Who's Taking Who's Farm in Zim

24 May 2002, 03:07

Zero Drift

The way you do this is under the "race card" you tell the World how unfair it is that the Whites have stolen the land for the rightful owners. After all, everyone knows Africa is 100% black and that any White who owns land must have stolen it from some poor black family at some point in time. So, after you get the liberal world believing that Africa is black and that you are doing the politically correct thing, you then reward your buddies with the reclaimed farms. To make it look all nice, you establish a court system where Whites can complain, however, this only ensures the legal transfer of deed to your buddies. Then, when your black buddies donï¿½t produce the first crop on their once highly productive farm, you plead to the liberal World that famine has struck your country and you must have food shipments.

Unfortunately, some folks are buying this....

I do have a few rhetorical questions - Where are the Hollywood idiots that were screaming of the injustice in RSA? Where is Danny looking-out-for-number-1 Glover, or Michael I'm-really-a-communist Moore, or Barbra cross-me-and-I'll-kill-ya Strisenburger, or Reverend Jess Iï¿½m-not-your-father-kid Jackson, and Sean got-nothing-else-to-do Penn? Why are they not in Zimbabwe staging protests and rasing money for the folks that have been unjustly run off their land? Where are all these proponents for peace and justice? Why is it that when Whites are being mistreated that no one is running to their defense? Could this be another shining example of racism???

24 May 2002, 03:28

Safari-Hunt

Well said Zero-Drift !

This week a new law has been passed to our police they are not allowed to use lethal force to arrest anybody unless they are in mortal danger.

In other words you come around someone who is raping a wowen a very common sight he runs and you have to run you can't shoot him to stop him. The criminals have more rights than the cops how are they suppose to work. "Please stop running I would like to hand you these lovely stainless steel handcuffs and I'll show you how they work" : )

I don't know but they have just told you criminals can do what ever you want as long as you run when you get spotted they can't do anything to you.

Safari-Hunt

www.Safari-Hunt.com

24 May 2002, 03:44

Zero Drift

S-H - Unfortunately, now you know what it is like for our boys in blue over here. You must have the 15 step checklist complete before you can even un-holster your weapon. God forbid that you actually shot someone, the paperwork will kill you and you must immediately retain an attorney for the cascade of law suites.

Gone are the good ole days where you could actually stop the bad guys and do so in a manner that would make the next guy in line stop and think - ï¿½maybe I should get a job today rather than knocking over this old ladyï¿½. Sorry to hear of the change in law. Jo'Burg will be even a more dangerous place for it.

24 May 2002, 05:35

qw1437

AMEN, Zero Drift-

After 22 years with a metropolitan police department, the only reason I stay is because I have a slather of young-uns that need their dad employed, and its pretty tough to make a living selling guns.

Thanks for the support- QW

24 May 2002, 06:26

<AW>

Zero drift, nice little rant and rave.
Are you a member of the KKK?

24 May 2002, 06:45

MLindsay

Please give us your ideas on what is happening in Zim

Mike

24 May 2002, 06:47

Zero Drift

AW - Seeing as how the UK sold out Rhodesia in the first place, I guess I can see where the KKK comment came from.

However, to answer your inquiry, I am not a racist. As a matter of fact, I abhor racism of all kinds, including the thinly disguised racism imposed on Whites. But it's not politically correct to point out this type of racism now is it?

24 May 2002, 07:00

Flip

Safari-Hunt

That new law are gone give us hell on earth, I don't know how they can pass such an law.

24 May 2002, 09:47

Will

They can, and did, pass that law because 99.9% of the crime is perpetrated by blacks, and in that mind set, blacks can do no wrong. Look at Mbeki's approval of Mugabe.

Why is it always the poor, picked-upon blacks. They never seem to take the higher ground. Zim is run by them, but protect white folks? Yous gotta be kiddin'.

24 May 2002, 12:22

Mike Smith

AW, Black or white what is the difference? Racism is racism no matter where it is pointed. In all fairness it isnt about race at least not totally. Mugabe will steal from the whites first because people like you will stand by and let it happen. Once they are all taken care of he will resort to stealing from his own. It is about money, theft, and power. The race card is just a convenient excuse for now.
SH, I dont know why the criminals have more rights than either the victims or the law enforcement officers but it is the same here.

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Happiness is a warm gun

[This message has been edited by Mike Smith (edited 05-24-2002).]

25 May 2002, 03:02

<AW>

Have you gents considered that maybe the people of Africa have seen what the european immigrants did to the indigenous people of North America, and are now ensuring Africa does not go that way?
If you chaps do not like the Africans, why go to their lands?

