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I find both Ted's and Kensco's opinions very interesting because they show just how controversial the subject of hunting, as presented by the media, really is. And I agree with both of them to a large extent. Hunting in France is legally based on a politically correct view of wildlife management, range management, agricultural management, etc. And "politically correct" are the key words here. In fact, the laws and rules about hunting in France would seem to be based on "how can politicians feel comfortable about it" rather than any other consideration. In that respect Ted is absolutely correct about the search, and the editorial drive, to orient information published about the activity which can make us all feel really good about just how sensitive we are to (take your pick) the environment, animals, competing interests, the greater good of science, ad nauseum. Then again, there is no reason that everyone who hunts has to have the same justification, and I agree with Kensco on that. But I would put us all on guard against spiralling down to the requirement that hunting become an activity regulated like stem cell research undergoing constant "moral" and "ethical" review. I believe, like Ortega y Gasset, that instinctual behaviour escapes "rational" justification. It's a contradiction in terms. There is nothing worse than technocrats deciding how instinctual behaviour is to be judged, with the yardstick being, "will it hurt my chances for re-election". A long time ago a group of far seeing thinkers put down a few principles and I'll use just one example, the first phrase of the 1st Amendment to the US Consitution: "Congress shall make no law abridging the freedom of speech, ......" Imagine if it read, "Once a few elected officials, who may or may not reflect their constituencies wishes, has ascertained what position will ensure their re-election, they will decide what you can or cannot say or print,..." Which do you prefer? _________________________________ AR, where the hopeless, hysterical hypochondriacs of history become the nattering nabobs of negativisim. | |||
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All, The author answers a number of questions about the story on the NYT website on 29 March. Certain amount of vegan dudgeon in some of the q's, doesn't look as if he will continue the sport, but some thoughtful comment. Regards, Tim | |||
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Dear Kensco, I neither care nor require that the guy likes hunting. That's his business. But he for sure isn't becoming a modern hunter gatherer. He is simply going out hunting as Elmer Keith or Ted Nugent would. I think it is intellectually pretentious to infer that by killing a pig he is he somehow morphing into a hunter gatherer. Anyhow I have to laugh. Here I am on my high horse and I haven't even read the story. VBR, Ted Gorsline | |||
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Ted Gorsline, You have outlined a conspiracy theory that would require more of the NYT and liberals in general than they have to offer. Way more. I seriously doubt anyone thought past the requirements of making the publication date. JPK  Free 500grains | |||
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Well, I'm surprised and pleased to see that one of our French friends came up with an answer that suits me. "Instinctual behavior escapes "rational" justification." In my rather crude speech, I say the same thing, "I need to go out and kill something and get blood on my hands ever now and then." Is that instinct? I think so as I am normally not a violent man. Is it a missing gene, or a flaw in the DNA? I think man was a hunter before he became a farmer. Some of us, still are. | |||
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TJ, just to set the record straight, I live in France but I am still an American citizen; it wasn't taken away from me when the American firm I work for assigned me to their French subsidiaries' office. Living here does give me a different perspective on a lot of things though. As for missing genes or flawed DNA, that seems to be more prevalent in Arkansas than Alaska and I won't hazard a guess as to your family tree. I wholly agree; it seems to me to be perfectly natural to want to hunt, and if you haven't ever killed an animal then you haven't hunted. Since all of nature is a heirarchy of hunter and hunted, with man at the top, condemning hunting is to condemn what is left of natural behaviour. Man is of course the supreme hunter and to refuse to confirm it is to deny one's humanity. _________________________________ AR, where the hopeless, hysterical hypochondriacs of history become the nattering nabobs of negativisim. | |||
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Dear JPK, I suspect you are right. But I am having fun anyway. VBR, Ted Gorsline | |||
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Anybody have a copy of the article...i couldn't find it Mike Legistine actu? Quid scripsi?[/] [i] Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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90+% of the people reading the article will not parse it like we have here. It will not change the minds of the ones that are ardent antihunting. However the ones that are on the fence or don't have an opinion are the ones we have a chance to influence. It might not be the style of article that appeals to me but I'm not the target reader. I think, however it probably appeals to the sensativities of their typical reader. Any prohunting article is good any antihunting article is bad. A steady steam of postive hunting news would gradually improve our position politically. We should thank those that give us positive press and take to task those that trash us. | |||
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