I have noticed this bullet being mentioned on here. How about a penetration/damage report at 22-250 and 223 speeds.

Probably not to many use this tiny bullet on full size hogs. I suspect it would work great on piglets, up to mayby 25-30 lbs. If someone gives a report on success with this little bullet, how about being full disclosure and give a report on those that got away wounded.

One can't expect much penetration out of a 45gr bullet with a whopping SD of .128, and BC of .188. But I did hear or read about some AH taking a 204 to Africa and shooting game up to the size of zebra with it, then writing a straight-faced, can-you-believe-this article about his "success".

KB

I've read of very successful usage on adult hogs on another site. Apparently it's a real killer. The caveat, as you might expect, is minimal blood trail. FWIW, I consider the source reliable.

I've got some loaded up for my own use, but haven't had a chance to use them in the field yet.

quote:

Originally posted by analog_peninsula:
as you might expect, is minimal blood trail. FWIW, I consider the source reliable.

No kidding - minimal blood trail -- humm. FYI, I'm familiar with and prefer minimal blood trails, since I prefer and expect hogs I shoot to be DRT, and the blood pouring out the exit hole, and pooling on the ground right there, instead of dribbling along the escape route. If I have to track a hog down by following a blood trail, or whatever, I consider that a mistake on my part, and of course in that case, make the best of it, and figure on what to do next time to avoid that. Generally, I have found that using an adequate cartridge for the task and expected results avoids 90% ++ of any problems, tracking, etc., one may encounter. I really don't like tracking wounded hogs, or tracking any wounded animal.

FWIW, and frankly, I don't consider those bullets reliable for such use, and about equally as reliable as any source who says they use them on hogs with success. If they were reliable, and if they were really seeking reliability, or if they were even remotely interested in, or have the distinction of reliability, conceptually or practically, they wouldn't choose that bullet for that purpose, IMO.

Reliability is not a priority for those choosing to use this bullet for hogs. So, why worry about penetration? If one is really interested in penetration, rather than merely talking about it, he would choose a different cartridge for the task, known for penetration. You already know the 45gr .223 bullet is piss poor from the get-go. It's a known quantity, mathmatically and in the field, so shoot and be happy.

KB

I agree completely with most of your observations, K.

By "successful", I mean the bullet penetrates and performs predictably, killing the hog every time when you do your part. Remember, the context of this discussion started with .22 centerfires and shotguns. While I think that a good slug gun is undoubtedly more lethal than any .22 centerfire, many don't want to go that direction for a variety of good reasons (trigger quality, for one, single purpose usage, etc.). In the context of .22 centerfires, the 45 gr TSX appears to be a better mousetrap.

I can't really say anything more definitively since I'm only repeating what I've read from others; but I've been sufficiently convinced that I've loaded some of the 45 gr TSX for use in my own .22-250. As always, we each make our own decisions.

I ordered a 1-9 twist barrel yesterday so I will be able to shoot bullets that weigh up to 75 grains including the 62 gr. TSX. When I get it chambered and installed. I have killed a lot of hogs and have to say that the number of good blood trails has been small. This with mostly plenty adequate rifles from Kabluey's point of view. I have killed 3 this year with a 223 shooting cheap Brown Bear 62 gr. HP's (2) and one using the hornady 60 gr. HP. All were immediatly down due to spine or neck/head hits. I haven't lost an animal I have shot at in many years.

If I knew a landowner that gave me permission to hunt hogs on his place, with the condition that I had to use a 223, 22-250, or something using .223 bullets, heck I would have one of those humdinger pea shooters, all sighted in, with TSX or whatever, and go hog shooting. I might complaned some, especialy if one got away. Given no choice and all, I might learn to like it. For sure, it would be better than no hog hunting.

But, since I have a choice, the smallest I've been willing to go is my little CZ527 in 7.62x39, and I'm working hard to develop some loads likely to succeed with 150 gr bullets. So far, I'm able to get real close to 2200 fps, and the best groups have been about 1.5". I would like to do better than that.

Sunday, I also tried some Remington 180 gr .311 bullets, and the best two groups I shot were both three-shot groups at 100 yds with the holes all touching. I'm really a little surprised since I somehow thought that kind of accuracy wasn't likely from those bullets. The velocity 10 feet from the muzzel is right close to 1850 fps, which may be too slow. I would like to get 1950 fps, but I'm not sure that I can with the powders I have to choose from. One good sign is that there's room for more powder, so it must be good. This is 22 WRM velocity, but with a bullet 4.5 times heavier, and vastly greater sectional density. And the recoil of the 7.62x39 with 180 gr bullets is very mild. To me it's almost the same as shooting a 22 WRM, just more blast, but I'm used to much bigger cartridges.