25 May 2002, 03:13

<AW>

quote:
Originally posted by MLindsay:
AW
Please give us your ideas on what is happening in Zim
Mike

Mike,
The indigenous people of Zimbabwe have waited over 20 years to get back what was snatched from them (ie.. their land). So now, they have lost their patience , and are taking back what is rightfully theirs.
The problem with people on this forum, is they feel their sport is being threatened, hence the apparent crocodile tears for the whites in Zimbabwe. Bet you guys would sing a different tune if Mugabe offered cheap hunts to you'll in return for your endorsement of his policies.
AW.

25 May 2002, 03:35

<AW>

quote:
Originally posted by Zero Drift:

S-H - Unfortunately, now you know what it is like for our boys in blue over here. You must have the 15 step checklist complete before you can even un-holster your weapon. God forbid that you actually shot someone, the paperwork will kill you and you must immediately retain an attorney for the cascade of law suites.
Gone are the good ole days where you could actually stop the bad guys and do so in a manner that would make the next guy in line stop and think - ï¿½maybe I should get a job today rather than knocking over this old ladyï¿½. Sorry to hear of the change in law. Jo'Burg will be even a more dangerous place for it.

Zero Drift,
Pretty good stuff, bearing in mind you live in a country where more members of the law enforcement agencies are are killed by friendly fire than by villains.
Tell me, was it a mentally challenged person who filled the test tube that produced you?
AW.

25 May 2002, 03:44

GarBy

AW...in my opinion, your attitude, and those that follow your line of thinking, is one of the primary reasons that most of the problems occur with folks on the lower level of the social-economic scale. You find that, due to previous infractions committed by those in-charge, that these individuals are therefore somehow justified in their actions and bear no responsibility. This only drives a wedge further into the gap between the groups. EVERYONE, regardless of any color, race or religon, should be held accountable for their actions....and at the present time that is, quite simply, not the case. To be perfectly frank about the situation(s) in Africa, the only difference in the modern day (read black) rulers and those of yesterday....are their weapons. Please think harder next time before you immediately put the blame on everybody other than those responsible for the actual infractions.....your over-generalizations are no better than the group(s) you peviously mentioned. Gary.

25 May 2002, 03:49

Mike Smith

No! That is not the case at all. I can no more change what happened in africa 100 years ago than you can. We cant change the injustices of history there, here, or in europe. You can never go back only ahead. I dont see how perpetuating injustice makes anything right. There is right and wrong period. The poor bastards who are having their farms taken are just as much victims as those of the past. They didnt steal the land any more than you or I did. What you fail to realize is that in the end it is still about money and power. Ill bet that the majority of the land ends up in the hands of a very few. Mugabes friends will profit nicely but the masses will end up with nothing like usual. I dont see how you could possibly think there is any justice in this. As far as native americans go I know alot more about that than you will ever know.
My family history is quite clear on what was done to my ancestors. Perhaps you would think it right for us to go steal the land back. Two wrongs dont make a right.

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Happiness is a warm gun

25 May 2002, 04:02

m1carbine

AW your comparison of Africa to America is interesting. But as one who has lived in America my whole life and has grown up in a post civil rights era, I would have to say that your view is flawed. Most of the people that I know who "play the race card" only do so because they are not willing to work hard for something. Or have some other motive, such as revenge.

You mentioned Native Americans, now if the blacks in southern Africa were smart they would build casinos and make lots of money in a simple legal fashion. They could sell tourism items and countless other items. What is truly apparent is that robbin bob lacks imagination. I wouldnï¿½t have too much of a problem with the state repossessing all the farms the in Zimbabwe if they actually compensated the owners.

Again there are countless other ways that he could have accomplished the same thing but in a legal and ethical way. I donï¿½t think Mugabe knows the meaning of the words ethics.

Ray

25 May 2002, 04:26

GeorgeS

AW,
The "leaders" of post-colonial Africa haven't done much for their people, have they?
They don't build roads, schools, railroads, power plants, factories, or water works.
These were either built by the colonial power, the former white regimes, corporations, or by donor countries.
Huge amounts of foreign aid were stolen by Comrade Bob and his Marxist cronies.
Comrade Bob didn't do ANYTHING for the war vets until his own grip on power was being threatened. In 1997, he sent the police to crush peaceful protests by those same war vets (I was in Zim at the time).

Of course, we feel a kinship for the whites in Africa. They are a reminder of our own pioneer past; European immigrants came to the U.S. and built the most powerful nation on earth out of the wilderness by the force of their will.

You haven't established any bona fides here, and by your contemptuous manner, I suspect you are just another anti-hunting troll.

George

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"Shoot straight, shoot often, but by all means, use enough gun!"

