This is a question I have analysed a lot over the years.

I know there are many hunters (not professionals but people with day jobs who hunt as a hobby / recreation) who have shot a lot of game - even hundreds. Some of the hunting might be from vehicles, tree stands, ground blinds, walk and shoot by chance, spot & stalk etc. Some of it might be guided and others might be DIY or with a buddy.

I wonder how many of them have real bush craft. Can they instinctively know wind direction, animal habits at times of day, aware of weather impact, know their quarry's food preferences, walk silently, have good hearing & sense of smell in the bush that helps them in the hunt etc.???

Can they plan a walk and search based on terrain, wind, water source, quarry habits etc. ??

Can they spot game well in the bush? Can they track game? Can they read body language of the game?

I realise that these are the main reasons why one uses a PH or a guide when hunting new countries or regions. That bush craft experience is vital.

Most hunters would probably be interested in bush craft to some degree. At least enough skill to build a fire, navigate, butcher an animal, and build a crude overnight shelter. Maybe not so much advanced bush craft such as flint knapping and hide tanning.

My thought is most hunters will have pretty good bush skills from their home area.

My skills as someone from MN are probably better than most from GA or FL in dealing with cold weather. Not as good with heat and jungle type terrain.

I probably do Ok with whitetail and duck, not so good with mule deer, pronghorn or bear. What I know about African animals is largely book learning with a bit passed on by PH's.

What I am trying to say is that there are different skill sets based on where and what you hunt, and while a bit will transfer (wind awareness, fire building, field dressing) a lot will not- like animal ID and habits.

The skills are not mutually exclusive, but rather a learned skill set that one picks up by doing. I don't know anyone who is skilled in bushcraft who is not a good Hunter in that locale, but I do think there are more than a few accomplished international hunters who are not particularly good with bushcraft as they depend on their guide and trackers to provide this skill.

I think there are lots of hunters who live in cities who are not very well versed in bush craft.

I know, many of us take this for granted - have some knowledge and the desire to learn about our surroundings in the wild.

But many are either not interested, or actually have no desire at all.

Thanks for the honest and relevant responses.

I saw the recent post about the researcher who was killed and just wondered about the issue. It is so sad and it is likely that she had excellent bush skills.

I have to agree with Saeed, many are just hunters who depend on their guide to take care of things which is unfortunate. I see the whole experience as an integral part of the hunting experience.

I personally believe where you hunt makes a difference too. Where I live and go to hunt camping and getting by in a wilderness teaches many of the bushcraft skills. I also do a lot of hiking and fishing in the mountains before the season. For me bushcraft is just part of the fun.

As a South African that had grandfathers and uncles on bushveld farms and where I had the opportunity to hunt solo on most hunts, I believe I can help myself in this environment.

But if you want to see a mess, drop me off in the Canada or The Rockies where there is a lot of snow and pine trees.

First post here on AR.

I concur with some of the comments above (I am a big fan of cordage), bushcraft when developed is quite local. The required tools and skills as well as hunting technique can vary dramatically depending upon where you are. Caribou in the barren grounds of the NWT demand a very different level of preparedness and awareness than hunting whitetails west of town on a quarter section (160 acres) where you can't go more than 1/2 mile and not hit a fence.

When I have gone someplace new to hunt I find it interesting how different bushcraft and hunting techniques are. A good guide or PH is so valuable as one can buy their knowledge and experience as opposed to having to earn it over a long period of time. I have also learned to ask lost of questions then shut up and listen when hunting in a new area as there is always a ton to learn.

This April / May I was able to experience impala rutting, I had no idea how noisy they were and would have never thought that it was they how were making all the noise.

All the best GRF

To be a consistently successful hunter without a guide or PH, you have to have a decent amount of 'bushcraft'

Wind direction? goes without saying you get to hunt longer with the wind at your back.

Shooting from truck? essentially illegal in much if not all of US

Treestands? Animal habits? How else do you know where to hang the stand and when to hunt it?

Walk silently? that one is a bit tougher for many as it is tougher to be quiet in the woods when you are 50# overweight.

Spot game? yes, if they are successful

Track game? A lost art in the US for most. Wounded game, different matter, many can.

