Here is a good example of WHY the idea of poisoning Feral Hogs to control their numbers is possibly NOT a good idea.

This is another item from the TP&W weekly news update.

Unintended Consequences

On March 22, a Matagorda County game warden received a complaint about several sick and/or dead eagles and buzzards on a local ranch. Upon arriving at the location, he observed a dead feral hog that the birds had obviously been eating. Three dead bald eagles and a few buzzards were located in the immediate area. Several more buzzards and a caracara that were too sick to fly were also observed. Suspecting the possibility that the pig may have been poisoned, and because of the bird species involved, the warden contacted a U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service special agent and brought him in on the investigation. They made contact with a neighboring farmer, who admitted to soaking corn in a poison and putting it out to get rid of the feral hogs in the area. The federally-protected birds had ingested the poison. The violations were turned over to USFW for prosecution.

Thanks for posting this. I wonder how many other creatures besides the birds had ingested the poison as well?

That is the whole deal. One of the poisons requires a cumulative effect, eating the bait over an extended period of time. The other is a "DRT" at the first feeding.

Unless someone is monitoring those baits daily they will bhave no idea how much collateral damage is being done

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Unless someone is monitoring those baits daily they will bhave no idea how much collateral damage is being done

And that, most likely, is not being done. I've no dog in this fight, as you Texans do, but just don't think poison is a good solution.

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but just don't think poison is a good solution.

That was also the conclusion of the Texas Parks and Wildlife scientists. For better or worse. shooting or trapping are presently the best way to "control" feral hogs. A good by product is some good eating and sport.

That's exactly the reason such stuff is
now outlawed in the US.
Years ago it was commonly used out here for
coyotes. Wasn't many birds around anywhere.
Don't know how many coyotes it got, but, still had plenty of 'em.

I was told and later read it can cycle thru at least four eatings and still kill.

George

The thing is: The TPWD knows it is a bad idea. The majority of landowners know it is a bad idea. But then you have a moron like Sid Miller who is hell-bent on getting a state-wide poisoning program enacted. He's already shown what an arrogant buffoon he is in the past when he said he'd bypass regulatory legislation to get Kaput into the hands of Texans. Remember this at voting time, folks. He needs to be replaced.

Bobby,
Could there be some form of financial reason for Mr. Miller's position? Such as bribes, kickback, stock ownership, etc? Or might it just be ignorance?

No idea what is feeding Miller's thoughts on this subject, probably/possibly multi-faceted.

Daily, on one of my routes I see anywhere from 50 up to close to 100 head of pigs of various sizes.

The problem with hoghs is a carbon copy of the one with fire ants.

There was a ecological niche that was open and ripe for an invasive/aggressive/prolific species to fill.

There were reasons why North America did not have a small, "House Cat" sized feline predator.

There were reasons why North America did not have pigs, only javelina.

We didn't have English Sparrows or Starlings or Ring neck doves.

Feral hogs are going to prove out to be the worst of the lot in the long run in my opinion.

Any states paying a 'bounty' on hog tails? Makes a lot more sense than poison. One dead eagle is one too many.

WE had a similar occurence locally a while back. The culprit was caught and tried and convicted by the trail of dead creatures leading back to the "bait".
Anyone can kill hundreds of carrion feeders by using certain chemicals which used to be commonly used for cotton.

The post has absolutely nothing to do with controlled poisoning of hogs.

It has EVERYTHING to do with the proposed controlled poisoning of hogs, because if there is even a REMOTE possibility of collateral poisoning of FEDERALLY protected species such as vultures/hawks, the outcry is going to be unbelievable!

I do not know abpout the attitudes of land owners in other parts of the state, but those up in this area are against the program simply because they do not want to deal with the carcasses!

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It has EVERYTHING to do with the proposed controlled poisoning of hogs, because if there is even a REMOTE possibility of collateral poisoning of FEDERALLY protected species such as vultures/hawks, the outcry is going to be unbelievable!

But, of course, there is NO possibility of collateral poisoning because the tests have proven it doesn't happen with the poisons that are working on being approved. So, as usual, you "EVERYTHING" becomes a NOTHING.

To the best of my knowledge, nothing has been proven concerning any of the poisons being tested, being species specific to the point that scavengers feeding on the carcasses of animals that died from the poison, will not be affected.