25 May 2002, 04:31

<AW>

Garby,
What .... ugh... yuk!!
AW.

25 May 2002, 04:37

Zero Drift

GarBy, Mike, Ray, George - Good posts.

This is a problem of perception and understanding. Everyone wants to believe in the myth that the African land was stolen from the African blacks. This comes largely from a total ignorance of African history. Somehow, everyone seems to think that Africa was totally black and that no white race has ever had any legal claim to the land. If this were true, then man needs to immediately turn over all properties, wealth, and holdings to the apes. After all, they were clearly here well before Homo sapiens came on the scene.

Unfortunately, most folks run around in a state of ignorance and denial. The cold, hard facts are difficult for many to face. AW, if you want to believe that African blacks have been enslaved by the white man, go ahead. If you want to believe that whites have no claim to the land in Africa, go ahead. However, history clearly demonstrates you are quite wrong.

My interest in and defense of Africa is not about hunting. It is about people. I have many friends both white and black in Southern Africa who have faced oppression, racism, and injustice. Two acquaintances were murdered in Zimbabwe defending their homes and their rightful property. Their murders were identified but not prosecuted. Two Zulu trackers whom I hunted with in 1990 were murdered by ANC types while defending farms outside of Joï¿½burg. Again, no prosecution.

AW, I fully realize than nothing that I am going to say will change your mind. My only hope is to challenge you enough so that you will pick up a history book and read for yourself. To ensure you are getting the whole truth, I suggest that you read many books on the subject. Learn the facts before you open your mouth, it makes you appear more intelligent. And BTW, your amateurish jabs have not consequence with me.

[This message has been edited by Zero Drift (edited 05-24-2002).]

25 May 2002, 04:44

<AW>

You haven't established any bona fides here, and by your contemptuous manner, I suspect you are just another anti-hunting troll.

George

[/B][/QUOTE]

George,
What pioneer past?
Anti hunting troll? You must be kidding my friend,but then unlike you and your friends I do not suffer from hot air.
No, Mugabe has done a lot for his people , all he wants is to get back what is rightfully his, and his people's.
I actually support ZanuPF and have recently taken out full membership of this great political party. My membership subs are paid for the year.
The rest of the world should learn from Mr. Mugabe, ie.. the native Indians from North America, the Aboriginals from Aus and the Maoris.
As a white person, I am ashamed of my race.
AW.

25 May 2002, 04:48

<AW>

[QUOTE]Originally posted by GarBy:
[B]AW...in my opinion, your attitude, and those that follow your line of thinking, is one of the primary reasons that most of the problems occur with folks on the lower level of the social-economic scale.

Garby,
Your transparent attempt at snobbery is pathetic. Please try again , this time please extract your mindless little head from your rectum.
AW.

25 May 2002, 05:34

Zero Drift

AW - You cannot be serious. I have spent a lot of time in Zimbabwe. Apparently you have not. To say that Mugabe has done a lot for his people is laughable and the most ignorant comment you have made (to date).

The country is in ruins. Millions of his loyal blacks will soon be facing starvation. Zimbabwe was once considered the bread basket of Africa because of its farm production - farm production that does not exist today. Disease of all forms is rampant. There is little medical help in the country. There is no immunization. The military cannot afford the most basic spare parts. Few government employees are bing paid today. None of the war vets have been compensated nor are receiving welfare as Mugabe promised when elected. The police are out of control and have broken down into regional rivalry. Formal education is non-existent. Infrastructure is circa 1974 - the date that the present government assumed power. International business has pulled out of the country. No new international investments are forthcoming. If you had the money to afford a car, there is no petrol to run it. The Zimbabwe dollar which was once powerful is valueless - both in-country and out. The airport suffers from numerous power outages every day. And Black on Black crime is horrendous. The Zimbabwe economy is now in the same class as Rwanda & Burundi. Zambia has even closed its boarder to keep starving Zim refugees out of their country.

No, the only person in the country that is better off since ï¿½independenceï¿½ is Mugabe. And thanks to mis-informed folks like you, he will continue to laugh as his people die in the streets. All he has accomplished is to continue to prove that Black Africa is incapable of productive self-rule. Yea, Mugabe is a great guy and you are a total turd for even suggesting he has done anything positive for his country or African blacks. I am incensed that a once productive country has been turned into another African cesspool and all of us sat by and watched it happen.

Get an education child.

25 May 2002, 05:51

GeorgeS

Well, AW, your membership in ZANU-PF explains your statements.

You're a Marxist (or a sympathizer). You feel Marxists can do no wrong. History has shown us how well Marxism works.

The two "real" Marxist states left (North Korea, Cuba) are economic basket cases. China only works because they allow capitalism.

