Well, I got an e-mail yesterday from my very good friend, Jay, that I hunt hogs with out at our lease in the Hill Country. He told me a rather heart breaking story.

We had the opportunity to add 415 acres to our 2,000 acre lease so we took advantage of it. Jay said he saddled up one of his colts and went out to ride the fence lines of the new section, which is about 5 miles as the crow flies from the camp. He brought along Ringo and Billy, his 2 hog dogs that are still both under a year old. He said they started chasing some deer (Billy's fault, he's the youngest and least disciplined). After they went after the second group of deer, they both came back suffering badly from heat exhaustion. It was over 100 degrees. Jay saddled Ringo up on the horse and rode him back to the windmill as fast as he could, but it was too late and he had to shoot him. He went back for Billy and he was too far gone, so he had to shoot him too. I feel really bad for this happening. Ever since Jay lost his 3 good dogs 2 years ago (we suspect they were stolen), he has gone through 18 dogs trying to find good ones. He has one pup left that was too young to go out yesterday, so at least he's got something, but he still has to start all over. He's really down in the dumps right now.

If any of you know of a good deal here in Texas on dogs like Catahoulas, Curs, Plots, Dogos, mixed, etc... PLEASE let me know. Any help would be greatly appreciated. The only criteria I can think of is NO PITBULLS. Jay has 2 small children and is not interested in owning Pits. Thanks in advance to anyone that might offer some suggestions.

That's no good. I've had a close call with my staghound - he overheated and ended up urinating blood. He appears to be fully recovered now. It's not all that hard to cook a dog when it's warm.

Sad story, but to be frank, the dogs were killed by their owner and he should be down in the dumps. Taking dogs of any kind, but especially young one with less than optimal controls, out for a run in 100 degree weather with no water source or means of cooling one down is just plain criminal. Hopefully he learned from this episode but the dogs paid the price.

Very similar to an experience my brother had with a young chocolate lab. Brought him back across the horse, dead. I agree with Gatogordo.

Sorry to hear about the dogs. I know how hard it is to find good hog dogs. Unfortunately I also agree with Gatagordo. Hopefully he won't do that again. I do feel for him though. Try Douglas Mason in Columbus, TX. http://txmasoncatahoulas.texasboars.com/

I've talked to him on the phone a couple times and he seem like a good guy. He's got an excellent reputation for well bred dogs.

eland slayer .. have three lacy cross dogs that are not working for me... female2years old, female 1 year,pup four months.. look like small rots without the attitude..if your friend is interesded.. also might know of some black mouth curs...south of san antonio

A few years ago I was hunting antelope in Montana ... right after the start of pheasant season. Opening day was very warm and someone told me the number of bird dogs that died that day from the heat ... it made you sick ...

Thanks for the replies, but I don't appreciate some of this criticism. Jay isn't a newbie to this dog stuff. He's been training hog dogs for over 10 years. He knew what he was doing. There were plenty of watering stations along the way (springs and watering troughs) and there were plenty of shady areas for the dogs to rest if they needed to. How was it his fault that the dogs went chasing after deer? If they would have stuck with Jay, they would have been just fine. I think some of you need to stop looking down your noses at others before you know the whole story. So with that said, I would like to hear any more suggestions ya'll might have.

Oh to hell with it, the dogs are dead, I'll let that fact speak for me. I'm not looking down my nose at anyone, shit happens, but if you and your friend don't KNOW that he fucked up and don't LEARN from that fuck up, then you and he don't need anymore dogs. I'm done with this topic.

Gatogordo,

Yeah, I hope you are done with this topic. I don't think there was any need for you to say what you said. Did you even read what I wrote in my second reply? "THERE WERE PLENTY OF WATERING STATIONS ALONG THE WAY (SPRINGS AND WATERING TROUGHS)." Am I typing in Japanese or something? I don't know how else to put it. We'll just have to agree to disagree.

My question is whether your friend kept moving to the point where the dogs couldn't rest and take advantage of the ground water. Dogs generally don't just run 'til they drop dead. They generally try to keep up.

Obviously there weren't plenty of waterholes or the dogs wouldn't be dead..

Sorry, i agree with Gatogordo.. we as owners are responsible for our dogs...If we take out dogs that are not 100% steady or dogs that don't respond to the recall, we are responsible..

I have a terrier which is a swine for chasing rabbits, buts its up to me to take that into account when taking him for a walk ect...

I'm not a vet but it almost sounds as if the dogs had some sort of pre-existing condition. I've ran dogs with my dad my whole life and I've seen them get pretty exhaused but I've never seen them fall out this way.
I've had to put down dogs that had been bitten by snakes and cut by hogs but never from heat exhaustion.
One bit of advise I would give though is to put a tri-tronics collar on the dogs next time. It brings an abrupt end to chasing deer.

Not good judgment to take a couple of hunting dogs out in 100 degree weather. These dogs are bred to chase game and they don't know or care that it's too hot to do so. Heat is at the forefront of our thoughts during every single hunt during the summer. That's why we only hunt at night or early in the morning. Even then there are times when it's just too hot. These dogs will run themselves to death because they are highly driven dogs that know no quit. We had to put a dog down this summer due to heat and that was at 7 in the morning.

quote:

which is about 5 miles as the crow flies

That portion of Eland Slayer's post pretty much makes it a cut and dried issue in my mind -- and certainly does point the finger of blame. (Gatogordo and the others are right on the money.)

A trip of that length in the heat of summer with dogs that have a propensity for chasing game makes me question the judgment of taking them along. Yes, it is quite sad, but the death of the dogs could have been easily avoided.

OK I don't hunt with dogs this way so can someone please enlighten me here?

Why do you have to shoot a dog with heatstroke? I imagine there is a good reason because people don't just decide a dog is too sick from it and grab a shovel but I just don't know. If they are kept cool and in the shade I suspect they would either recover or die, but how do you know the process is inevitable and should be hastened along?

Dogs that reach the extreme condition that we know as heatstroke usually do permanent damage to the internal organs. After the event and the dog survives, they're usually more predisposed to the condition more so than a dog that hasn't.

Tasso

He 'went through' EIGHTEEN dogs in two years??

Frans

quote:

Originally posted by Frans Diepstraten:
He 'went through' EIGHTEEN dogs in two years??

Frans

Yes, but the others didn't die (if that's what you were thinking). If they didn't turn out to be good hog dogs, he either gave them away or sold them to good homes.

the use of an E-collar in the future is good advice. Pups do not know any better, whether there was plenty of shade/water. Secondly, they, IMO, shouldn't have been permitted to chase deer in the first place. One quick zap with an E-collar would have stopped that.

I can appreciate the 10 years of experience your friend has but just because you have longevity at doing something, doesn't mean you did it right the whole time.

I'm not going to condemn your friend but having had dogs for the better part of 20 years, and training them myself, this could have easily been avoided.

quote:

Yes, but the others didn't die (if that's what you were thinking). If they didn't turn out to be good hog dogs, he either gave them away or sold them to good homes.

Hmmm? Things must be different in the hog dog world (and this is not meant as a sneer). Where do you get good hog dogs? Is it trail and error, or are there special breeds or breeders? I know e.g. in Europe they use German Hunting Terriers, Dachshunds, which, if you buy careful will almost certain display some of the required characteristics. German Hunting Terriers e.g. are all tested to see if they want to bail on a hot track. If not, breeding will not endorsed by the breed association. So if you buy a pup or dog from parents that have been tested, and used on hunts, at least the genes are OK. No way you are going to buy 18 misfits.

But like I said, things must be different in the hog dog world...

Frans