Anyone else see Andy Ross's Kalahari lion?
An obvious canned lion hunt but Andy Ross infers this is a purely wild lion hunt.

The hunt begins by driving thru a gated ares. Day one they just happen to find a track across the road. The PH, who claims to have shot 100 plus lions (all of them canned, I am quite sure) proclaims the lion to be a large male (as if there was any doubt??).

They "spot and stalk" this lion who doesn't seem to care that much that the "hunters" are close by.

I could go on and on, but this show was basically a huge pile BS. This was so non-fair chase it wasn't funny.

Anyone else see it?

I give up. Who is Andy Ross? also, let me guess. this was in the Kalahari( North West Province of RSA), bordering Bots and this "wild" lion just happened to wander into the area.

I saw it, piss poor excuse for a lion hunt....

Probably that De Klerk pratt who advertises in the African Hunting Gazette. 'Hunting Lions on foot in the Kalahari'.

I caught part of that show also.

What a disgrace to bowhunting, and hunting in general. Absolutely disgusting.

I will never understand why someone wants to kill a canned lion

quote:

Originally posted by Caracal:
I will never understand why someone wants to kill a canned lion

Because the canned lion can kill the hunter? Naw! So can a wild lion!



Because the hunter can 'only' afford a canned lion? Naw! There is not that much difference in the cost.




Because the hunter does not know the difference between a canned and a wild lion? Yeah! That must be it! He is to stupid to know the difference!

In good hunting.

Andrew McLaren

quote:

Originally posted by Andrew McLaren:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Caracal:
I will never understand why someone wants to kill a canned lion

Because the canned lion can kill the hunter? Naw! So can a wild lion!



Because the hunter can 'only' afford a canned lion? Naw! There is not that much difference in the cost.




Because the hunter does not know the difference between a canned and a wild lion? Yeah! That must be it! He is too stupid to know the difference!

NO ! NO ! NO ! it's 'cause they comes with a birth certificate.

I can almost see where one might go on a canned lion hunt, but I'll be buggered if I can understand why one would make and show a video of it to the hunting world.

He isn't the first to do a canned lion hunt for TV. I've watched several shows done with an outfit named Tamm Safaris that I believe were canned hunts.

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
I give up. Who is Andy Ross? also, let me guess. this was in the Kalahari( North West Province of RSA), bordering Bots and this "wild" lion just happened to wander into the area.

You sure you didn't see the show??

Maybe we should boycott the advertisers of crap like this. Muzzy Broadheads was one of the sponsors.

It's what you get for rock-n-roll (or country) bowhunters these days...

Now I know this is going to get me flamed, and I know it's Christmas Eve, but what is the rush in bowhunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powerered rifle?

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:
Now I know this is going to get me flamed, and I know it's Christmas Eve, but what is the rush in bowhunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powerered rifle?

here we go...

Chuck - Just curious??? What is the rush in gun hunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powered rifle? Seems one in the same to me??

This guy hunting so called "canned Lion", it's his choice. It's legal, so be it. Would I do it no. Would I film it for TV, no. To each his own. If you don't want to watch it, switch the channel. Am sure Rosie or Oprah are on somewhere??

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:
Now I know this is going to get me flamed, and I know it's Christmas Eve, but what is the rush in bowhunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powerered rifle?

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
Chuck - Just curious??? What is the rush in gun hunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powered rifle? Seems one in the same to me??

This guy hunting so called "canned Lion", it's his choice. It's legal, so be it. Would I do it no. Would I film it for TV, no. To each his own. If you don't want to watch it, switch the channel. Am sure Rosie or Oprah are on somewhere??

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:
Now I know this is going to get me flamed, and I know it's Christmas Eve, but what is the rush in bowhunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powerered rifle?

Larry,

The fact this guy infers it is a free chase lion is disgusting.

Prostitution is legal in Nevada, but that doesn't mean it is accepted by those who find it disgusting.

quote:

Originally posted by John S:
He isn't the first to do a canned lion hunt for TV. I've watched several shows done with an outfit named Tamm Safaris that I believe were canned hunts.

canned lion hunts with Tam Safaris appear regularly on all the hunting channels- and they are always presented as free range hunts. they are right- the lions are recently freed from their cage, after they have a shampoo and blow dry.

quote:

Originally posted by Antlers:

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:
Now I know this is going to get me flamed, and I know it's Christmas Eve, but what is the rush in bowhunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powerered rifle?

here we go...

lol!

Just watched that hunt and maybe that Ph was blowing all hot air. Ross does not know that was a canned lion? But the pic at the end of the show simba looked pristine. Not a mark on him.

Mike

wonder who his hair stylist was? and his plastic surgeon?

Peggy wish you all....

I have nothing against "canned" or "put and take" lion hunting along as they are upfront about the method. This show in question should explain it and it's conservation value at the beginning of the program. The fact they are trying to pass it off as a wild lion is the disgusting part.

