be accurate but again no load data.

Some loads with some slugs recommend the use of a shot wrapper to bring the slug up closer to bore diameter. I hesitate to recommend them, but Ballistic Products has a new slug manual out ( www.ballisticproducts.com ) . Other than Lyman's 4th., its really the only other source of proven loads.

If I load "nekkid" slugs I paint on 2 coats of Lee liquid alox cut 1 to 1 with mineral spirits. After its dry I dust with Motor Mica. Liq. alox is sticky and I'd hate to glue a slug inside the hull.

Try the factory fosters. You can probably load slugs that shoot slightly better than your results with these- but not a great deal unless you start modifying the mold. Also some guns simply will not shoot foster slugs accurately. There was a great deal of info about shotgun slugs on shooters.com but I haven't found the shotgun archives anywhere.

Remember shotgun pressures can climb very rapidly and its best to stay with published loads. If you make changes- use a bit LESS powder only. It is easy to drive these thing too fast for reasonable accuracy.

BH

It would seem that the data I received with the mold WAS for the sabot-type slug. A phone conversation with Rose, at Lyman, resulted in her faxing me the correct data for the foster slugs. BTW, they are smooth, no "rifling", or fins at all. They do require a "built-up" wad column, and I don't have access to all the necessary components, of course. I cut the petals off some WAA-20 wads, just to try them. They are the same basic size as the base of the slug, and seem to be the right height for a folded crimp. I'm going to try some fairly modest loads for this case/wad combination, for a 3/4oz load - which is what the slug weighs. Good thought about the Alox/mica lube, hadn't thought of that. I also might try paper patching a few, to see how that will work. I'm thinking the wad might force its way up inside the hollow base. Maybe some sort of filler in the base, as Bunny Hunter stated? I only want a load that will be usable out to 30-40yds max. Now that I have 500 of these darn things cast, I've simply GOT to find a way to use them!>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Bug.

Bug -
Here's another alternative.

I have the Lyman moulds in 12 and 20 ga. Don't like them - too small to fit the bore. I shoot slugs only in cylinder bore or rifled barrels/chokes.

Years, no, decades ago I tried paper patching to bring them up to size. Single barrel shotgun with no sights. I could hit a brick at 35 paces (meters) 4 times of 5.

Tuck the paper tail into the base. Load over the thick wads. Do what it takes to keep the crimp from tearing up the round.

Bug,

Had breakfast and a pot and a half of coffee. Now I'm semi functional.

Almost all Foster slug loads are roll crimped (forgot that). There are 2 in Lyman's that are not (also forgot that). Just in case you didn't get these (components listed in order)-

Win Compression Formed (AA) Hull
Win 209
31 gr. Blue Dot
One .125" nitro card
One 1/2" fiber filler
Two .125" cards
345 gr foster slug
Fold crimp- velocity 1298 fps; 1100 lup

Win Compression Formed (AA) Hull
Win 209
25 gr. Blue Dot
Win WAA20 with petals removed
One 1/4" fiber
One .125" card
345 gr. foster slug
Fold crimp- velocity 1340 fps; 10400 lup

Bore size of a 20 ga is supposed to be around .615". You could try measuring the ID of 5/8" pipe and see what its running. I've noticed almost everything is undersized nowdays. If its pretty close, sharpen one end and use a block of wood and a hammer and have at it.

The "cards" are just thick cardboard, usually "coated" or shiney. Shotgun shell boxes work. Thinner cards can be stacked to come up with the proper thickness. I've also substituted wads cut from sheets of cork for other filler wads. Cork is very light and easy to cut. As long as the height of the wad column is correct they're should be no problem as the cork wads I've cut for .410's are actually lighter than an equal height of the fiber fillers I weighed.

I probably forgot something else. If I got more sleep... speaking of which... anybody want an approx 6 month female black lab/ probably greyhound cross? See the "Just Pi$$ed- gotta vent" thread on the dog board. Cute, friendly, ALMOST crate trained.

BH

BH -

Just an off-the-wall side note - my 20 ga rifle bore measures .625 (grove diameter) which is EXACTLY the OD of 1/2" cpvc pipe. Except for the hole in the middle it, it slides down the tube and engraves perfectly when fired.

TRK

I looked through my misc. cutters last night and found a piece of half inch copper pipe with a coupler soldered on that had been sharpened. It was a perfect match with the 20 ga cork wads I still have laying around. Its been a while because I've had a drill press with a 5/8 chuck for about 5 years and this was used with a hammer.

TRK,

I gotta ask. Why did you shoot a piece of cpvc out of your rifled 20 ga? And more important- How did it work? Visions of sabots are dancing through my head.

BH

Thanks, guys, for the info... Bunny Hunter, I find it very interesting that the data you relate shows a higher velocity for the 25gr load, versus the 31gr load. The pressure difference seems to be logical, but the velocity reading would seem bass-akwards. It is, however, right in the range I was looking at, circa 1300fps, with the 3/4oz slug. I have made up one loading of 10 rounds, to try @ 28gr of Blue Dot. After reviewing your data, I might ought to take the chrono along, instead of relying on group size to make a determination.
My muzzle measures a nominal .600", and the slugs go about .595" at the base, so I'm gonna try 'em nekkid, for the initial run. I don't know what the base of the slug will do when that wad hits it in the butt. If I have any leading, then I'll try some lube, or paper patching. I might have to cut off the compression part of the wad, too. If so, your thoughts on cutting card wads and/or cork may be just the ticket.
Anyway, thanks again guys, for the info, for this ongoing project. I'll post my results when I get to the testing. If you have any other input, don't hesitate to post! >>>>>>>>>>>>>Bug.