Since Fixed powers dont really need alot of technolgy to make them work ,i just wondered on your opinions are of the BEST less expensive fixed powers that get the job done .Rather than spending an inordnate amount on a Quality fixed power ,whats your experience or view ?

I have only bought one 'cheap' scope so far so my experiance is with the others.

The old Lyman All Americans have excellent optics and might be available for less than $75 or so. The thing is that their seals might not be all that new. I have quite a few still in service. Most are 4X's.

Used Leupolds are way too expensive.

There are some Zeiss Diatals on the net and they are superb scopes. A 4X might go for $250.

I would much rather have a variable power scope for any purpose.

Nikon and Burris have fixed power models that are priced well. I don't see a lot of used fixed power scopes because not many are sold and people that have them tend to hold onto them.

Buliwyf

If you want good quality and cheaper prices I would follow Savage99’s lead and look for an older Lyman or Weaver. I have several older scopes and the optical quality is, in my opinion, as good as anything being made today, especially the cheapo ones being made today.

It’s pretty easy to find these older scopes for around $100 bucks or so, and sometimes way less.

Someone here on AR said he sells the Pentex that is a great buy for the money. All are under $150 retail and there are two fixed models One I think is a 4x32 the other is a 6x42.

Depends on your version of cheap somewhat. Nikon Monarch 4x and 6x scopes offer very high optical quality for just over $200 new. The Weaver Grand Slam is another of very high optical quality in a 4.75x for $250 or so.

The Buckmasters 4x offers very good optical quality for around $150. An excellent old Weaver will cost possibly half of that. Optically it is far behind and doesn't have a lifetime warranty.

Bushnell Elite 3200's are available in a good 10x mildot for $180'ish.

Weaver's current K series offer 4x and 6x scopes for $120 or so in good optical quality. And also surpass the old steel tubes optically if not in toughness.

Since you want cheap,go BSA all the way!

You are correct that the less complex fixed power scopes can be very serviceable in an inexpensive brand compared to complicated variables that are total trash.

Even the loss-leaders in the Bushnell line in a 4x are pretty decent scopes. I don't know if they still make the Sportview, but that $20 scope works. Hell, practically anyone's straight 4x is decent. I even have a $16 Chinese 4x shorty made for an SKS mounted on a kid's .22 and it is as dependable and accurate as one could ask on such a gun.

For the best, used Leupold M8 4x's usually go for around a hundred bucks on ebay, depending on their appearance. But if it is for a "non-crtical" gun like a .22 or a truck gun, just buy whatever 4x you come across and you'll likley be okay.

Nothing said here applies to fixed power scopes above 6x. Higher magnification gives the el-cheapos fits.

Cheap=what in dollars? If around a 100.00, look into the Pentax Gameseekers or Weaver's K line..

Savage99: I firmly and emphatically disagree with your blanket condemnation of used Leupolds and their prices!
Its this simple - if you buy a used Leupold and are a prudent buyer you WILL be making a sound investment!
Your money has been well spent and if you decide to resell a used Leupold you WILL be able to recoup virtually all of your investment!
Trust me on this one - I have wheeling and dealing in scopes of every make and manufacture for many decades now. Leupolds outsell and out re-sell ANY brand of scope - PERIOD!
For instance (#1) - just recently (December 9th and 10th) I attended a 950 table Gunshow on the west coast. I and my "homey" had three tables full of guns, scopes and related gear!
The FIRST item to sell off of our tables was a Leupold 4x12 variable scope - it was used!
We sold many more items including several Leupold scopes both (used and new).
In my travels and tradings around that show I took special note of every used scope for sale and every price. The Leupolds simply moved quicker and for higher percentages of original prices than any other brand.
Instance #2! I am good friends with a shop owner who deals a lot in used arms and scopes. He relishes the appearance of Leupolds coming into his shop especially on used Rifles. He knows that the Leupolds sell quicker and for a higher percentage of original cost than any other brand! My friend seperates the Rifle from the Leupolds and makes his re-selling quick and painless!
QUICKER and for a higher percentage - remember those two things and do some checking for yourself regarding the used Leupolds.
Money invested in Leupold scopes (new or used!) is "still" money WELL invested.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

VG i am going to have to agree with savage here, because, most people don't understand the difference between a rifleman, vx 1 vx 2 or vx3 or vari-x2 or 3, fact of the matter is there are still old vari-x2's selling for more money than a new vx1, which is actually a better scope than the vari-x 2. ebay is a terrible place to buy a used leupold, also is the vx2 the new one or the older one with only mc4 on the outside lenses. used leupolds are a good deal however for the person buying it new with a mind to sell it someday. I do agree they hold their value better than any other scope, It just takes a smarter buyer than most to know where and how much to pay for a used leupold. also to make money never sell the scope and rifle as a combo

...what's "cheap"?