P.S. You are a wierd guy Peggy.

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:
Now I know this is going to get me flamed, and I know it's Christmas Eve, but what is the rush in bowhunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powerered rifle?

Totally agree. I love bow hunting and have been hunting with a bow since 1984. It's a lot of fun, it's challenging, and you really work for your game. However, I don't know why people feel any challenge doing this type of DG hunts... that is, bowhunting DG with a rifle backup. There is zero danger involved. The lion has no chance. It's like kicking your 4th grade bully when you have three seventh graders standing behind you, backing you up. It feels great, but...

Saying the above, there may be safety regulations that require one to have a rifle back up for these type of archery hunts. If so, such is the deal. I would then just cut out the middle man and use a rifle.

As for the canned hunt aspects of the show, I cannot comment directly. I didn't see the show and I don't know all of the details.

quote:

Originally posted by Sherrill Philip Neese:

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:
Now I know this is going to get me flamed, and I know it's Christmas Eve, but what is the rush in bowhunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powerered rifle?

I don't know why people feel any challenge doing this type of DG hunts... that is, bowhunting DG with a rifle backup.

It's like kicking your 4th grade bully when you have three seventh graders standing behind you, backing you up. It feels great, but...

there may be safety regulations that require one to have a rifle back up for these type of archery hunts. If so, such is the deal. I would then just cut out the middle man and use a rifle.

Perfectly summed up!!

To me, bowhunting DG with a rifle back up is trying to pretend you've done something that you really haven't done, namely exposing yourself to the dangers of the hunt while relying on your hunting prowess with the primitive weapon and no others.

quote:

Originally posted by BigBoreCore:
I have nothing against "canned" or "put and take" lion hunting along as they are upfront about the method. This show in question should explain it and it's conservation value at the beginning of the program. The fact they are trying to pass it off as a wild lion is the disgusting part.

P.S. You are a wierd guy Peggy.

Precisely!

Shoot whatever takes your fancy, as long as it is legal in that country.

But don't try to pass it on as something else.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by Sherrill Philip Neese:

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:
Now I know this is going to get me flamed, and I know it's Christmas Eve, but what is the rush in bowhunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powerered rifle?

I don't know why people feel any challenge doing this type of DG hunts... that is, bowhunting DG with a rifle backup.

It's like kicking your 4th grade bully when you have three seventh graders standing behind you, backing you up. It feels great, but...

there may be safety regulations that require one to have a rifle back up for these type of archery hunts. If so, such is the deal. I would then just cut out the middle man and use a rifle.

Perfectly summed up!!

To me, bowhunting DG with a rifle back up is trying to pretend you've done something that you really haven't done, namely exposing yourself to the dangers of the hunt while relying on your hunting prowess with the primitive weapon and no others.

Ya'll let the rest of us know how it works out convincing the authorities to let you break the law and hunt lion without a rifle backup. or better yet how well your PH goes with him NOT carrying a rifle as he guides you.

troy

quote:

Originally posted by DTala:

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by Sherrill Philip Neese:

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:
Now I know this is going to get me flamed, and I know it's Christmas Eve, but what is the rush in bowhunting DG when your guide or buddy is backing you up with a high powerered rifle?

I don't know why people feel any challenge doing this type of DG hunts... that is, bowhunting DG with a rifle backup.

It's like kicking your 4th grade bully when you have three seventh graders standing behind you, backing you up. It feels great, but...

there may be safety regulations that require one to have a rifle back up for these type of archery hunts. If so, such is the deal. I would then just cut out the middle man and use a rifle.

Perfectly summed up!!

To me, bowhunting DG with a rifle back up is trying to pretend you've done something that you really haven't done, namely exposing yourself to the dangers of the hunt while relying on your hunting prowess with the primitive weapon and no others.

Ya'll let the rest of us know how it works out convincing the authorities to let you break the law and hunt lion without a rifle backup. or better yet how well your PH goes with him NOT carrying a rifle as he guides you.

troy

That comment missed the point.

All I was trying to point out was: Bowhunting DG with a rifle backup is exactly the same as rifle hunting DG with a rifle backup. The hunters weapon may be different, but the backup is still the same. So, as a hunter, choose whatever weapon you prefer that is legal and go hunt. Geez, is that really that hard to understand?

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

Excellent point, Larry.

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
All I was trying to point out was: Bowhunting DG with a rifle backup is exactly the same as rifle hunting DG with a rifle backup. The hunters weapon may be different, but the backup is still the same. So, as a hunter, choose whatever weapon you prefer that is legal and go hunt. Geez, is that really that hard to understand?

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

That was my point too Larry, I just didn't make it as well. It's no less or more dangerous (or valid) than rifle hunting on a dangerous game hunt, particularly if you get in close.

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
All I was trying to point out was: Bowhunting DG with a rifle backup is exactly the same as rifle hunting DG with a rifle backup. The hunters weapon may be different, but the backup is still the same. So, as a hunter, choose whatever weapon you prefer that is legal and go hunt. Geez, is that really that hard to understand?