All the rest of the nations run by Marxist or re-labeled Marxists rely on massive foreign aid, and/or permit some sectors of the economy to operate without government interference.

Mugabe has unleashed his Fifth Brigade on black Zimbabweans in the past; his police on trade unionists; and his ZANU-PF thugs and war vets on white Zimbabweans (do you agree that they are Zimbabweans, or do you also consider them "settlers"?).

In over twenty years of "leadership", he has enriched himself and his cronies while allowing his people and economy to suffer.

Donor countries no longer give Zim cash for projects; they manage the projects directly.
Is that because they're racists, or because they've seen that their direct aid vanished into the private coffers of ZANU-PF elite?

Power in Harare was turned off during the day; water service was unreliable. The unemployment was 50% in 1999, and I doubt it has gotten better.

The more ZANU-PF squeezes, the more its people suffer. If all the commercial farms are seized, who will feed the people of Zimbabwe?

They have gone from an exporter of food, to the brink of famine. Whose fault is that?

BTW, when and where did you hunt? Have you ever set foot in Zimbabwe? Have you spoken with the people of Zimbabwe (without ZANU-PF chaperones)?

I have, and their tale of woe and privation cannot help but turn your stomach.

As for our pioneer past, do you think the native Americans (who migrated from Asia thousands of years ago) developed this country? Was it paved and built when the English, Dutch, Spanish, and French arrived?

How do you think this land was opened up? Was it opened by effete intellectuals who opine and pontificate, or by hardy people willing to risk everything to make a better life for themselves?

This was the same reason many whites went to Africa 100 or more years ago.

It doesn't surprise me that you just "popped up" out of nowhere. We have anti-hunting trolls do so from time to time.

Welcome to AR. Now, bugger off!

George

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"Shoot straight, shoot often, but by all means, use enough gun!"

25 May 2002, 05:55

<AW>

Zero Drift,
Who's the child?
Anyone with half a brain would see this as a wind up miles off!!
Thanks for the laugh!!
AW.

25 May 2002, 05:58

<AW>

GeorgeS,
What can I say?? Nothing really.......
AW.

25 May 2002, 06:12

jorge

Gents IGNORE this AW idiot. The facts speak for themselves. Zimbabwe went from the "breadbasket" of central Africa to near starvation today, thanks to Mugabe. The decline of Zimbabwe since "independence" has been precipitous. By virtually every measure of effectiveness one cares to use, Zimbabweans were much better of 20 years ago than today. But like I've posted before, in 20 years or so, only the animals will be left as the whole continent south of the Sahara anyway, AIDS will take care of the problem for us. Remember, this is a place where the WHEEL was unkown until europeans introduced it in the 16th century.

25 May 2002, 06:38

Zero Drift

AW - All of us here have clearly, concisely, and I might boast quite elegantly shown your statements as false. And all you can respond with are feeble retorts like ï¿½Whoï¿½s the childï¿½, ï¿½Thanks for the laughï¿½, ï¿½What can I sayï¿½, ï¿½I am ashamed of my raceï¿½. Shit child, I was really hoping for a more intellectual banter than this on a slow Friday. Donï¿½t you have any really intelligent thoughts? Canï¿½t you dig down and pull out something really original? Could you quote some rudimentary facts that could some how be twisted into supporting your position? Maybe some good ole Communist/Marxist rhetoric? Anything other than ï¿½Whoï¿½s the childï¿½?

Now I am forced to surf the web for a more enlightened, intellectual, and suitable foe. Your unable to carry on a simple discussion. I guess that makes you the pride of public education in the UK. When you get into 9th grade, take some history courses.

Alas, you bore me.

25 May 2002, 07:08

<Mike Brown>

Guys, this P.O.S. POM is baiting you. I suspect he`s flogging it while he reads the replys you post.
On the other hand, if he should actually be something other than an instigator, his political affiliations speak for themselves.
Either way AW, I would`nt piss on you if you were wearing one of Mugabes "Goodyear Necklaces" and were on fire.
Get your head out of your ass, learn to read, learn to listen to folks that are clearly your superiors, and maybe, just maybe, even with your 'room temperature IQ', you will someday be able to carry on a debate in an objective and rational manner.
Oh, and as for the Blacks, please tell me who it was that sold them into slavery? You don`t know, do you? Well, it was their OWN black "Bruthas", you moron.
The Maoris in Zew Zealand were there how long before the whiteman showed up? Hmmm? What DO you know? In the time between the arrival of the so-called "Natives", and the arrival of white man, the clock only turned a few times. Look it up and learn something.
Careful... They say you`ll go blind if you keep that up.