I recently purchased two twenty round boxes of Federal Premium 500gr TBBC 458 Lott from Midway. I decided to shoot a few today, and while inspecting the ammo before loading the rifle, something that I always do btw, I saw that one of the primers was inserted backwards.


I haven't contacted Federal yet, but I will just as soon as I get this posted. To me, this is a serious quality control issue that could cost a dangerous game hunter his life. I will advise what Federal's response is as soon as I get one, if I get one.

UPDATE:

Within minutes of the time I posted this, I called Federal, and e-mailed them. I left a message with Gary in their product service division. Less than two hours later, he returned my call. Gary was very concerned about the round being loaded incorrectly, especially since it is a DG cailber. He stated that there is no excuse for something like this happening, and has asked me to return the round to him ASAP. He also wanted the lot # off of the box. In exchange for the bad round, he has offered to send me an entire box of the same loads. You can't beat better response or service than that. Gary is a nice person to deal with, and his level of concern impressed me.

I like your wife, I like your house, I like your land, I like your dogs and I like your fishing pond. Please use that round in Tanzania and remember me in your will.

Damn!

A dangerous game hunter with half a brain would check his ammo before taking it hunting anyway.
However how many times have you had this happen with federal premium ammunition? If this has happended more than once then yeah I would probably complain. If this is the only time then I would chalk it up to shit happens. If they were perfect and never made mistakes they would not be selling ammunition.

Jarrod:

I once had a "Coleman" type propane lantern ignite while I was holding it in my hands... I say ignite, but since the gas was escaping from mutiple flaws in the copper "generator" and screw-in connection, "explode" would be a better word.

I complained to the Product Safety Commission (or whatever the hell the consumer protection folks are) and I was shortly contacted by the manufacturer and was sent a pre-paid shipping container to get the lantern to them. It was a unique problem, but they went to China where the product was made and inspected the manufacturing process and discovered that it would repeat itself (and other safety problems)if changes weren't made. I got lots of camping goodies for pointing out what happened to me. (I wasn't injured, btw).

Dangerous stuff needs to be reported. What does one have to lose but a little time and maybe the problem needs to be fixed... JMHO.

Jarrod,

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but I tend to be a little less cavalier in my attitude towards an obvious lapse in quality control. I obviously am in you "half a brain" crowd or I wouldn't have caught the problem. However, just in case I happen to be standing shoulder to shoulder with someone who doesn't have half a brain when some real shit happens, I would hope that my warning would somehow remind them to look before they load. I have been a cop for 23 years, and have stayed healthy so far erring on the side of caution. I am not even going ask Federal for a replacement, but I sure as hell am going to let them know what happened. There is no excuse for this round making it to a box and out of the door with an inverted primer.

Dale- last year, just before departing for Zambia, I was inspecting brand new Federal boxes of ammo. I opened one box that was labeled "trophy bonded sledgehammers". That solid was the one I was going to use for Cape Buff. What was really in the box and much to my surprise was trophy bonded bear claws! Fortunately, I had 10 rounds of sledgehammers left and that ended up to be enough for my hunt. Yep, always check that ammo!

John

I use an old Rockchucker press for all my pistol and rifle reloading. However I do use a progressive press (with automatic primer feed) for my shotshell reloading. Even visually checking the primer "tray", I can see how this could happen. I wonder how they do check? Visual?
Peter.

Here's the question, for you avid reloaders - how in the world do you get that primer out of the brass if you want to use it again? Doesn't the decapping pin cause the primer to fire? I've inverted a primer or two when I've reloaded and I just throw the stuff away.

Well be damned.

I was in a gunshop the other day (here in Aust)
and we opened a box of Federal to show someone
a loaded round (I think 243) and one of the primers was like that shown in the Lott, inserted backwards.

Dale: Let us know what Federal says. When i had a problem with hot Weatherby ammo, they sent me 2X1 for every box for my inconvenience. Just for info, I always, in addition to doing the same thing you do, is fire atleast one round out of each box before going on a hunt. jorge

Bwana

I spray the primer with oil, let it soak in for 15 mins which should make it inert and them slowly deprime it - slowly !

You WILL get a response, especially if you point out that you were planning on shooting charging dangerous game with it.

I was given a factory box of 45 Colt from PMC. 49 of them fired just fine. The other one, had no POWDER. The primer fired but fortunely the bullet did not budge. That is why I prefer my handloads.

Keith

I bought a few boxes of Remington 45/70 JHP's a couple of years ago. One of the cartridges had a bullet in backwards. I visited the gunshop who sold me the ammo to let him know what happened. He didn't care. I never called Remington, Maybe I should have. This was the first problem I had had with factory ammo. I still have the 45/70 round.

What do you suppose would of happened If I didn't notice the backwards bullet, and fired the round?

quote:

Originally posted by Bwanna:
Here's the question, for you avid reloaders - how in the world do you get that primer out of the brass if you want to use it again? Doesn't the decapping pin cause the primer to fire? I've inverted a primer or two when I've reloaded and I just throw the stuff away.

Wasteful.

I'll bet if you TRY to fire off the primers while decapping the cases you'll have to do MANY times MANY of them to get one to fire.

