I thought the answer was "no." But today I attended the Cleveland, Ohio Sort, Hunting and Outdoor show. there were about four outfitters from RSA and one from Namibia. One of the people from RSA claims that it is now possible to get CITES permits for elephants in Mozambique if you are an American. Anyone know anything about this?

Now to my knowledge you can get a cites export permit from Moz for elephant; that should be a true statement! However you cannot get a cites import permit from usfw...so it certainly would do you no good! Which is why US citizens do not elephants in moz! There's quite a few species you can get an export permit for yet you cannot bring to the USA. The person you talked to is absolutely wrong!

The long answer.....NNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. The short answer.....NO.

Brett

Comes under the heading of 'stricter domestic legislation'...Ausies cannot import tusks or leopard from Zim - Americans can.

Truth and logic don't have much to do with it...

quote:

Originally posted by Ganyana:
Comes under the heading of 'stricter domestic legislation'...Ausies cannot import tusks or leopard from Zim - Americans can.

Truth and logic don't have much to do with it...

Ausies can't import spotted cat, Rhino or Ele products from anywhere BUT we can import Lion. Go figure.

quote:

Originally posted by Ganyana:
Truth and logic don't have much to do with it...

+1

quote:

Originally posted by ozhunter:
Ausies can't import spotted cat, Rhino or Ele products from anywhere BUT we can import Lion. Go figure.

Until recently the lion was not widely regarded as endangered. Times have changed.

I wouldn't expect either of us to be able to import lions for too much longer.

But then, I never have been any good at reading tea leaves.

That's what I thought.

Rule #1: Book through a reputable agent (I use Atcheson's mostly).

Rule #2: Use a PH who is a citizen of the country where you are going to hunt.

quote:

Originally posted by Indy:
That's what I thought.

Rule #1: Book through a reputable agent (I use Atcheson's mostly).

Rule #2: Use a PH who is a citizen of the country where you are going to hunt.

Rule #2 is applicable only to certain geographical areas in Africa.
Assuming you were to go to Tanzania (example) you would therefore not hunt with Paddy Curtis or Mark Sullivan among others, as they are definitely NOT citizens of that country.

I believe the number was for six or seven eles this year.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by retreever:
I believe the number was for six or seven eles this year.

Mike

???? Do you mean that the USFW has agreed to issue import permits for elephants from MOZ?

I clearly remember that the did this for Zambia within the past year, but I don't recall anything like that with Mozambique.

quote:

Originally posted by Indy:
I thought the answer was "no." But today I attended the Cleveland, Ohio Sort, Hunting and Outdoor show. there were about four outfitters from RSA and one from Namibia. One of the people from RSA claims that it is now possible to get CITES permits for elephants in Mozambique if you are an American. Anyone know anything about this?

Hi

No problem getting Cites Elephant EXPORT Permits from Mozambique for legal Quota BUT USFW Will not issue any import permits for Mozambican Elephants!!! John Jackson, Conservation Force is fighting USFW for years on this!
You can ship to Canada or Mexico if you have a place there but not to the US!

Hope that's Help

http://legaltimes.typepad.com/...-import-permits.html


October 07, 2011


Court Shoots Down Sport Hunters' Lawsuit Over Import Permits



Updated at 1:46 p.m.

A group of sport hunters have lost their bid in Washington federal court to bring home elephant "trophies" that were legally killed in Mozambique.

The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, which grants permits for the import of animals killed during sport hunting, denied the hunters a permit on the grounds that authorities in Mozambique had failed to provide enough information to show that there was an effective elephant management plan in place.

U.S. District Judge Royce Lamberth, in an opinion (PDF) published Thursday, found that the agency had reason to deny the permits. Without "sufficient information" about Mozambique’s elephant management plan, the agency, according to policy, errs on the side of caution.

“Indeed, the record suggests that Mozambique’s conservation efforts were poorly organized, underfunded, and in no position to oversee the controlled killing of elephants,” Lamberth wrote.

The four sport hunters were represented by John Jackson III of the Conservation Force, a Metairie, La., nonprofit that served as the fifth plaintiff. The group promotes wildlife and habitat conservation, including through hunting, noting in the complaint that fees associated with hunting fund a number of conservation efforts.

Jackson, who also serves as president of the Conservation Force, said they plan to appeal.

"The Mozambique program … has a model program, set up by experts, and is considered one of the foremost programs in the world," Jackson said. "The fact that the service sat on permits for years and then when they’re sued they invent reasons to deny permits and the court lets them do it, is pretty disappointing."

A representative for the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service could not immediately be reached.

Two of the individual plaintiffs had shot and killed at least one elephant in Mozambique between 2000 and 2006, and the two others had filed for permits in advance of hunting trips, according to the complaint (PDF). Following what the agency acknowledged was an “extreme delay,” it denied the permits in 2006.

Mozambique lifted a ban on sport hunting in 1999. The agency decides whether to issue import permits for hunted species through provisions of the federal Endangered Species Act, which requires a finding that the import “will be for purposes which are not detrimental to the survival of the species involved.”

The total number of elephants in Mozambique is unknown – a fact the agency cited in determining that officials there lacked an effective management plan – but according to Lamberth’s opinion, the number is believed to have dropped from between 50,000 and 65,000 in 1974 to between 11,000 to 13,000 in 2002.

Sounds like an anti-hunting judge.

Totally ignorant of the facts.

Not now and likely not ever.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Sounds like an anti-hunting judge.

Totally ignorant of the facts.

I assumed the same, but his Wikipedia entry reads like he would be conservative. He is a Texan who was appointed by Reagan, ruled that Iran was behind Hezbollah and the 1983 bombings in Beirut and ordered Iran to pay $2.65 billion to the families of the victims, and enjoined the Obama Administration from further Federal funding for stem cell research.

I think you'll find that the ban goes back to about the time the Elephant upgrade first happened and there was a very dodgy application made to move what turned out to be a large shipment of dodgy ivory....... USF&WS sussed what was going on and ever since have refused to allow import of Mozambican elephant products on the excuse that the country doesn't have a properly organised management plan.

The fact that this happened around 30 years ago and the culprits have long gone and that the country has since formulated a far better management plan than many of it's neighbours seems to be irrelevent to the USF&WS.

John Jackson has (to his immense credit) been fighting the ban for many years and has won many judgements but usually the USF&WS have simply gone their own sweet way and often ignored the court rulings he has won.

My guess is that if the ban hasn't been rescinded in the last 30 odd years, it probably ain't gonna be rescinded anytime soon.

What it needs is for a judge to get real and start jailing the top officials until they actually do as they're told.