I just watched the Babe Winkleman show (not one of my usual shows) A guy was hunting Cape Buffalo with a bow in South Africa. He arrows the bull and it runs off into a river bed so they call in a helicopter to come in and finish it off with a rifle shot from the helicopter. Is that the latest method for finishing off wounded game?

The other thing was that the buffalo was described as 47" wide, 2,500 lbs and "over 16 feet long"

Under South African Provincial Game Laws if a buffalo is wounded you have to imediately report it to the authorities ( police and local game department) and steps will then be taken / have to be taken to bring the hunt to a rapid conclusion. This may include as I have seen personally the use of a helicopter, hunting dogs or whatever means available at the time.

This done to eliminate the threat to life and limb of locals. Failure to do so, especially if someone should be killed or injured can lead to criminal charges against the parties involved.

Just watched the same episode. Seemed pretty cowardly to me, why hunt DG at all if you're going to finish animals off from a helicopter

What a croc of s...t. That buf is bigger then Walter's what a bunch of BULL crap 16feet and 2500lbs.

Mike

Croc? I didn't see no croc. Must have missed it while watching the helicopter.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by retreever:
What a croc. That buf is bigger then Walter's what a bunch of BULL crap 16feet and 2500lbs.

Mike

At the end of the show, I was sad that I had stopped the job I was doing and wasted the time to watch it. It was embarassing.

The follow-up examination showed it was hit "perfectly" (thru the heart), but stayed on its feet and was waiting for them in the riverine brush. Could have waited a while longer for it to drop, if it was perfect.

They could see it from up in the tree, and it was still standing (shoot it again from up in the tree?). The helecopter certainly looked like a privately owned one from the ranch, certainly nothing "official" about it.

Just measured my wall mount buff, and am amazed that it is so small. I'm missing about 12 more feet. The other buffs tail must have been eight feet long!

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
Under South African Provincial Game Laws if a buffalo is wounded you have to imediately report it to the authorities ( police and local game department) and steps will then be taken / have to be taken to bring the hunt to a rapid conclusion. This may include as I have seen personally the use of a helicopter, hunting dogs or whatever means available at the time.

This done to eliminate the threat to life and limb of locals. Failure to do so, especially if someone should be killed or injured can lead to criminal charges against the parties involved.

since it was almost certainly shot inside an electrfied game fence, i would think there was VERY little danger to locals, other than the hunting party. is this what happens if you wound a buffalo on the concessions bordering Kruger? no follow up- just call in the chopper and try to win the door gunner award?? if this is how dangerous game hunting is in RSA- WELL, NO THANKS.

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
Under South African Provincial Game Laws if a buffalo is wounded you have to imediately report it to the authorities ( police and local game department) and steps will then be taken / have to be taken to bring the hunt to a rapid conclusion. This may include as I have seen personally the use of a helicopter, hunting dogs or whatever means available at the time.

This done to eliminate the threat to life and limb of locals. Failure to do so, especially if someone should be killed or injured can lead to criminal charges against the parties involved.

ALF abiding by the law is the right thing to do if all else has been tried then the chopper is not a bad issue!

My question is, if they could see the the buff what is to stop the PH from simply shooting him? It seems to me the bow hunter was not going to be dispatching the buff anyway, so what is the difference between the PH and the chopper shooter?

I think the PH was simply scared to go into the weeds with the buff, and called in the chopper!

Of course you can't always judge by what you see on edited film!

My bull was estimated to weigh "about 800 kilos" I didn't realize at the time how puny he was, that's not even 2,000 Lbs! I'll have to go back now and insist that Martin find me a bigger one.

quote:

Originally posted by Fjold:
My bull was estimated to weigh "about 800 kilos" I didn't realize at the time how puny he was, that's not even 2,000 Lbs! I'll have to go back now and insist that Martin find me a bigger one.

Please don't forget that within the confines of the fence a certain amount of weight gain and "plumping" with salt and water can take place adding as much as 40% to the initial weight of the animal before it is released from the corral.

ahhhhh, dangerous game hunting- South African style. do they at least let the client go up in the chopper and finish the job? mustn't break the law and apparently chopper shooting is legal in defence of the game ranch staff- and the PH afraid to go in and sort out his client's mess. once again Babe has filmed another winner. WHY IS THIS GUY STILL SELLING THIS CRAP????

I watched it, didnt understand why the shot it from the chopper when they couldnt make it move whith it. They said the chopper ran off the other bulls. That told me the buff was not going anywhere. All they needed to do was keep someome in the tree to keep an eye on him.

Wasnt a very good advertisment for the rage broad head either.