I've read and heard reports of those who have shot hogs with the 22 WRM. One of my Texas buddies has a lot of fruit trees and berry bushes, and he says the 22 WRM is all he uses anymore, and claims great success. I'm pretty sure he drives around at night and uses a spotlight, and shoots mostly coons. I figure his success on hogs was demonstrated when I discovered a jacketed 22 bullet in the shoulder of a pig I killed on his farm. I certainly don't argue with him, since he has been generous with permission to hunt on his place. It was sort of amuzing and satisfying in January this year when he commented that he was pleased I was more successsful this time than last year, as he was admiring the nice Sako 308 another Texas friend/gunsmith had put together for me. He made the comment that he would rather see dead hogs than hear about the ones that got away. To me that was a contridiction, since he says so highly of the 22 WRM, but I just grinned, and didn't say anything. BTW, that 308 is a hog killing machine, a real confidence builder.

KB

Head shots, yes, but I wouldn't trust it on anything else especially if it's a large hog you are eyeballing through your scope.

I know that you two like larger cartridges for hunting deer and hogs than 22 centerfires. I felt the same way for a long time until I tested various 223's, a 222 and several 22-250 rifles and bullets. I started fooling with them after seeing how effective the 223 was in the hands of young shooters. Sure the young ones made a few bad hits but these deer were also generally recovered. The 22-250 is a very effective deer round with good placement and the right bullet. I think what it boils down to is what shot angles you will take. If you are jumping deer or hogs in the brush then the 22 centerfires are not very useful but if you are watching a trail, feeder or hog toy and take your time then you will rack up an string of DRT's you will be proud of. Since I am there not only to hunt but watch wild animals and have killed enough that I am not in a hurry or particularly bloodthirsty any more I could hunt with just about anything and be successful

Never underestimate the lethality of speed and a quality bullet. I have killed lots of hogs up to 300 lbs here in Texas with a 45 gr TSX out of my 220 Swift. At 4100 fps the hogs don't go far enough to require tracking. 100% full pass throughs and tremendous internal damage on the largest hogs. That being said, I wouldn't consider hunting hogs with a 45 gr lead bullet, but 55 gr Game Kings do just fine on yotes and deer.

I have used the old 45 gr vlc on a rather large-70 lb-javelina, and with what I consider spectacular results. A broken shoulder, pierced heart and golf ball sized exit hole gave less of a blood trail and more of a puddle where the critter chewed his last supper. All from the 222 rem at a distance of approximately 70 yards.

Manbeast-

Welcome aboard...and congrats on the javelina. But as to blood trails on hogs, which can be much larger than the collared peccary, the small calibers just can't produce on a consistent basis. Heck, large calibers sometimes are a bit disappointing in that regard. You don't need tons of velocity, either, but rather a bullet that'll plow through and wreak havoc with the vitals.

I've killed quite a few with a 6.5x30-30 AI (aka 6.5 Bullberry IMP), 6.5x55, 6.5-06, 7mm Bullberry and a .308. I've used others, too, but these will do all you ever ask of them and will put the pork on the ground in a hurry.

The thick hide, layers of fat (not to mention the gristle plate on boars) and mud-covered hair can plug even a generous exit. (Of course, if you pop him in the thinker, all of that is irrelevant anyway... )

I've used .22 centerfires in specialized circumstances and never had a problem, but I prefer a bore diameter of 6.5 or larger for the serious work.

I whole-heartedly agree. Javelina and hogs are absolutely worlds apart in the area of terminal ballistics. Furthermore, the use of small bore cartridges on medium or larger game is not on my good practice list. Not to say that I depricate on the practice, but rather that I myself rely on a bigger stick to give more reliable results and perhaps make up for human error in the field. I feel the same way on long range hunting.

I bet the little 45 grainer works great for a 45 grain bullet. I personally would recommend something with more mass and frontal area. Read larger, heavier. If I were required to use a 22 centerfire on hogs either for noise or any other reason,I would use the heaviest TSX I could get to stabilize. Maybe a solid. DW