Need(want) a new pair of binoculars in 8 X 30. Narrowed it down to Leica and Swaro. Love the Leica that I have looked at. Was prepared to buy at $1,800. But saw 8X30 Swaro (SLC I think, which may make a difference) in Cabela's on sale at $900.

Look, I absolutely want top quality glass and I'm not a penny pincher, but does anyone with experience with these binos? Seems like a big disparity in price.

I don't like to compromise, but would I be happy with the Swaros at half the price, or should I go with the original plan?

I hardly would consider either Swarovski or Leica a "compromise" (or Zeiss for that matter).

Having said that, I made the same decision you are comtemplating about 11 years back for 8x42. I compared both, along with several other high end brands and concluded the Leica Trinovids and Swarovski SLC's were equal in optics and construction quality and based my purchase on price alone. Found a better deal on the Leicas.

I understand that Leica has updated their line and you're probably not looking at Trinovids but in all honesty, I believe you would have to be a german optical engineer to tell any meaninful difference. You will be extrememly happy with either.

To me, the Swaro's are a no-brainer, No matter what the difference is between the Leica Ultravid HD and the SLC, it won't be worth that much $$.

I had a pair of Swaro 8x30 slc binocs and sold them to buy a long range scope. I frequently wish I had not done that as they were wonderful lightweight binoculars well suited to all day use.

quote:

Originally posted by lavaca:
...would I be happy with the Swaros at half the price, or should I go with the original plan?

You would likely be happy with the Swaros, but it is possible (not guaranteed) that if you compared the binocs side by side that you would prefer the Leicas.

Top optics are very much about the law of diminishing returns, so less expensive models often come very close to what the very top product lines offer. In addition to that, your personal preference does not have to match that of another user. I believe you would likely be happy with any of the top optics manufacturers' products, but that does not mean you might not notice differences when/if you test them side by side. Which way that would make YOU choose, only you can tell.

It is likely also worth testing the Swaro EL as well as the Zeiss FL series. Doug from Cameralandny.com, who posts here, often has some very good offers on show models, like:

http://www.cameralandny.com/op...zeiss.pl?page=523220

http://www.cameralandny.com/optics/site.pl?page=40290

- mike

The 8X32 EL version Swaro is the top choice in my book. Money not considered. Next would be the New version SLCs. They have only been out about 6 mos. This is the reason that Cabelas has the older SLCs on sale. They are good also but if you have to wear glasses to use your binos the new SLCs are more user friendly. Look at the ELs or the New
SLCs before you buy.
Lica is good also, you can shop for a deal on Leica easier. The retail markup is only about
12% so anything over 12% off is cost or less to a retail dealer.

If you don't require the big brand name check out the Meopta made in Austria or Checzk Rep.
(Cant remember which) But Meopta makes a lot of the glass for Swaroski. They are in the $600 range and quite good. Also they are sold in Cabelas under the EuroSport brand but they don't stock the 8 powers, only 10X42s.

My personal binos are Leica Duovids 8-12 X 42 which are no longer made in the green rubber finish. Bought several years ago.

If I had to do it today and money was no object I would go for the Swaro. 8X32 EL version.

Wish I were getting a new pair. Have fun shopping.

Good Hunting.

Tetonka
DRSS
Band of Bubbas
Big Bore Bolt Trash
Band of 45-70ers

I am using 10 x 32 Leica Ultravid HDs and have been very impressed by them. I have also owned several other Swaros and Leicas. You will not go wrong with either brand. Both are top notch gear.

If you are comparing the newer Leica 8x32 Ultravid HD's to the older design Swaro 8x30 SLC's then the Leicas are better glass. Whether or not they are twice as good depends on you. They are nice glass though.
If you wish to spend $1800 or so you should also look at the Swaro EL's and the Zeiss Fl's.

Just bought Swaro 8 X 32 EL demo's from Cameraland this week for $ 1499.99. Looked at Cabela's 8X30 SLC for less than $ 900.00.
Have NO regretts getting the ELs.
Jim

Thanks for all the input. Currently, use an old pair of 10X42 Zeiss. Love them. But in the thick stuff, and for long walks, they are a bit heavy. To be honest, a 4-7X would be ideal for what I'm looking for. I've thought about compacts, but 8X30 seems to be a reasonable compromise.

Lavaca,
I use 8x30 Swaro's. I have had several pairs over the past 20 years. The newest ones are the best I have used. My eyes like them.

With that said, you can take an old pair, send it to Swarovski's customer service in Rhode Island and have it upgraded to like new for about $300.

I have done that am amazed at what they did for the price.

I have not used Zeiss or Leica other than scopes or range finders.

I have a pr of the new Leica 7x42HD and love them. Not high power but they are bright and sharp, and for the PA woods and smaller fields they work great. I do not need high power where I hunt. Buy what you think satisfies your desire, otherwise you will never be quite content.

I would suggest the Leica HD or Zeiss FL over any Swarovski (For Hunting). They are all outstanding optically and if you are a birder or hunt out of your truck; Flip a coin. A expedition type hunter may want to consider other criteria.

1) Rugged/Robust; Plain and simply Leica (built like a tank)
2) Hydrophobic lens coatings; Leica and Zeiss
3) Greaseless disc focusing: Leica, Your focus wheel will be less effected by temperature extremes (stiff to too easy) to move.
4) Scratch resistant lens coatings; Leica & I "think" Zeiss

I just always lean towards Leica as it is my belief that they have addressed more of the needs of a hunter. It is my opinion that the Leica's are better at differentiating gray scales at dusk and dawn when you loose the ability to see color. It will enable you to see game better against a backgound. I have owned them all and always grab my Leicas!
I will admit the new EL's are spectacular to look through.Have thought about buying one of the new 50MM EL's but I think they will stay in the truck.