Good day gentleman.
Please do not take what you see on TV as 100% facts.
The law in SA does say that if a DG animal is wounded that certain authorities are to be notified.
It all depends on the area and the province that it occurs in. It also depends on the PH and Outfitter and the situation.
If the hunt was conducted in a primarily ECO-area where a nominated animal had to be hunted and it was wounded then I understand that only after all other methods were exhausted that a chopper would be called upon.

Please do not after one incident on TV think that this is how it is done in SA.

There are loads of places in SA where you can have a Buffalo hunt of a lifetime without diesel stalking or any other easy way equipment on offer.

Please refrain from drawing a conclusion after one incident on TV.

Fritz:

What you say could well be correct and I doubt many will dispute you however, what was screened was for everyone and anyone to see and I could wager that the majority of the viewers, not necessarily of the hunting fraternity, would take similar situations for granted.

I have not seen the footage so cannot offer an opinion if enough was or was not done by the PH before calling in a chopper, which anyhow I feel is rather far fetched - however, to each his own.

The first mistake was using a michanical broad head

If he used a mechanical head then he broke the law. Both the outfitter, PH, and client should be taken to task on this one. A mech head has no place, absolutely none in DG bowhunting. I have not seen this show but if this is all true he shot that buffalo with a piece of junk. Was the PH using ballistic tips ammo as well? This sounds like a sad comedy not a buffalo hunt.

quote:

Originally posted by Ken Moody:
If he used a mechanical head then he broke the law. Both the outfitter, PH, and client should be taken to task on this one. A mech head has no place, absolutely none in DG bowhunting. I have not seen this show but if this is all true he shot that buffalo with a piece of junk. Was the PH using ballistic tips ammo as well? This sounds like a sad comedy not a buffalo hunt.

I was thinking the same thing Ken. Mechanical heads have NO PLACE in DG hunting!

If he used a setup that was not propper for a Buff hunt and the PH allowed it then the PH should be charged and brought in front of authorities.
Also the people making the show should be prosecuted because they should have known that a mech point is not suitable for a Buff. Then the Outfitter should also be held accountable for running such a bad outfit.

This is unfortunately true of many companies. They book bow hunting clients and do not have the faintest idea of how it works.

Please folks. Do not condemn SA as a whole because some Baboons thought that they could win an Oscar with their show.

There are many places in SA that offers a great Buffalo hunt in any persons standards.

I took a guy bison hunting a few years ago and he wanted to use a bow with mechanical broadheads. I asked him to used fixed blades but he thought he'd read otherwise in some magazine. We got on a huge bull and he shot the poor thing about 12 times with the mechanicals with no fatal results. Was getting 2 inches of penetration. Was picking up the arrows that had fallen out and reshooting them. Finally disclosed he had some fixed blades in his truck and the job was finished with one arrow. Mechanicals have no place with large game.

I normally refrain from commenting on these type of thread topics as anyone whom posts contrary to the general theme of the thread is soon to be dismissed as little more than a troll to the AR site. With this in mind I give my $.02 anyway.
By scanning some of the anti archery/DG topics of past a reader will quickly note the bias tone of the posters here on it. In total disregard for the fact no animal DG or not will not live very long with it's heart or both lungs pierced with anything. I've hunted DG in Africa with both archery and centerfire finding it takes alot more nerve to get under 25 yards holding a properly equipped bow/arrow combo knowing you'll likely get just 1 shot than it does, or did for me anyway,with my Mauser 458Lott stuffed full of 450 gr Barnes X ammo.

I've hunted with archery gear thruout most of NA for everything except the sheep an one thing that stands above all others in NA archery hunting vs. African is waiting after the shot for the animal to die for fear ofjumping up an pushing the prey. Why? There can be no good reason except the PH operating the hunt does not understand archery hunting.

With that said if the law requires notification immdeiately after the hit so be. I'm all for following the law. Though once the skin of the prey is pierced via a bullet it is no longer and narchery kill. Cowardly NO! law obeying YES! Archery kill NO!

2th doc,

Did you watch the show? The hunter shot the buff which ran into a swampy area. The tracker was able to climb into a tree and spot the buff; so what prevented the hunter and the PH going in with rifles if need be to finish the hunt as opposed to waiting for who knows how long for a helicopter to come?

I don't think anyone is anti-archery. The issue is whether or not the hunt is done the right way.