I bought a Weaver GS 4.75 and love it. Had a Weaver steel tube K4 and loved it a lot, used it for 20 years until it fogged.

VarmintGuy...while I agree with you on the resale value of Leupold scopes, the guy asked about "cheap" scopes. The prices asked for used Leupold scopes usually border on the ridiculous, and most hardly qualify for the "cheap" category.

Hard to go wrong w/ a Nikon.

The only cheap fixed power I'd feel confident w/ is the Nikon BMs or the Weavers.

The Wal-mart special Bushys, Trashcos, and BSAs are crap. I've seen many of them bite the dust. The last BSA I shot with would change POI two feet if you bumped the scope w/ your palm .

Actually the only cheap as dirt fixed scopes I've seen that will reasonably hold POI and have so so glass are the Trashcos. I personally wouldn't feel confident w/ one while in the field.

It cracks me up to go to the range and see guys w/ high dollar rifles and cheapie scopes.

Good Luck

Reloader

RE: Used Leupolds.

I don't think that anyone is "wrong" here, in fact, you're mostly in agreement.

Savage 99 simply said that used Leupolds are too expensive, which I take it is from the buyer's perspective when looking for a "cheap" scope. Can't disagree.

Varmint Guy says that used Leupolds sell quicker and for a higher percentage of new price than other brands, and he's absolutely right. What Savage99 said.

Cummins Cowboy says that ebay is a poor place to buy a used Leupold. If you're looking for a "bargain", he's right because ebay is a very efficient marketplace for items like scopes so you're going to find every scope going near its full potential price.

What the market is saying about Leupolds is that (1) they are high quality scopes (2) they have an excellent and non-time-limited warranty and customer service, which makes them attractive as used merchandise, (3) they are known standard by which other scopes (both better and worse) are judged, and (4) there is a very broad market for them.

I recently bought an "as new" Leupold off of ebay. I only paid about 15% below what I could have purchased one new, but on such an expensive model the 15% was significant (plus the state sales tax) and I was confident, for a number of reasons including the Leupold warranty, that the scope I was getting was, as a "user", worth essentially the same as NIB in the same scope. So yes, I purchased from ebay, but I got what I wanted and saved enough to make the process worth its while. (I did, however, pass up several of the same model that bidders took too close to the NIB price.)

As to people being confused about Leupold designations, that is true, but it usually doesn't enter into the pricing in a significant way. I would agree that I would prefer a new VX-1 to a similar Vari-X IIc, but there are those in the marketplace that put a premium on the older scope because they believe that it has some inherent quality that is missing from the later model. So, the Vari-X IIc's in mint condition usually sell for as much or more than the $199 that it takes to buy a VX-I from your local retailer.

It may be true that various of the scope brands often mentioned as being excellent scopes do as well as Leupolds in many ways. But the fact is, that other than a couple of the European "premium" brands, no scope will resell at anywhere near the percentage of its new price that a Leupold will. If you enjoy trading and jockeying in guns and scopes, that's important!

At a gunshow this last weekend I saw two scopes on the same table and both in decent condition for their ages. One was a 30 year old Bushnell 3-9 that at the time sold for $59.95, and it was tagged $20. The other was a 30 year old Leupold 3-9 that at the time sold for $99.95 and it was tagged $175. The Bushnell had depreciated to 1/3 of its original value, while the Leupold had appreciated to 175% of its original value. By the way, when I came back around to that table, the Bushnell was still there, but the Leupold was gone. The marketplace has spoken.

We have sold many of the Pentax Gameseekers....
4x32
6x42
Either one is under $100.00 and on a different site have been reviewed quite favorably.
If you would like I will send one to you to check out. If you like it then keep it & pay me for it, if not send it back. Fair enough?
Please let me know your thoughts.

Here's a great fixed power, when you can find it: Tasco 6X Euroclass scope.

