I just received the shipping charges for my duiker skull from Tanzania, which was misplaced and didn't make it with my original trophy shipment. Coppersmith handled all the custom clearence etc. on this end. The bottom line is it cost me $533.58 for one duiker skull (about the size of a baseball). I told Coppersmith that I thought this was just a "tad too much", but they said there was little they could do about it as the charges were coming out of Tanzania (you want to play you got too pay). The air carrier was British Airways, here is a break down of the charges:
FREIGHT CHG-OCEAN/AIR&SVC = $277.90
STORAGE CHARGES = $25.00
TERMINAL CHARGES & SVCS = $20.00
CARTAGE & SERVICES = $70.68
CUSTOM ENTRY SERVICES = $100.00
FISH/WILDLIFE ENTRY SVC = $40.00
TOTAL = $533.58

Are these charges excessive or am I missing something?

I would have informed the taxidermist or the outfitter (whoever's fault it is that the duiker didn't make the original shipment) to pick up the cost.

I would not pay $533.58 for a duiker skull, even with Top 10 horns.

George

I agree with GeorgeS. Someone obviously fumbled the ball on the duiker, which was not your fault.

It should be whoever made the mistake picking up the tab.

graybird

quote:

they said there was little they could do about it as the charges were coming out of Tanzania (you want to play you got too pay)

Seems to me that about half the total amount is what Coppersmith charged you!! What does that have to do with the trophies originating in Tanzania???

Did they handle the other shipment? If so I'd go back and ask again for a break on their fees - find someone at Coppersmith who can do something about it.

I agree with George! I wouldn't pay that for one Duiker skull!

There's something missing here, someone is responsable for this screw up! I don't know what to tell you about this one, who ever is at fault will for sure pass the buck!!!

seems to me that I'd do without the skull & mention to coppersmith just where they could place it

That sounds very high to me.

The way Coppersmith explained it to me was, these were predomiatley British Airways charges (including the airport storage charges). Coppersmith just cleared the stuff through customs, etc on this end. Coppersmith also told me that Tanzania was notorious for high shipping rates. As far as the outfitter, I will not be hunting with him again. Not that we didn't have a great hunt, we took 28 animals in 21 days. I just felt that things weren't always as they were promised. We had a great hunt, because we had a verry good/fun PH, who worked his butt off. As far as the duiker - he was a good one and I will probably not kill another one (one is enough - they aren't like buffalo, just don't get my heart rate up, if you know what I mean!!!).

I would never pay that...If you did not sign a contract refuse it....

IMO

Mike

I would have just shot another duiker on the next trip.

STORAGE CHARGES = $25.00
TERMINAL CHARGES & SVCS = $20.00
CARTAGE & SERVICES = $70.68
CUSTOM ENTRY SERVICES = $100.00

I think those are all Coppersmith handling/service charges.

Now that is just ridiculous! Assuming whoever messed up won't pay to ship it to you, tell the taxidermist to put it in a slightly oversized box and DHL it to you directly. Label the damn customs declaration "academic manuscript" with a value of $0 and be done with it. If it gets confiscated, it gets confiscated but no way in hell I pay $500+ to get a duiker skull home.

JMHO,

JohnTheGreek

I have had the same experience with Coppersmith and the SBS Logistics people they use is RSA. I have 15 trophies there waiting to be shipped and a couple of friend with 7 - 8 each. The initial quote on the guys with the 7 -8 was about $3,200 for ocean shipping. I did not even ask for a quote on mine. In any case, I am having Flora and Fauna ship the stuff with Safari Cargo. Don't know yet what the costs will be, but I'm hoping it's less. Flora and Fauna advertise in the SCI magazines and they're out of New York.

quote:

Originally posted by MHC_TX:
I just received the shipping charges for my duiker skull from Tanzania, which was misplaced and didn't make it with my original trophy shipment. Coppersmith handled all the custom clearence etc. on this end. The bottom line is it cost me $533.58 for one duiker skull (about the size of a baseball). I told Coppersmith that I thought this was just a "tad too much", but they said there was little they could do about it as the charges were coming out of Tanzania (you want to play you got too pay). The air carrier was British Airways, here is a break down of the charges:
FREIGHT CHG-OCEAN/AIR&SVC = $277.90
STORAGE CHARGES = $25.00
TERMINAL CHARGES & SVCS = $20.00
CARTAGE & SERVICES = $70.68
CUSTOM ENTRY SERVICES = $100.00
FISH/WILDLIFE ENTRY SVC = $40.00
TOTAL = $533.58

Are these charges excessive or am I missing something?