Heym yes I did see the show though I confess to not watching much TV in general as IMHO it dulls the mind which may seem absurd for someone whom has produced a hunting show at one time. In truth what a viewer watches for 18.5- 20.5 minutes of a 30 minute taping varies from the actual event as much as a beagle varies from a setter, they are both canines but that is where it stops.
It is my understanding of the show that the PH was following the letter of the law. I do not know first hand RSA's DG laws on the matter as I never hunting DG there. But to answer your question yes by the depiction of the events if the law allows a PH and hunter should have been able to approach with rifles.

As to your comment of not thinking "anyone is anti archery'" please do a search on articles pertaining to the subject then come back to post you opine. Doc

2th doc,

Fair enough there are probably a few anti archery guys on this site. I just didn't see anyone bashing archery on this post.

I have been bowhunting my whole life and have shot more deer with my bow than rifle. Imo you have three options while using archery equipment on DG. You can wait for the animal to bleed out, go in and stick another arrow in it, or go in with a rifle and finish it off.

This whole point about following the law seems off to me. I find it hard to believe that any Cape buffalo would go straight down after being shot with an arrow. So are helicopters just standing by to finish off everyones wonded buff. I have no problem with anything that happened until they shot a wounded animal from a helicopter that to me is cowerdly

The law in RSA states that if a DG animal is wounded, the PH MUST do everything possible to down the animal. The incident has to be reported after 24 hours to authorities if the animal was not killed. Then they will decide to send out another PH or allow for a dog team or they will advise something else.

The Outfitter and PH will be contacted and their input is valued because they are the responsible parties.

I think that it was the Outfitter or PH that called upon the chopper to help for what ever reason. It is not something that we hear of often.

Maybe someone can contact the PH or client and find out what the real story was.

I would speculate, and only speculate, that the entire chopper thing was just something cooked up to hype the show and overdramatize the event.

Agreed but it does more harm than good.

It's simply amazing how words written on these threads are taken dissected and then twisted to suit a point of view, it is as if topics take on a life of their own

The law as it stands goes back to the Game Conservation law number 17 of 1967 and it predates legal bowhunting in South Aftrica. ( under the same law bowhunting was illegal), it even predates the wide spead use fences and was aslo the same law that mandated the use of game fences to gain expemption from provisions of the law.

The intent was / is simple:

To mandate an obligation to prevent injury to persons by wounded big game, no matter by what means the animal was hunted.

This provision of the act was not anti-bowhunting,( there was another provision that outlawed bowhunting) it is nort anti -rifle hunting, it is not anti- hunting per se.

It does not claim that the officials are going to supply the helicopter, it does not claim that a helicopter even be used. It does not even state or claim how or by whom or by what means the animal is to be dispatched.

Only that the hunter be obligated to inform the authorities ie the nearest Police usually ( which also makes sense as they are an duty 24 - 7 in all jurisdictions as opposed to Nature Conservation) and that attempts then be made to hunt and put the wounded animal down before it can do harm.

Ken and Fairgame:

If that was the case then it is bad taste from all parties involved.

This post was not about the bow hunt at all.
The first point of the post was a question about why the PH called in a helicopter to finish off the wounded bull.

The bull was wounded and they followed it up in to a river bottom. The PH climbed a tree and could see the group of bulls included the wounded one. The same afternoon the helicopter came in and spooked off the other bulls but the wounded one was down and couldn't get up. They then shot the bull from the helicopter.

From Fitz's post
The law in RSA states that if a DG animal is wounded, the PH MUST do everything possible to down the animal. The incident has to be reported after 24 hours to authorities if the animal was not killed.

The helicopter was called in the same afternoon so the 24 hour rule was not in effect.

Since the helicopter could see that the bull was down and unable to get up why couldn't have it been left for the PH or hunter to finish it?

There were ample people on hand to put an observer in the tree to watch the bull while the PH with or without the client, to go in after the bull.


The second point that I was trying to make in this post was the absolutely ridiculous size estimate of the bull.

I REPEAT- HOW DOES THE BABE GET AWAY WITH PEDDELING THIS TRUCKLOAD OF BS??? IS HE TOO STUPID TO REALIZE HOW BAD THIS MAKES HIM LOOK?? HE HASN'T GOT THE COJONES TO FINNISH WHAT HE STARTED( USING ILLEGAL ARCHERY EQUIPMENT)???

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
I REPEAT- HOW DOES THE BABE GET AWAY WITH PEDDELING THIS TRUCKLOAD OF BS??? IS HE TOO STUPID TO REALIZE HOW BAD THIS MAKES HIM LOOK?? HE HASN'T GOT THE COJONES TO FINNISH WHAT HE STARTED( USING ILLEGAL ARCHERY EQUIPMENT)???

It wasn't Babe doing the shooting it was another hunter. Babe just showed it.

Babe put it out there for public consumption- PATHETIC!