My love of the outdoors began in Boy Scouts many, many years ago. There I was taught basic skills that formed the foundation of a lifetime of hunting around the world. I did a fair amount of solo alpine hunting in the Cascades and the Brooks Range and always felt safer there than on the streets of Seattle.

Unlike many outdoorsmen/women I never had a good sense of direction. That led me to become skilled with map, compass and altimeter. I was never lost. (knock, knock)

God Bless BSA!
Brice

Vegetarian - Old indian word for "lousy hunter".

[QUOTE]Originally posted by crbutler:
My thought is most hunters will have pretty good bush skills from their home area./QUOTE]

I would have to agree.

I grew up hunting in the West, primarily Montana and Wyoming.

I have learned a lot from other places I have hunted, some was similar tactics some was not.

Namibia was very much like hunting pronghorn antelope, you drive, you spot, you stalk.

Hunting roe deer in Germany was totally new to me, I was used to killing animals at least partially with my feet. I learned patience, and how to step, glass, step glass. That's how it's done and it worked for us. I actually applied the same concept to hunting elk in Wyoming in the black timber. It would have worked for me if I'd have had more time to hunt the timber. I was able to stalk within a 50 yards of several herds but never found a legal bull.

On that same note, I am not much of a stand hunter people that can tolerate the sit will do much better than I can. I personally don't have the patience for it. This bit me in the ass in Germany after pigs.

A lot of what I learned in Germany I applied on Sambar in Australia, and it worked well. Just didn't find a mature bull so I didn't shoot one.

A guy I work with from Texas (I won't call him a friend) spent his entire time in Australia trying to use corn on sambar, fallow deer and red deer. The deer were not used to it, so it had zero effect. At least in the time he hunted there.

The typical Safari style or Wyoming antelope style hunts he couldn't get the hang of. He also couldn't handle the roe deer sneaky stalking method either. He was a stand corn hunter through and through.

When I was a kid my dad guided a lot of elk hunters from back east. These were guys that lived in deer stands, and wanted to employ the same tactics on elk. I guess it could work if you were someplace where there were tons of elk and it was mostly private land. Or there wasn't much water, which is a common method to hunt in Arizona and New Mexico. The idea being that you sit a water hole and wait for the elk to come in. Not a bad method, just doesn't work in the Northern Rockies as water isn't a problem.

Honestly I am kind of hooked on roe deer and sambar deer. The same basic methods can be employed on either species to good effect and they are a blast to hunt.

You know I was typing out a post on this topic and stopped and reread it. I was thinking about how hunters have changed over the last 50 years that I have been in the bush, from a general local perspective with fellow resident hunters and as an outfitter/guide with clients.

I had to delete my post because it was really negative. Not that what I had typed was not true from my experience, but that most hunters would not want to hear it.

So all I am going to say is that in days gone by many hunters had a certain level of bush craft skills, relative to where they came from and what sort of hunting they did. That level has been decreasing steadily and really taken a downhill plunge over the last couple of decades.

Today there are far too many that require someone else to do the basics for them, because they really do not know how to do it and who could not find their ass with both hands..... ah, I mean GPS.

We all can continue to learn from others. No one knows it all. But when the desire to learn, actually learn how to dig down, get the hands dirty, put up with some hardships is gone..... well I will leave it at that.

Short answer no.

Theres a saying that applies to whitetail hunting. 10% of the hunters kill 90% of the deer.
If you take away the guide aspect this would probably apply across a broad range of the hunting world.

The rest probably have skill sliding down to some who for whatever reason have almost none.

I just realised that for every member here on AR posting on this thread there are probably 100,000 hunters out there in the bush hunting their local areas.

I suspect a large number of them have reasonable bush craft / skills.

Here in NZ, we have the Deer Stalkers association with veterans and young guys. Some women too.

I have hunted with probably 30 different people here over the last 22 years and you get a full spectrum. You always pick up new tricks around camp or about gun care or how to keep boots dry etc.

I remember 40+ years ago a friend in school (in India which is hot) told me that the tramps in the UK covered themselves with newspaper because it kept them warmer than a blanket! I then found out that Newspaper is a great insulator & very useful on a camping / hunting trip. I started carrying newspaper in my pack.

I have been rained on with pack & sleeping bag wet - the newspaper saved the day & the trip.