They didn't make many, and the ones that were made were from Japan (not China).

The tube is 30mm. The only place you can find them nowadays is on Ebay (or maybe a gunshow).
I have a fixed 6X Leupold on my Dakota Model 10, and the Tasco Euroclass easily beats it out to my subjective view.

Garrett

quote:

We have sold many of the Pentax Gameseekers....
4x32
6x42
Either one is under $100.00 and on a different site have been reviewed quite favorably.

Doug,

Do you know who builds the scope?

As far as I know, Pentax doesn't build scopes themselves. Burris was making some of their models.

Thanks,

Reloader

Burris makes the Pioneer and the Whitetails Unlimited which are the same as an FFII. Burris makes the Lightseekers which are the same as the Signiture Series.
The Gameseekers are made by Pentax in a factory that Pentax built in China (Please hold your opinions on made in China until you see the scope). It is all Pentax from start to finish. For the price you cannot get a better scope, IMO.

FWIW, I ordered 5 (or maybe it was 4?) of the Gameseekers today from Doug. 2 (or 1), 6x42s, 2 1.5x6x40, and 1 2.5x10x56. Total (for 5) was less than $550.00 and free shipping. There are many guns I shoot that don't require the nuts in optics, these sounded good, I'll let you know what I think.

Gatogordo,

I'm curious about your thoughts on the scopes you ordered. I Have the same problem. To many guns to put high priced optics on all of them.

What is your opinion of the scopes you received?

James:

So far, so good. I've only mounted the two 1.5x6x40s (holidays, ya know), one on a Marlin .45-70 and one on a Savage 99 in .308, which two scopes back had a Leupold 1.5x5x20.....these scopes are considerably better than that scope in low light (all of this is true, but mostly for Stonecreek ). Sighted both in, the adjustments are not necessarily 1/4 MOA but that is not unusual on most scopes. Both scopes had one plane which was more or less 1/4 and the other was a bit more.

Optically they are fairly good. They seem to compare reasonably well MENTALLY with much more expensive scopes but I haven't tried them side by side. They are definitely acceptable even in deep twilight.

I shot a fairly large feral sow, about 175, with it on the 99 .308 yesterday, well past legal deer time......I was actually walking back to my truck from the stand when I was "surrounded" by a pig posse. Luckily I was able to defend myself. Scope was on 6x, could see the sow much better in scope than by naked eye, which isn't surprising, but I make this comment because it was quite DARK. First pig I've shot in a couple of months, I killed them in a pile for a while and they kind of disappeared, based on the 60 or so that I saw yesterday evening, they're back.

The only real complaints I've got is the magnification selection ring......you better be Godzilla or not be in a rush when you want to change powers.....it is quite hard to turn. Perhaps it will get better. This is not a real problem, since I normally pre-select a likely power but is an annoyance, reminds me of some older Leupolds. The other is the reticle, it is a bullet drop type arrangement with multiple little short horizontal cross hairs below the center cross. I find them to be less than helpful. Whether they would work for longer range on other rifles, I dunno. These rifles are used mostly for short range work, 150 and under, mostly a lot under, which is why I put the variables on them with the low end power selection.

All in all, based on very limited experience, I'd say they're an excellent value for the money with a lifetime warranty.

BTW, I have had excellent luck with them up to now, but the Savage 99 had a Elite 3200 2x7 on it and it lost its ability to hold a horizontal zero.

Thanks for the excellent post, that really helps. Good luck with the hogs!

LEUPOLD 4X , cant be simpler with the wide duplex
daniel

This year I elk hunted with a $20 used Weaver 2.5X post that must be 40 years old, mounted to a $275 Sav 99 308.

This year I deer hunted with a $150 used Leupold Vari Xii 3x9x50 mounted to a $75 VZ24 action in 300WM.

Last year I elk hunted with $100 used Leupold 2x7x33 Vari Xii mounted to a $60 91/30 in 7.62x54.

Last year I hunted deer with a $20 used Weaver K4 mounted to a $100 1896 Swede 6.5mm.

I own more expensive rifles and scopes, but I would no sooner show up for a hunting trip with a safe queen than I would show up wearing a neck tie.

In case my cheap scope or rifle breaks down or I fall down hard, I have a spare in the car. If someone steals it, I am not devastated.

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
RE: Used Leupolds.

+1