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

It's no less or more dangerous (or valid) than rifle hunting on a dangerous game hunt, particularly if you get in close.

That's exactly the point. Archery hunting of DG with a rifle back up is no special achievement over and above rifle hunting of DG.

Hunting DG with a bow and rifle backup is no more dangerous than with a rifle? Really? Sorry, but that's just ignorant. How many DG bowhunts have you done? You are shooting at 20 yards or less and the animal will not drop instantly but run off to die (hopefully). It must be followed up on foot and if not dead finished at very close range with another arrow or by the PH if it doesn't charge first. The biggest reason it's far more dangerous is that you are placing your life in the hands of another person. There's a huge difference in the PH carrying the rifle and the PH and client both carrying. Put a bow in your hand and then follow up a wounded buffalo and see how tighly your sphincter closes. I promise you you'd feel alot less ansy if you were carrying your double.

quote:

Originally posted by Ken Moody:
Hunting DG with a bow and rifle backup is no more dangerous than with a rifle? Really? Sorry, but that's just ignorant. How many DG bowhunts have you done? You are shooting at 20 yards or less and the animal will not drop instantly but run off to die (hopefully). It must be followed up on foot and if not dead finished at very close range with another arrow or by the PH if it doesn't charge first. The biggest reason it's far more dangerous is that you are placing your life in the hands of another person. There's a huge difference in the PH carrying the rifle and the PH and client both carrying. Put a bow in your hand and then follow up a wounded buffalo and see how tighly your sphincter closes. I promise you you'd feel alot less ansy if you were carrying your double.

Give your PH a bow to back you up with and I'll agree with you ...

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:

quote:

Originally posted by Ken Moody:
Hunting DG with a bow and rifle backup is no more dangerous than with a rifle? Really? Sorry, but that's just ignorant. How many DG bowhunts have you done? You are shooting at 20 yards or less and the animal will not drop instantly but run off to die (hopefully). It must be followed up on foot and if not dead finished at very close range with another arrow or by the PH if it doesn't charge first. The biggest reason it's far more dangerous is that you are placing your life in the hands of another person. There's a huge difference in the PH carrying the rifle and the PH and client both carrying. Put a bow in your hand and then follow up a wounded buffalo and see how tighly your sphincter closes. I promise you you'd feel alot less ansy if you were carrying your double.

Give your PH a bow to back you up with and I'll agree with you ...

I don't bowhunt, but assuming the hunt is a fair chase hunt, how can bowhunting not be more dangerous? Ken's point is there is only one guy with a rifle. The only way your conclusion is right, Chuck, is if your rifle is no more effective than a bowhunter's arrow. Two guns are better than one, even if the client isn't close to being as good as a PH.

Made the horrible error of watching "Hunting with the Judge" this morning. Aside from the host not exactly being "camera friendly", it featured a canned lioness among other dubious hunts. Can't believe the Vs. network sees fit to air some of this crap.

That's exactly the point. You're trusting someone else to save you life if necessary. Who would do that? The proximity required to successfully shoot the animal with a bow makes it much more dangerous. There's a big difference in standing by your PH resting your rifle in a pair of shooting sticks and blazing away at 50 or 60 yards vs. crawling up to within 15 or 20 and waiting for a possible shot opportunity and hoping that if something happens your PH can stop the animal with one shot from his bolt gun. How many buffalo charges at close range are stopped with one shot? Only a fool would bowhunt without a proper backup and normally I would insist that a primary and backup PH be on the hunt in the event of a problem. The intent is not to get anyone killed but that possibility is certainly magnified when your backup options are limited to only one rifle.

Ok, ok, uncle I agree. I put the first and killing shot into my brown bear this fall at 13 yards (ranged after the fact), then went into the willows after him. The fact is if he had charged us, there would've been two of us shooting and that's clearly less dangerous (in most cases).

I fully support canned lion...it stops hunters comming on wild lion hunts that expect 100% sucess rate and MGM lions at the end of it

oh and did I mention Andy died of piosoned cocaine? Somebody with a nasty sece of humor piosoned a whole batch of cocane to zim...suprising who it killed

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

Prostitution is legal in Nevada, but that doesn't mean it is accepted by those who find it disgusting.

Prostitution legal in Nevada? That's very interesting!

Seriously, this could be a fantastic oportunity to prove the theory that legalising something can save it. The rhino situation could be resolved here....

We need to know if Nevada prostitutes are safer, healthier, more secure than those where it is illegal. Does legalising it take away the crime syndicate element? Pimps, the use of narcotics, what percentage of their income is "stolen" by these operators as against where it is illegal?

This is an excelent oportunity for a case study on whether legalising the rhino horn trade will save or destroy the rhino for ever....

Prostitution legal in Nevada? That's very interesting!

Don't know about the whole of Nevada but Vegas does boast of its "Chicken Farms"