Has anyone had trouble with 30mm Talley Q.D. rings not holding 1.5-6x42 Swarovski? Mine slide forward on a 416 rigby and marred the scope. Really sucks, I thought maybe I didn't get the rings clean of oil so I cleaned it all up and re-mounted but with the same result. I have the same rings but in the 1" model with 1.75-6x32 Leupold and it's rock solid on the same gun.

I contacted Gary at Talley and he said the swaro's use a Teflon coating the acts as a lubricant. He suggested I use clear silicone on the rings to act as an abrasive and give the rings more bite. I tried the silicone and it worked, after 50 rounds it hasn't budged nary a .001 but damn I done scuffed up my high dollar scope. I've got it cleaned up where it's hardly noticeable to the casual observer but every time I look at it I cringe.


Have you guys seeen or heard of this problem with Swaro's? I should add I have not confirmed it 100% but I think the scope didn't movw in both cases until working up loads at the bench and only while useing a LeadSlead but with the silicone in the rings I have been gageing with calipers and even in the Leadslead the scope hasn't moved.


I've never had this problem before but I would have thought inertia would have moved the scope back on the rifle but it didn't the scope moved forward?

Scope stays 'in place', rifle moves back.Plain inertia. Just a fraction each shot but ends up with a mark. Shame about that.
Clear silicone sounds like a good idea, perhaps Swaro will put a small tube of Dows finest in the boxes:-))

quote:

Originally posted by RayRay:
I would have thought inertia would have moved the scope back on the rifle but it didn't the scope moved forward?

What happened is your rifle recoiled back and your scope tended to get left behind, so it looks as if it moved forward. I had the same trouble with a heavy steel Pecar until I gooped it on. Apparently we need to do that with the front ring expecially if it's around the front lense, otherwise if tightened too much. . . cracked lense.

Jeez please excuse the typo's and spelling in the above post.
As for the inertia I guess I was thinking the gun would stop in recoil and the scope would continue it's momentum rearward.

It is always tough to mount a scope on a hard kicker. A heavier (Euro) scope does not help either.

As you have found out, it can be hard to stop the scope slipping within the rings. There are several options to try to deal with this, but not all of them may suit you.

1) lap the rings - sadly there is no guarantee a tighter ring will not give you very clear ring marks. Talleys are bad for leaving marks if not lapped, though.
2) epoxy the scope into the rings. This is an absolutely bomb proof way of dealing with slippage (often used in Europe), but it mars your scope finish no end if you ever want to remove the scope.
3) try rosin - this sticky stuff has been used for mounting scopes for many years, and supposedly works fairly well. I can't tell you whether it will mar your scope finish or whether it will hold up to .416 level recoil.
5) I use a product called "liquid gasket material" (or something). It is a black gooey stuff you can get in automotive part stores. This stuff never dries out, and to a large degree prevents scope slippage. It is non-marring - you can remove it with a bit of rubbing alcohol after you remove the scope. I can't tell you whether it will hold up to .416 level recoil.
6) get rid of your Talleys, and start using Burris Signature rings instead. They have polymer inserts in the rings which helps with scope marring. I have never used these on a .416, though.


- mike

Because the rifle is heavier than the scope and the scope is mounted above the rifle a moment is created at firing whereby the rifle moves rearward and inertia causes the scope to move forward. The scope will try to stay in place and the lighter the scope weighs the less inertia can be applied to throw it forward. This is one reason the Leupold DGR scopes at approximately 9oz weight are so popular. I believe the Nikon 1-4 is in the 9oz range as well.

Hello,
I have a Ruger RSM in 458 Lott and mtd. Nikon Monarch 13/4 x 4 scope w/ Ruger rings, shoot the heck out of it most every weekend and have yet to have the thing move one iota. Recoil w/ some of the loads is about as strong as you want to tackle even with the forgiving RSM. I have a KickKiller lace up pad on it or would not be able to take more that couple rounds. In any event, the scope/Ruger ring set up has worked very well for close to 400 rounds now and really impressed with the Nikon. Figured it wold crash after couple hundred rounds and it may well yet do so, but so far, so good, and absolutely crystal clear at any setting. Saved a few bucks as well.

dsiteman, I dunno what you mean by 13/4x4 scope, is it a 30mm tube? I've never tried Nikon I've always been kind of a Leupold slut, I probably have 12 or more, half of which are 6x42's. I think the weight of the Swaro may be the biggest problem but the finish may have contributed some as well. I wish I had the same luck as you did and sure wish I had it to do over again.

Mike
thanks for the reply. I don't have a lapping bar for 30mm rings but I will say, when the scope slide, it not only removed the finish on the scope tube but the rings as well, looking at the inside of the rings there was very good contact. I did lap the 1 inch rings for the leupold and not much was needed for 80/90% contact. It will be another 100 yrs or so before I start using epoxy on my scopes. I've went with Burris Signature rings almost exclusively the last few years but in this case I wanted a quick detachable scope on a CZ rifle.

I guess the European scopes on heavy kickers are just outside the weight threshold necessary for a unassisted scope rings hold?

That´s a good reason why to take the scope with rail mount!!!

What You could do is glueing it with UHU endfest 300 after you cleaned both from ail with acetone the scope and the rings... That´s apretty good additional thing for high stressed assemblies!

If You can´t get some of that UHU in the states, drop me an email for help...

Klaus
www.titanium-gunworks.de

Rayray, I have the exact same setup (rings and scope) on a Sauer 202 in 416 Rem Mag. It hasn't moved a whit. I have used lots of Swaro scopes in Talleys, and no problem, other than as MHO said, they will mark a scope from time to time. The one thing I do which may make a difference, is that I blast the rings and screws and bases with the gunscrubber citrus based cleaner. This takes all the sheen off of the rings, and I supposed any oil at all, and sure helps them grip some I think. I haven't had to do anything else to the rings, I do sock them down pretty tight with a wiha screwdriver style torx, which allows you to get a pretty good leverage.

Good Luck--Don

Thanks Don, your experience is exactly what you would expect from top of the line products. I noticed today the Talley rings on the Leupold do not close completely. I use a torx driver like you and I cannot completely close the gap at the top of the rings together. With the Swaro setup, the rings close shut, I now suspect this is the problem but still not sure. Could you please look at your rings and tell me if when torqued down the rings close completely with no gap between them at the top? If yours will not close shut I may have a diameter problem with the O.D. of the tube or the I.D. of the rings.

Does anyone know if Kahles are prone to this? The finish looks very similar to Swarovski.

Kurt

I have a 30mm Swarovski mounted with Talley QDs on a 458 Lott. I haven't had a problem with the scope moving. I did have the same problem with some Lynx rings, but when I switched to the Talleys they held up fine. Me Lott is a real kicker also. It only weighs about 9.5 pounds.