With the anvil floating free even dimpling the pellet with the decapping pin is unlikely to do anything other than release some primer dust
down your spent primer chute.

But if you are really worried about it put a drop or two of WD40 on the upended cases (in a loading block) and let them soak overnight.

I spend too much time prepping cases to casually toss them.

AD

1115

I just bought 8 boxes of the same loads. What was your lot number? I won't get a chance to inspect them until later this summer because I had them shipped to another location.
Rich Elliott

Rich,

Lot 2 39V493. There was only one round out of 40 that was affected. I shot a few of them, and they seemed perfect.

I guess the moral is "inspect your ammo before you go hunting."

I do. My inspection includes a visual exxamination, and a function test in which each round gets to go from the magazine into the chamber. In my Ruger No. 1's, I let the cartridge slide into the chamber. It is obvious if it goes in as far as necessary from visual inspection. The block is not closed, and merely elevating the muzzle lets the cartridge slide back out into my hand.

Since I use ammo I load myself, I can't blame anyone else if it has a defect! But this is something I prefer to deal with before I am on top of Elk Mountain!

Yet another reason why I only shoot my own reloaded ammo on any hunt.

I've never come across any of the things mentioned myself in any caliber of new box ammunition, but it is good that you contacted them.
Believe it or not, a good company/manufacturer wants to know about things getting through any quality control cycle for a number of reasons.
They can't fix something if they don't know it is broken, so to say...

We deprime cases all the time, and we have never, ever had any go off.

quote:

Originally posted by 500N:
Bwana

I spray the primer with oil, let it soak in for 15 mins which should make it inert and them slowly deprime it - slowly !

This does not work all the time.

Some primers, which have a lacquer coating covering all its anvil, would fire after being left in oil for a week.

I am with Saeed on this one; in the over 27 years of reloading (I started when I was young)lol, I have had dozens of rounds with primers inverted (mostly from my progressive pistol press). If I caught it before I loaded the round I just cleared the press and ran it back thru, SLOWLY pressing the primer out. Most times I turned the primer over and re-used it on the round. If I loaded the round I would pull the round with my inertia puller and then deprime it. I have never had a primer pop on me. Can it happen, sure. I use light steady pressure, no sharp slam of the deprime pin on the primer. It works. My .02
Eterry

I have deprimed plenty of pistol rounds without a hitch, but never rifle. Maybe get some neighborhood kid to do it.

I am interested that the reloaders feel their ammo solves the problem. Ask any serious trap or skeet shooter if they have ever had a reloaded primer dent but not fire. It happens not frequently but it happens. Ammunition and component manufacturing is not zero defects so things will happen. In one of Boddingtons books he shot a lion with the second shot after the first dented the primer but did not fire. I think Federal offers much imagination and good products for the hunter. I don't think we should conclude on the basis of an incident or two that they are producing a bad product. If you shoot enough the odds will provide you with the mysterious misfire or problem round. Next time you seat a primer ask yourself if perhaps a drop of oil from a machine splashed on it? All any person or manufacturer can do is produce a reasonably reliable round or component. If we expect more we are kidding ourselves.

Having loaded countles thousands of rounds of ammo in progressive presses myslef, this does happen on occassion. I have never had a problem removing the primer with the standard sizing die with decapping pin. I do apply pressure SLOWLY, as mentioned earlier, and make double sure I am wearing glasses and on a single stage press (no powder near by.) I must admit, this is not a particualry safe practice, and have gotten in the habit of discarding cases with inverted primers if they are in inexpensive brass (.38, .45 acp, 308, etc.). I'm still too cheap to throw away a .375 case, or heaven forbid, a .416 case that is in otherwise perfectly good condition. Use caution, and at your own risk, but my results have never (yet?) resulted in a primer detonation.
Good Luck,
Bill

On a secondary note, aside from inspecting factory ammo, I always, always, function feed every round from a box of factory ammo before taking it hunting. I once purchased a box of 30.06 Remington factory ammo (don't remember the specifics) which was too long (headspace), and would not chamber in my trusty old 30.06. Trying to load the rifle at first light on opening morning of deer season, after hiking 2 miles from the truck, was a lesson I haven't forgotten. As a further precaution against my own fallability, I also function feed all of my handloads before heading to the field on a hunt. A problem on the range is one thing, but an entirely different matter when hunting.

A backward primer will just pop and flash a bit if you punch it out..Its really not a big deal, just cover the die with a a plastic bucket if you must and punch it out slowly, if it pops it pops, its not exactly dynamite...

Interesting comment Ray. A slightly different experience... an acquaintance of mine, a benchrest shooter, was depriming a case with a hand die. The primer "went off" spraying pieces of metal into the flesh of the palm of his hand. He was bleeding like a stuck pig (his words) and the bleeding would not stop. He had to go to the ER where they spent quite some time picking out the pieces. Several months after the incident he did not have full use of his hand. My take, is that I agree with the above posters about firm pressure rather than an impact of decapping pin on primer, but also be aware of "exit points" from the shell holder and press. They may not be only be below the press. I was also unaware of the "debris" from a primer detonation.
Peter.

This is just another in a long list of reasons to handload your own ammunition.

Honestly, based on what I see they manufacturers and retailers charging for completed cartridges, high cost is all the more reason to handload.

Doug