I think I just bought a double from Champlins. It is a 450-400,3" by Watson. The rifle had 24" chopper lump barrels with dolls head extension, extractors, and is proved for 55 gr. cordite.It weighs 10.5 lbs.and 11.5 with scope and claw mounts. It was built by Leonard in Birmingham.
Will this double be able to shoot the GS custom 385 gr..411 bullets at 2150 f/s safely?

You will need to check the bore before you shoot anything. Some rifles are .411 and some .408. I have read of but never heard a first hand account - or second hand for that matter - of odd ball bore diameters too. Champlin's probably knows the bore diameter or can check for you.

On bullet choice, 500 Grains is well versed. I personally would stick to Woodleighs.

Congrats on your DR!

JPK

lb404
That rifle has "Jeffery" written all over it.
No doubt it was made on a "Jeffery" action.
I would stick with 400 grain Woodleigh Softs and Solids for the big stuff.
For deer and pigs I would try Hawk 400 gr and 300 gr bullets with the same powder charges that work for the Woodleighs.
With my 450/400 3 1/4" double I have killed black bear [Montana] 2 caribou [Alaska], deer and several pigs here in TX. The 400 is a greast African calibre as well.
A scoped 400 double is a great hunting rifle.
I cannot think of a better leopard and lion rifle [or bear, black or brown for that matter] than a scoped 400 double.


I really should have JJ put claw mounts on my 400.

WTG Leonard! You are going to like that rifle!

Congratulations!

Good on ya, for picking a 450/400NE 3"! Slug that barrel before you shoot anything in it. It may very well be a .408" bore!

All you have to do now is, come to one of our DRSS hunts with your double rifle!

Mac,
On the Champlin site they say it's a .411. I'm sure JJ has already done that!

Ib congrats and good luck with that double rifle...


Mike

quote:

Originally posted by lb404:
I think I just bought a double from Champlins.

You don't know? As bad as I am I usually know when I buy a new gun.

I don't know if I like the Watson double or the Fjold double better!

Leonard:

Glad you've finally found one. I remember talking to you several years ago when you had a couple tracked down in Virginia. Nice looking rifle. It does look like an H. Leonard gun. I have a nearly identical rifle built by Leonard for a different retailer, but with 26" barrels. If yours is a Leonard built gun, Leonard's serial number will be stamped on the lower rib, just in front of the fore-end loop, and will be three or four digits. These rifles are of excellent quality, and I think you'll like it. Funny thing, my first .400 was a Watson Bros. also. It wasn't a Leonard and wasn't at all similar to yours.

Can it drive a 385 at 2150 safely? That isn't realistic. The original standards for .450/.400 3" NE, are 60 grains Cordite and a 400 grain bullet = 16 tons bolt thrust and 2125 fps in a 30 INCH pressure barrel. Your gun has 24" barrels. Late production (1972) original factory Kynoch (Cordite MD) gives 2070 fps in my gun with 26" barrels. I would expect somewhat less with 24" - maybe 2050 fps. A 5% reduction in bullet weight won't make much difference in handloads. Sure, you can reach 2150 with handloads, but the gun probably won't stay on face very long, and isn't likely to regulate at that velocity anyway.

There isn't any need to horse it anyway. This cartridge established it's stellar reputation with Factory Kynoch. With Woodleigh bullets loaded to the same velocities, it's even better today. I wouldn't recommend the bullet you mentioned for that rifle. Stick with Woodleighs. Congratulations on your choice, and good luck with it.
----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

lb404
Standard 450/400 3" tropical ballistics, with Woodleigh 400 grain Softs and Solids, out of a fine double rifle WITH scope.... It just does not get much better than that.
Plenty of power, with low recoil....
All you need is a plane ticket to Africa [and a pocket full of money], and every animal on the Continent should be in fear.

Congratulations on the new double. Hope it serves you well.

quote:

Originally posted by Fjold:

quote:

Originally posted by lb404:
I think I just bought a double from Champlins.

You don't know? As bad as I am I usually know when I buy a new gun.

That type of thing happens to me from time to time, too. It's a state known as "blissphoria" (hey! I don't make this shit up! ) Like, well, just like when you buy a fantastic double rifle. You're in a blissful state of euphoria (no, that's not in the EU). "WOW! I can't believe I actually did it. I did buy it, didn't I?"

Dave

You'll definitely enjoy it!