It looks like the itemised charges per se are close to or within standard as per normal USA clearance storage entry permits and other misc as applicable /

I dont know if there is a MINIMUM airfreight charge that the (airlines use)

On larger crate consignements, generally they use a formulae based upon weigh/volume or similar.

So as I see it, the only charges that need some investigation or clarification is the FREIGHT /

The main questions I therefore ask are.

1) Who did you hunt with in TZA

2) Who in TZA arranged the field prep & dispatch of the trophies after the hunt

3) Who in TZA did the actual dip & pack and documentation

4) For what specic reason did the duiker skull miss the origional shipment

5) Who in TZA arranged the airfreight of the consignemnt out from Tanzania

6) Did anyone in TZA give you an estimate or ballpark cost prior to dispatch of the skull, if not, any reason why not !

Regards, Peter

Don't even think that their prices are better then Coppersmith!!!

There're all the same!!!!

MHC - I had a similar incident with Coopersmith last year with a different animal and skull. I called their main office (Dallas) and was able to recover some of the "excessive" charges; however, their explaination of the "high" cost left alot of questions in my mind regarding their customer service policies. Passing on charges you know are "too high", but may not be contested by the "average" safaris traveler, is not a way to make friends or aquire more customers IMO. I'm sure I would not have received a "rebate" from their "good graces" if I had not taken swift action. I won't be using their service in the future. Mags

NO WAY that I would pay that. A duiker skull could be wrapped in bubble wrap, put in a shoe box and be mailed from Africa for about $25. You could pick it up yourself. If it were mine, they would keep it, I can buy a duiker skull on ebay for about $20.

At this point I'm just trying to learn something from this experience, too insure that it doesn't happen again too me or someone else. I finally payed the charges yesterday, after bitching at Coppersmith, in both Dallas & Houston. I have another trip booked to TZ, with a different outfitter and I plan to go over the shipping arrangements in detail!!! As far as the duiker - yes, it isn't worth that kind of money, but the memory that it represents too me is priceless (every time I look at that little guy I will probably get pissed off ).

quote:

Originally posted by RBHunt:
A duiker skull could be wrapped in bubble wrap, put in a shoe box and be mailed from Africa for about $25.

EXACTLY !

quote:

I finally payed the charges yesterday

My God! I have a 1990 Ford Bronco for sale....the car is free and I will only charge you $10,000 to ship it to you from Utah. Seriously, don't take this personally, but you paying this bill only reinforces Coppersmith's belief that they can do it to others. Sooner or later, we all need to take a stand against this sort of bullshit. RBHunt is right, the thing could have been shipped for less than a tenth of what you were charged.

Best,

JohnTheGreek

Hunters should always require their p.h. or outfitter or its designated freight agent to notify them PRIOR to shipping anything to the U.S. so you are given the chance to review the packing list and authorize shipping charges. Unfortunately, in Tanzania there is no structured set up on shipping unlike RSA, Zim, Botswana or Namibia so most shipments arrive "unannounced" at U.S. ports. Clients have no option then but to pay or abandon the shipment. Simple advise, when you get the bill from overseas requesting for wire payment before trophies are packed and export permits applied for, always check the packing list and ensure that you are paying for everything that you are expecting. If any shortage occurs when you receive the shipment, you can hold the shipper responsible for ALL CHARGES DUE, i.e. shipping, clearance and delivery to door.

Several things come to mind, your PH should have sent the skull with someone elses trophies, IF he was aware....