You are entitled to your personal thoughts and beliefs, but as long as nothing can be proven concerning collateral poisoning of non-targeted species, poisoning as a control method for free rangec feral hogs is going to be openly opposed by the Public in general and by private land owners.

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To the best of my knowledge

Therein lies a HUGE problem.

No Gato I have set thru a TP&W workshop on the issue of Feral Hogs and the poisoning proposition, and the bioligists openly stated that the issue of possible collateral poisoning of non-target species is and will be the biggest roadblock to the idea, especially when environmentalists and Animal Rights groups get involved.

Many of the land owners in this area that set thru the meeting expressed opposition to having dead hog carcasses on their property laying around rotting.

I think another responder mentioned something about establishing a "Bounty" program and that to me seems to be a better concept.

they don't want there alive and they don't want them there dead, and they don't want no one shooting them [unless they pay for the privilege of doing them a favor]

that sure poses a problem don't it.

sounds like they'd rather complain about the problem rather than fix it.

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that sure poses a problem don't it.

Yes it does, and there are no easy answers.

We had farmer charge here in Wis in a poisoning case.

They found over two hundred critters dead on his farm.

Not very smart of him.

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they don't want there alive and they don't want them there dead, and they don't want no one shooting them [unless they pay for the privilege of doing them a favor]

As some one else stated, landowners have more to consider than the problems hogs are causing if they decide to allow folks access to their property, even locals that they are acquainted with.

I grew up in north Texas during a time when if a land owner gave someone permission to hunt or fish on their property, that person respected the land owners wishes concerning that access. Those days are long gone and too many land owners have lost their asses and their property because they let someoner on the place that did something stupid, got themselves hurt and blamed it on the landowner.

This part of Texas where I live and grew up and my Dad and I had permission to go fishing or I could duck hunt or dove hunt, ain't that way anymore and I do not blame the land owners one damn bit.

Too many folks in todays America have no respect for nature/the land, whether Public or Private.

Poisoning is just bad! There is no good or safe way to do it. We have tried it for other critters in the past and failed every time! Just too big a net in the ocean, you will kill the wrong thing sooner or later. Pigs are here because we want them here! They have gotten out of hand like so many other imports. They are just easier to hate than say Eurasian collared doves!

That is as good as I have seen it stated.

I can remember in the mid to late 80's when feral hogs first started showing up in this area and everyone was excited all to Hell.

I can remember the folks that got started trapping them, did so to move them to properties that they had not moved on to.

Many land owners viewed feral hogs as a new source of income, until they realized that the damn things cannot be managed.

The only realistic option, is going to be introducing a swine specific disease into the wild population, hoping that it does not mutate and affect other species such as Javelina.

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Originally posted by Live Oak:
Poisoning is just bad! There is no good or safe way to do it. We have tried it for other critters in the past and failed every time! Just too big a net in the ocean, you will kill the wrong thing sooner or later. Pigs are here because we want them here! They have gotten out of hand like so many other imports. They are just easier to hate than say Eurasian collared doves!

Well-stated!

Sell the suitable hind quarters to prison kitchens for $1.50 a pound. Butcher gets .50 cents to cut and store in the freezer, hunter gets 50 cents. Transporter gets 50 cents for 1X month delivery.

Dream much, do you?

Point taken.

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Sell the suitable hind quarters to prison kitchens for $1.50 a pound. Butcher gets .50 cents to cut and store in the freezer, hunter gets 50 cents. Transporter gets 50 cents for 1X month delivery.

That actually is a reasonable idea, except that the PTB's are afraid of the possibility of contaminated meat!

I thought about the meat quality posing a hurdle. I guess it's asking a lot to ask the butcher(s) to test the meat for any issues. The FDA would have to lend some help in that regard. But, there has got to be a another way other than poisoning and shooting is much more fun and nothing get's attention more than $-ca-ching-$. Get them hogs.

I maybe wrong on this, but didn't Pennsylvania shut down the "Hunters For The Hungry" program because citizen complained that since the meat was not federally or state inspected it posed a threat to those that received it???

Here in Alberta, we declared wild hogs a pest and a land owner is obligated to deal with them, it's put a dent in them.

Grizz

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Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
I maybe wrong on this, but didn't Pennsylvania shut down the "Hunters For The Hungry" program because citizen complained that since the meat was not federally or state inspected it posed a threat to those that received it???