EZ

I use 10x56 Zeiss for scouting at dusk, but for all-around hunting use, I'm very happy with the Swarovski 8x32 ELs I have...light, easy to wear and hunt with, and optics 2nd to none.

@eezridr:

Why would you rate the Zeiss and Leica´s over the Swarovski´s?

-> The optical brilliance is much higher with the Swarovski´s against the Zeiss FL and the Leica HD´s: The Leica´s show a slighly colour seaming and the Zeiss FL have unsharpness at the rim
-> the Zeiss FL is made with a fibre reforced PLASTIC housing, while the Swarovski´s have a metal one -> I am sure You will see which will losse it´s Nitrogen filling first...
-> the Swarovski´s have also a hydrophobic lens "Easy to care" lenses...

-> so why do you talk them bad: look through them and You will notice the differences CLEARLY!

Scubapro,

I think Swarovski makes outstanding products. The first premium Bino I ever bought was a pair of Swar Poro 10 X 40 WA's. I later traded them for a 1st generation 10 X 42 SLC. Swar did this as a favor due to some issues with the WA's. I still have those SLC's and Swar has upgraded them once. Great customer service!
My son has a pair of 2nd generation 8.5 X 42 EL's that you could not pry away from him.
Let me address some of your questions one at a time.
1) The toughness issue is as compared to Leica. I have two pair of Laica 8X32's (Trinovids and Ultravids) and a pair of 12 X 50 HD ultravids (fabulous binocs!). The 8 x 32 have been about everywhere with me. Dropped and banged countless times. Good as new. I dropped the Swar WA's and SLC's and both times they got out of allignment(Swar did fix them and fast; no charge)but that does you no good in the field. Leica touts their lens coating as scratch resistant; Swar does not mention the toughness of their coatings and they do not mention hydrphobic coatings to my knowledge.

2) I do not believe I compared the toughness of the FL's to the Swar. I do have a pair of 10 X 42 FL's and through my eyes they are among the brightest binocs I have ever look through at dusk and dawn. It might not sound logical but they seem a bit brighter than a pair of 10 X 56 Zeiss night owls I bought 10 years ago with APO lenses and the objectives are much smaller on the FL's. They both have T* coatings. The Zeiss focus adjustments are too sensitive for my taste.

I think you can best judge Binoculars at dusk and dawn for brightness and resolution. The Leica HD's may not be quite as bright as the Zeiss FL's but their resolution appears better to me. Almost splitting hairs here.

Again if Swar is supplying Hydrophobic coatings to the external surfaces of their lenses that is a big plus for a foul weather hunter. Zeiss markets their coatings as Loutec and Lecia as Aquadura. Not sure how Swar markets theirs?
My comments are based on my experiences and for hunting the Leica's have gained my confidence as the most dependable. If I am hunting a 1000 miles from nowhere I always want to know I have the most reliable products I can get.
I leave for Alaska, April 8th on a spring Grizzly hunt. I am taking 10 X 42 Zeiss FL's and the 8 X 32 Leica ultravids. Bet which pair I will use most often? I do not believe you need the brightest unit if you background is soild white. I hope to see the Aurora Borealis. The FL's should be great for that. Also bringing some good camera gear

Thanks Eezridr - now Your posting makes much more sense to me - understood your position...

I believe one of the biggest screw ups ever in the evolution of binocs are the twist out eye cups. They all break or wear out! They get filled up with crud or water freezes in them.
The old Zeiss classic had the best rubber eye cups. If they tear over time just buy some replacement units (cheap).
Good rubber eye cups would save a ounce or two, be cheaper, and just be more dependable. Just never understood this "enhancement"
I continue to believe IF focusing is more practical for hunting applications (perhaps not for birding). I seldom mess with my focus once set. The center focus wheels seem to always move on you. IF (individual focus) would make units more dependable as there are fewer moving parts, save weight and should cost less to produce.
Just by incorporating these "old" technologies you might reduce the weight of a binoc by 3-4 oz, be able to produce them for less money and make them a better unit for (Hunting).

Good luck EZ! Thanks for the input

Well Lavaca, what did you decide on?

I have a set of the swaro 8x30 purros and love them. I also have some ultravid compacts--like them too. Have fun making up your mind!

Ed

Dan,

Hell, I don't know. I'll use these for general hunting, but what I wanted was a light weight pair for tracking hunts -- buffalo and ele. I was sold on the Leica's. Then saw the Swaro's for half of that. Could sure use the extra $900 bucks -- need a camera too. But then, generally when I've made a decision based on price alone, I've regretted it.

Love my swaros, wish I had bought them years sooner. You cant go wrong with either-get the one that feels best.

SSR

I would include switch power binoculars in your survey. I have had binocs. since the 50's including Hensoldts.

The new Leu. 7 to 12X 32mm Switch Power binoculars I got on sale at Cabelas are by far the most comfortable to use and carry. Its so good to be able to go to 12X in big areas and make out "What is it?".

Leupold Switch Power Technology

John Barsness on Duovids

I bought one just like this in 8x40 about 6 months ago on Egun for $476 shipped to my door.
Can't tell it from new.