Boots & socks wet from the day in the bush - dew, stream crossing etc. - stuff newspaper in the boots and put them upside down near the hut fire (our NZ huts are very basic and very small) - dry boots in the morning!

Always keen to learn new ideas of making life easier or more successful on a hunt.

It's acquired skill. Just like anything else, if you enjoy it, you will learn by observing others ( humans and the animals )
And of course, there is many levels.
Even being guided, you will learn and nothing wrong by being guided. Most of countries will simply prohibit non residents from hunting on their own and it has plenty to do with money.
Yes, times change but not always for worse

From those many I've hunted with since the mid fifties, very few even had any sense of direction let alone know anything about being out in the hills n woods. It's no wonder so many get lost out there.

Mighty few ever learned how to read a map or use a compass. Guess I'm in the same fix as I have never even looked at a GPS except in Sis's car and she got lost even with that thing!!

George

My learning curve with hunting has been a bit strange.

Started in India with watching wildlife in national parks and remote wilderness as a kid. Rrdiving in a jeep with dad or on elephant back. Occasional walks when I was a teenager.

All my hunting in India for deer & pigs was usually with other locals including villagers. Some of it was beat shooting and some was spot lighting. Si I had little bush skills and depended entirely on the locals who were totally at hone in that environment. I had no clue where I was most of the time!

When I came to NZ in my mid 30s and started hunting - it was totally different. The hills were steep and the gullies were small & the bush was dense but no thorns. It was wet!

We walked in or flew in by chopper and we hunted far away from other people & farms or roads. My first hunt was with another person along side me. The second one was with a group flying into a hut & then hunting individually. I had a map & a compass and plodded my way through it. I was at the most 2 km from camp and half a KM from the river. So I could not get lost. Yet there were many times that I thought I was 5 km from camp or more! I still got on to deer and had one at less than 5 meters in the bush but I could not get a shot!

Very quickly I got the confidence to range out from camp. in 1996 I got a GPS (the Desert storm model from Eagle that came out into the market for US$400). That just opened up a new world for me. I now dared to cross ridges, catchments and streams. I learned very quickly to navigate with both map & GPS (& compass of course).

"I have never been lost, a might confused for a month or two -yes"

American Mountan man

have see this attributed to both Jim Bridger and Kit Carson.

I have seen it attributed to Carson most often.

I hate GPS's with a passion.


The way a person learns is to spend as much time in the field as possible, whether it be to find one's way around or understand game movement.

I'll be damned...I had always thought it was a documented Jim Bridger quote.

Don't see the point of hunting unless you learn as much as you can about the species you hunt, where they live, the other non-game species that live there, the people that live there, the history of the region, etc. That's why my library continues to grow.

Not to mention how to build a fire or navigate.

quote:

I had always thought it was a documented Jim Bridger quote.

Lane I have seen it attributed to Daniel Boone.

Any of you ever get the chance and are close to Pinedale Wyoming, stop in at the Mountain Man Museum, it is worth the time and price of admission.

quote:

Don't see the point of hunting unless you learn as much as you can about the species you hunt, where they live, the other non-game species that live there, the people that live there, the history of the region, etc. That's why my library continues to grow.

That is why I hunt. I enjoy shooting whatever it is I am after, but there is a lot more to it then just the kill.

One of the biggest problems I see concerning todays hunters, is that they are not good amateur naturalists.

That is one of the aspects about Theodore Roosevelt I find most interesting, he was an excellent naturalist, he knew about the animals he hunted.

Too many of todays hunters are worried about time and scores, they don't really put time into learning about the animals they are hunting, those animals habits or the habitat they live in.

quote:

Originally posted by Nakihunter:
I saw the recent post about the researcher who was killed and just wondered about the issue.
It is so sad and it is likely that she had excellent bush skills.

I don't know about her bush skills, but we do now know that she had insufficient situational awareness,
and maybe some lack in precautionary commonsense.

She travelled to Zambia to research reptiles and apparently was killed by bull ele in 'musth'

Had the researchers opted for rangers to accompany and watch over them, while they studied their lizards,
the tragedy may well have been avoided.

She may well have observed the elephant before the charge, but not have known how to indetify & understand
the risks of being around a secreting bull.

Crazy has a very valid point. I don't carry a tape on any hunt. Not one of my trophies has ever been measured.