Actually the opposite is true.
"Sharing the harvest" is alive and well. Just recently, the $15 fee paid by hunters to donate venison was done away with and the state now picks up the whole tab. The Ag dept. is looking for more processors to sign up. Retail meat quality rules apply.
The scoop.
Sharing The Harvest
Click on sharedeer org at the bottom then locate a processor for more information like the following.

Processor information copy/paste.

Reminder about the state-required deer processor inspection and registration If you are familiar with the HSH program and have not already done so, please remember that registration applications required by the PA Dept of Agriculture (PDA) must be completed in order to participate as an HSH deer processor. A copy is enclosed for your convenience. Starting in 2012, deer processors were to be registered and inspected by the PA Dept. of Agriculture. If involved with accepting deer to be donated to a public food bank program this requirement is waived if you already are licensed by the PA Dept. of Agriculture with other retail or wholesale food or meat facility registration programs. This registration application and inspection has been developed specifically for HSH, in partnership with the PA Dept of Agriculture and the HSH board of directors. Working together with the PDA, our intent remains to minimize the inconvenience to our valued processors, make registration as easy as possible, while ensuring uniform food safety criteria and quality control in our future venison donations. Please understand that the integrity of the HSH venison charitable donation program is our highest priority. Our main goal with this state required registration will yield long-term positive benefits for you as an HSH Processor, as well as for the individual consumers receiving food assistance. For more information on the inspection and registration requirements, please call us or the PDA Region office listed on your notification or visit www.agriculture.state.pa.us and click on the Regional Office Information link. Thank you for your help and support as we work toward achieving our mission of delivering wholesome, high protein meat to those in need. Looking forward to another successful year,

Many Thanks for clearing that up.

No problem. I am much the wiser as well.

I really think the "Pork lobby" has a whole lot to do with the "non use" of our feral pigs.

Hunters for the hungry, prison food......all would be a very good use for large scale trapping. IMO large scale trapping is really, other than poisoning< the only realistic management method.

Hunting ain't ever gonna do much.

.

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I really think the "Pork lobby" has a whole lot to do with the "non use" of our feral pigs.

That is a real possibility and I cannot say that it would/will surprise me if it is true.

Great point there. More money needs to be involved.
Another wild suggestion would involve hog farming. Trap the hoglets live, then raise them to the 75 pound size on a farm dedicated to only feral hogs - to be sold to restaurants as farm-raised feral swine. Now that I say it, it sounds a little far-fetched as I'm not sure if the FDA would allow the designation of 'feral' for a farm-raised animal. However, the price of wild hog meat is much higher than conventional pork. Big question here is is there enough demand 'on the restaurant plate' to support a new industry as this and would it make a substantial difference in the population? I have a feeling it could just be another "asian carp" equal in terms of success. Various government efforts to curb the AC invasion by netting and turning them into fertilizer seems to have only kept the population from advancing, not backing off.

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Originally posted by JTEX:
I really think the "Pork lobby" has a whole lot to do with the "non use" of our feral pigs.

Hunters for the hungry, prison food......all would be a very good use for large scale trapping. IMO large scale trapping is really, other than poisoning< the only realistic management method.

Hunting ain't ever gonna do much.

.

They tried to poison hogs here same results a great disaster even dogs dead .The same with doves they fumigated from planes causing a disaster hopefully thy trust on hunting in the future .Poisoning is terrible even water will get contaminated .

In two short runs this afternoon that covered a total of maybe 20 miles, total number of hogs of all sizes that I observed was over 75 animals.

I was simply driving a couple of the county dirt roads and looking out at the wheat fields that are still standing, so podds are therre were probably a bunch of 15-20 pound and under pigs that I couldn't see.

All of the groups where the cover was short had litters of 5 pound or less piglets, numbering from 8 to 10 to over 20 in the group.

The only way I see for their numbers to be dimished is for some form of species specific disease to be created, only problem with that is that such creations have a bad habit of mutating.

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Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting
...

The only way I see for their numbers to be dimished is for some form of species specific disease to be created, only problem with that is that such creations have a bad habit of mutating.

Think about the nutria, sometimes the solution is worse than the problem. And hogs have been in east Texas since the first ones escaped from the Spanish in the 1600s, if hungry farmers couldn't eradicate them during the depression they can't be eliminated, just my opinion.

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just my opinion.

And it is a reasonable opinion and one that is shared by lots of people.