I have two contradictory offers from Zim

One outfitter says he can offer a PAC on communal land, but not a management (rations) hunt of any kind any place.

The other outfitter says PAC are not available to foreign hunters, but he is OK doing a management (rations) hunt in a Safari area. Only question regarding the latter is the price. Parks is apparently "negotiating" with the operators.

Don't ask me the name of the outfitters, that's a red herring and I don't want to stir up anything. I just want to know what the real deal is? PAC season is around the corner.

Hi Russ

As far as I know PAC done by foriegn paying clients is illegal. The "management quota" is likely to come about however as you were told the price that parks are wanting per elephant is still been negotiated. We are not selling any PAC and are not taking deposits for management elephant until prices are finalised.

If management eles happen it will only be in Safari areas and not communial areas. Hope that helps. Remember that things change from day to day in Zim though! Cheers Buzz

Things don't change nearly enough in Zim Buzz.

Is there some method to the madness? I mean, if PAC has to be dealt with, what is the logic for declining $7500 for the privilege of pulling the trigger? Too dangerous perhaps? What position are the operators taking?

Russ

It does seem crazy too loose us$7500 plus per PAC, the problem was though that there were some unscrupulous PHs that were killing trophy bulls as PAC.

As and when "management" quotas come we are pushing for them to be ONLY cows for the very same reason.

I just got an email from Butch Manasse Outdoor Adventures adverstising Zimbabwe PAC elephant hunts for $ 7,495. He even says this wonderful PH might be able to get you more than one PAC on a hunt, including some nighttime shooting of crop raiding elephants.

Who is right? Who is wrong? Does it matter in Zimbabwe?

ZIMBABWE: PAC ELEPHANT, LEOPARD, SABLE & PLAINS GAME Hunt # 88



This PH is a wonderfully experienced guy with hundreds of elephant kills to his credit, taken over a long and successful career as a PH. He guided several of our clients last year and our clients simply loved him. After several very successful elephant and other game hunts, we have made arrangements thru him to offer our clients a total of TEN (10) PAC elephants huntable for 2011. Out last two clients have both indicated they will re-book with him, one for 2011, the other for 2012. PLEASE NOTE: WE ONLY HAVE A QUOTA OF 10 OF THESE! (ONLY 6 left as of 1/19!).





HE ALSO HAS SOME EXCELLENT LEOPARD, SABLE AND PLAINS GAME PACKAGES.




Elephant are in the area known as the Binga, just south of and also borders Lake Kariba and Hwange to the south. Butch has hunted the Binga for buffalo (successfully). It is a good area for elephant. It also has some excellent croc and hippo. Prime hunting times include Feb thru May.



The icing on this case is that we have also secured some incredibly good pricing with this extremely capable PH!! And it is possible to take more than one elephant! Elephant taken are normally bulls with tusks under 40 pounds. You will do night hunting for elephants rampaging local crops. You may also do spot and stalk if time and circumstances allow. The night hunts are relatively easy, but dicey and thrilling. The day time hunts require that you be in physically good condition; you can often walk 4 to 10 miles during the course of a long day of elephant chasing.



We also were able to arrange a wonderful price for these hunts: $7495!! This includes the elephant, 7 days of hunting ; your own PH, your trackers, and your food and accommodations. You will fly into Bulwayo Airport in Zimbabwe for pickup. No air charter - that saves big bucks! There is a vehicle transport fee which currently is $200 roundtrip.





Observers welcome at the modest rate of only $200 per day. Lodging is another big plus- you will be taken to a very upscale bed and breakfast, along the shores of Lake Kariba. It has its own swimming pool; its' rooms are en suite with full baths and you will be served very tasty food. You are likely to see crocs and hippos, so do be a bit careful when walking around!



Please be aware PAC elephants are not importable. You can take the usual trophy photos of course, and many taxidermists can make extremely realistic replica mounts, saving the big import and transport fees across the water. Or, we can possibly arrange for a professional filmmaker to accompany you at a price to be agreed upon between you and the videographer. That makes a great film and we have seen several great ones.



If you wish we can also arrange to add on an importable hippo or croc or for example a Cape Buffalo. Other game is also available including plains game. Plains game can include sable, waterbuck, kudu and much more. To add on an importable hippo will cost a trophy fee of $3500; same amount applies for an importable crocodile. Ask us if there are other options which you might want.



SPECIALS: ONE PAC ELEPHANT, 7 DAYS, 1x1, ONLY $7495.

Two elephants $13,995!!

One elephant plus either a hippo or a croc, 7 days ONLY $10,995

I am by no means an expert here, but I have been trying to research this for the past 6 months with PHs in Zim that have superb reputations. All that I have talked to "in the know" have said that as it stands now that PAC animals can only be shot by Zim residents - thus most are being shot by appie PHs. There will likely be some mgt eles available, but whether they will be bull or cows and the pricing has yet to be determined by the Zim Parks Dept. So anyone offering those hunts right now seem to be ahead of the game a little so to speak...I sure wouldn't book one at this point...

I am very pleased to see this thread. The PAC stuff in Zim really needs to get straightened out.

I got a call over the weekend from an agent friend of mine who doesn't do much africa stuff. He told me that he could get:

"Elephant PAC hunts for bulls on communal lands. 8 days, $8,000 all in. They can expect up to 50 pounds of ivory! And Tom, the kicker here is that if they want to pay another $9,000 then the bull will go from PAC to trophy and he can export it!!".

I said i was not interested. Talk about shady. Crap like that has to stop. The bad part is, this agent really has no idea that what he is selling is illegal or at the least, unethical. I told him to stay away from it.

I may be the odd man out here - but I actually think it's fine that PAC animals get shot by Apprentice PH's - how else are they to get experience with what things cost in Africa??

Probably better for the industry in the long run...


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quote:

As far as I know PAC done by foriegn paying clients is illegal

I have heard the above from very reliable sources many years ago.

Folks PAC hunts in Zimbabwe can only be undertaken by Zimbabwean Residents. Some operators mistakenly advertise Management Hunts as PAC and incorrectly offer them as such.

PAC animals are generally taken by , as a previous poster said, apprentice Hunters who need a certain number of certain species to be able to obtain their licences. This is a long standing way for Appies to get enough experience to get to profficiency.In addition, as Buzz correctly points out, there were a number of Trophy elephants taken under this guise in the past by dodgy operators, who in some cases, for a few extra dollars would "convert" The PAC animal to an exportable trophy.

Offering true PAC animals to foreign clients in Zimbabwe is Illegal .Some PHs may let foreign clients shoot PAC animals and obtain a few pics etc, however please please be aware that it could land you in hot water with the authorities if they find out.

quote:

Originally posted by zimFrosty:
Folks PAC hunts in Zimbabwe can only be undertaken by Zimbabwean Residents. Some operators mistakenly advertise Management Hunts as PAC and incorrectly offer them as such.

PAC animals are generally taken by , as a previous poster said, apprentice Hunters who need a certain number of certain species to be able to obtain their licences. This is a long standing way for Appies to get enough experience to get to profficiency.In addition, as Buzz correctly points out, there were a number of Trophy elephants taken under this guise in the past by dodgy operators, who in some cases, for a few extra dollars would "convert" The PAC animal to an exportable trophy.

Offering true PAC animals to foreign clients in Zimbabwe is Illegal .Some PHs may let foreign clients shoot PAC animals and obtain a few pics etc, however please please be aware that it could land you in hot water with the authorities if they find out.

Never have truer words been spoken!

American hunters should be especially careful about this!