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| One of Us |
I'm trying to decide whether I should book a PG hunt for 2009 now or wait for awhile. I have the opportunity to go with my first choice company for a hunt in Sept. 2009 in S. Africa. The reason I wonder about waiting is the economy here in the US. I can afford the hunt but I am wondering if I wait there will be better opportunities/cheaper prices. The price for the hunt is good but maybe things will get even better. I've read some other posts on the subject but I thought I would solicit some direct opinions. Should I buy now or wait for a while? | ||
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Now now now, You will never know what the current economical effect will have for us in SA the fuel prices could climb considerably again and people will have to push up daily rates again. If you book now you fix those prices. Chances that prices may go down is slim. Frederik Cocquyt I always try to use enough gun but then sometimes a brainshot works just as good. | |||
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I agree, go now. you never know what will happen in the future. Also I would recommend you try to make your first hunt include some DG as well. At least a cape buff and a cow elephant. In fact if money is tight, I would do ONLY a cape buff and a cow elephant. And If I had to pick only one it would be cow elephant. THERE IS NOTHING LIKE ELEPHANT HUNTING. NOTHING. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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NOW, hunting in Africa is not going to get cheaper and who nows what the outlook is for the dollar? | |||
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Gremlin My advice to first timers is to spend their money on experiencing Africa. The experience is going to be over a lot faster if you spend it on two expensive trophies vs enjoying a much longer safari and taking several plains game species. Also my second bit of advice is to speak to outfitters tell them what you are after and that your budget is tight. I cant vouch for everyone but there are a lot of us that will put together special packages to help people get out and experience what we all love so much. Remember, of you don't ask you don't get. How flexible are your dates, this flexibility could end up being an excellent bargaining chip in securing you the best hunting for your money too. Good luck Ian | |||
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I would wait, If the stock market is still down when the conventions start there will be deals! Robert Johnson | |||
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It isn't just about money. The political climate may change or, heaven forbid, your health could deteriorate. Go while you can. Namibiahunter  . | |||
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Look at it this way, the sooner you hang those trophies on your wall, the longer you'll be able to enjoy them (and cherish the memories).... I don't necessarily see a choice between going "now or later". That is flawed and should be "now AND later". Just wait and see... Besides, I have never seen African hunting get any cheaper as time went by. - mike ********************* The rifle is a noble weapon... It entices its bearer into primeval forests, into mountains and deserts untenanted by man. - Horace Kephart | |||
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I suggest waiting. Based on what I am seeing and understand, we are all (worldwide) headed for a very severe economic downturn. Oil prices will hold at $80 (Opec will see to that), natural gas will drop to $4 or lower in the US, interest rates will climb as banks try to recover, the dollar will go back to par with the euro, the rand will go to 10 to 1 on the dollar, the Canadian dollar will drop to .75 on the dollar, the Kiwi dollar will drop to .45 on the dollar, the Russian bank system will collapse and they will likely flood the world markets with excess oil. Their stock market has already imploded (down 75%). The folks with money will hold onto it and not spend as they have over the past 5 years. All of that gloom and doom will lead to lower daily rates and lower trophy fees in non-trophy fee regulated countries (Namibia and RSA). Zim will get more negotiable than ever, Tanzania will hold for the time being but will see a marked decrease in demand for premium hunts, Zambia will follow Tanzania and Mozambique will likely follow Zimbabwe. I truly do not think we will see the bottom of this mess until 2009 or later. | |||
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What he said. THismess is going to get very messy indeed. Local game shooitng booking agents have been saying that they have not been affected all year by the financial crisis here in the UK. In the last 2 weeks thathas changed dramatically, and I have never seen so much discounted shooting. People are forgoing their deposits so as not to have to pay the balances, and driven grouse shooting is not only available but discounted by 30%. It was dead mans shoes for as long as I cuold remember with a waiting list as long as your arm. Other game shooting here is down in some cases by upto 50% on short notice. I don't see why safaris will be any different. The market in new and used guns has quietened off substantially here and people are really taking stock of their situations. We haven't got to the point where people are seling assets to stay afloat but I don't think it is far away. I'd wait a while longer and see what turns up, especially if the hunt cost is linked to the Rand. A lot can happen in two to three months and the markets still have a few point left in them that they can lose. Rgds, FB | |||
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I don't believe his question is about going now or later, but about timing his booking. I can't imagine the stock market recovering before Spring. If that is true, some good deals may be had after the conventions. But, if you already have the funds, why take the chance of missing the dates you want with the outfitter you want? If money was a primary concern, I'd book later. If the hunt itself is your primary concern, book it now. "There are worse memorials to a life well-lived than a pair of elephant tusks." Robert Ruark | |||
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Thanks to everyone for their replies. I have been trying to put this trip together for a couple of months. My hunting partner and I have tentative plans to go to Dallas SCI in Jan but the company I like has two openings for Sept. 2009 (I was previously told that they were booked up). I am looking at $3700 for 8 days and the following trophies: kudu, blue wildebeest, blesbok, impala and warthog. I can substitute a gemsbok for the kudu. I worry that the place will be booked before Jan and airfare will go up (about 1700 from Dulles to Jo'berg currently). My partner wants to wait a bit but I don't know if we are going to find something comparable for the price. The camp seems nice and has had nothing but good reviews on AR. This is my first safari and I have been trying to research things as much as possible. My partner thinks that it is a crap shoot anyway but I believe in getting as much info as I can before making the decision. Thanks again! | |||
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IF it is $3700 for the day rates AND the trophies listed, AND you are happy with your selection, go ahead and book it and get the dates you want. If you were looking at say a $15,000+ dangerous game + plainsgame hunt then perhaps there will be some significant discounts, but $3700 all-in is already a good price and a few hundred is not a reasonable trade-off for poor dates. Or, wait until Dallas and buy something there, otherwise if you have to travel those $'s would help fund the hunt. Good luck w/whatever you decide! | |||
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go now AND go again later!! and again -----and again ----   if you can afford this "addicting habit"" why stop?? the only thing stopping most of us from going continually is ---money  nothin sweeter than the smell of fresh blood on your hunting boots | |||
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I used to have similar debates with myself. Should I wait for business reasons, financial reasons, etc. Then, a good friend died of a heart attack at age 44, putting things more in perspective. One of my wife's favorite sayings is if you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans. Don't wait. You never know what the future holds. | |||
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Don't wait to go, but start negotiating now for a better bargain. The Safari industry is a luxury good and the demand for it will fall. The dollar has strenghened considerably against the Rand by 25% and oil prices are dropping. It will be a fantastic time to book ranch hunts in RSA and Namibia. Tribal conservancies and government safari areas will be slower to respond, but they will eventually get the message. STAY IN THE FIGHT! | |||
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I agree with Robert. It looks like the economy is going to be down for awhile. That should force more competitive pricing. There is a caveat however. How old are you? If you are over fifty, I wouldn't put it off. That's the mistake I made. I waited till my kids were out of college and now I am having some health problems that make it much harder. I am going to go anyway, hopefully within the next couple of years. Dave Dave DRSS Chapuis 9.3X74 Chapuis "Jungle" .375 FL Krieghoff 500/.416 NE Krieghoff 500 NE "Git as close as y can laddie an then git ten yards closer" "If the biggest, baddest animals on the planet are on the menu, and you'd rather pay a taxidermist than a mortician, consider the 500 NE as the last word in life insurance." Hornady Handbook of Cartridge Reloading (8th Edition). | |||
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Don't put off the hunt, but think about delaying the booking. Prices will drop over the next five months or so, at least. And they won't go up, so its almost no loose. But heed Bill C's advice too. JPK  Free 500grains | |||
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Are you interested in shopping or hunting? There will always be the possibility of better deals. It's like getting a cab at the airport, you can let this one go and hope the next one is nicer, or you can get in and get to your destination. If the price is right, you are comfortable with the outfitter and the dates are good, book it. Just my 2 cents TerryR | |||
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I think he is shopping for a hunt! Free 500grains | |||
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Who cares about the economy. I put off hunting in Africa way too long and had 3 heart attacks and then wasted 5 years trying to get better. I just came back and there isn't enough economy to stop me from going back again. The value of the experience is way beyond the dollar cost. I agree with the longer hunting time and doing both dangerous game and Plainsgame. Pick your dates now as that became a determining factor in who I was able to book as well. Book your flights now and pay for everything you can now and then you will have extra to add game to the list when you see that super trophy in the "bush". Frank | |||
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If you are an outfitter, did you drop prices as the price of oil feel the last 2 1/2 months. I doubt it. But when it goes back up it's an excuse to push the price up. If not an outfitter, then as a hunter did you get any e-mails saying, "fuel is down" we'll take"X" amount less for that road transfer, charter of the basic hunt. I doubt it. How many people got this kind of an email? | |||
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I think I should probabbly clarify things: come hell or high water I will be in RSA in 2009. The question is do I BOOK now or wait and see what prices are like in the next few months. What does everyone think of Sept in Limpopo? Is is too late in the season? | |||
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No, but in August when, on a whim, I sent an email to check if there was any elephant quota still available in Zim, the answer came back as a suprise. There was plenty, and it was discounted. I am sure that prices haven't risen since then and they're surely on the way down. I left to hunt on the 28th Sept with quota for six elephants, a bull and five tuskless, all arranged in late August at prices that I could not have gotten in, say, May. I had to return after one day hunting, due to an emergency. I went to reschedule and dropped three tuskless and added a another bull. I leave the 22nd with quota for two bulls and two tuskless. There hasn't been this kind of flexibility with available quota this late in the season and at the prices I'm seeing. If you aren't willing to negotiate, and don't try, you'll never get the best price. Posted prices are one thing, prices you pay are another. JPK Free 500grains | |||
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Go,that is it in a nut shell, 3700 dollars is not a whole lot of money. As for the Economy. Well, Its interesting to say the least, the guys that did this are the guys put in charge to fix it. Oh well, Its a correction, look the Congress forced the banks to do some stupid things, and in turn the Market is making the correction. While its painful, there is going to be some good things to come out of it, one houses well be houses again and not something to buy and flip in 30 days. Oil was never worth the 147 a barrel it was trading at, and its now making the correction. For ever boom there is a bust, while this one is a bust its by no means any different than any other bust in the history of mankind. This one will sort itself out when Congress and PM's just stop fooling with things they know nothing about. The Bankers are getting all the blame for this, and they never wanted to do what got them there in the first place. On the up side of this is that housing will become affordable again. And guess what, guys are still going to go hunting too. | |||
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I argree with you on late season offers, but my statement invloved fuel prices being the reason. I haven't seem any drop in charters and road transfers. That was my point. | |||
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Go now. Also, get as much as you can. In RSA, your PH should allow you to shoot a kuku AND a Gemsbok, provided you pay an additional trophy fee beyond the $3700. I first went to RSA in 2006 on a five animal package. I took 8 in seven days. I regret I did not go ten years sooner. Indy Life is short. Hunt hard. | |||
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Now, I am in the process of booking for south africa. we are going to hunt plains game. this will be my 60th birthday gift to myself. just wish i had the money to hunt everything i want to. would like to shoot everything africa has to offer. i read many of the posts and agree to go when you can. have friends that can not go because their health won't allow it, they waited too long and their health is such that they are afraid to go. | |||
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What you say may well be true. I haven't priced charter flights and don't need to pay transfers. I'd thought your reference to fuel prices and so transport prices going up was an allusion to the greater market for all things hunting. FWIW, our company raised its fuel surcharge when oil was spiking and gas and diesel prices as well, and we have not dropped the surcharge since then. JPK Free 500grains | |||
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Having been in the booking business for quite a number of years about all I can tell you is that it's a crap shoot anyway you look at it..Some are saying the economy is going to dump and say wait!, the next guy says go now before its too late..The truth is nobody has a clue and it all guess and by gosh! If I were you I'd just go! you have a good deal and no matter what the economy does your particular deal isn't going to get much better or worse, the difference would be zilch IMO.... Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Thanks everyone, I am going to book it. I think $3700 is a good deal despite what may or may not be happening with the economy. | |||
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Good for you. I think it's a wise move to book it now. And if you can pay it Rand even better, now that the US dollar is worth 9.2 Rand. Namibiahunter . | |||
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