The other is listen to Phil Lozanos post, most of those charges are by Coppersmith, not the problem of Tanzania..Actually Tanzania has nothing to do with this, British air and Coppersmith are the problem, and who ever is responsible for it getting shipped by itself...


You certainly have a legitamate complaint and you may get some sympathy, but thats about it, its one of those deals you pay or refuse, its a done deal now...

I'd refuse the shipment, tell those Brits to stick it myself, but thats your call...It won't do any good to stress out over it, just make a decision and get on with your day...Wish I had some better advise, but I don't.

I'm over it - I just don't want too repeat it!!

I paid the bill, because I wanted that trophy/memory - simple as that.

Now, for the rest of the story - I will keep digging and if I find Coppersmith f______ me, then I will do everything that I can too make sure it doesn't happen again, to you or me.

I am pretty ignorant about how trophies are shipped and how the billing works, so if someone would care to enlighten me I would like to learn.

JohnThe Greek:
As far as Bronco offer, sounds like a sweet deal, but I am a Chevy man, so will have too pass on that one (besides I thought you were in Egypt)!

MHC,

I am in Egypt 9 or 10 months of the year and spend the rest of my time in Utah. I gotta tell you that anyone who drops five bills to ship a duiker skull home is welcome to come shoot ducks with me here any time. I'll even let you take me to dinner...shouldn't be anywhere near $500.

Best,

JohnTheGreek

P.S. In a way, your attitude regarding this situation is a little refreshing. Sounds like you have enough respect for the animal and appreciation for the memories to say "to hell with it, ship the thing". I respect that. What I don't appreciate is people extacting ridiculous profits by exploiting the hunters ethic.

Contact Carol Rutowski at Coppersmith and give her some hell. She's the head person for Coppersmith's African shipments. It seems that until we all do that and make it known that the costs are excessive nothing will change.

quote:

Originally posted by JohnTheGreek:
MHC,
I gotta tell you that anyone who drops five bills to ship a duiker skull home is welcome to come shoot ducks with me here....

Hey JTG, is it really true about the great Nile perch fishing they have around the Aswan?

Think about it, BA charges you 250 bucks but at least they flew the thing from africa. Coppersmith charges 250 bucks for paperwork. Now I know they have to make a living but remember fish and wildlife does not charge for trophy clearance that is a coppersmith charge.The same goes for customs, the storage charge is bogus because they are suposed to pick it up when it arrives and either hold it or ship it to you. They need to adjust their charges according to the value or size of the shipment. I have used them for the last time.

quote:

Originally posted by gunny:
Think about it, ...... 250 bucks but at least they flew the thing from africa...... I have used them for the last time.

OK, the problem is that it does not cost $250 to get an item the size of a duiker skull from Africa, air or otherwise, it can be mailed surface, which takes a little longer for a lot less. I do not use Coppersmith, but the others have similar rates. When you have a shipment of your whole safari, a dozen or more trophies, and you have waited for six months or more, you are prepared to pay whatever it cost to get them. With the big shipments, you are at the mercy of a few companies, and they charge what they want and we pay it. I think it comes down to the fact that the hunting industry thinks that most trophy hunters are millionaires, which in many cases is true, and they can charge whatever the market will allow, be that shipping charges, observer fees, tips, etc. At some point we just have to say NO! This is one of them.

quote:

Originally posted by RBHunt:

Hey JTG, is it really true about the great Nile perch fishing they have around the Aswan?

I haven'y been so far as Aswan (only Luxor) but the overnight trip from Cairo only costs $50 for a pretty nice private sleeping cabin and meals. I have met with a guy here who arranges these trips for Nile Perch on Lake Nasser and you are looking at about $500 per person for four days and three nights including meals. The operator is about 65-70 and a retired british parole officer. He is an interesting guy who seems to have a great knowledge of how to operate such a business in Egypt.
I can't wait to get down there and do this trip but 14 day advance notice must be given to arrange the permits with the local military. I always seem to be too busy to provide that 14 days or I would have been down there already. IF you want to arrange something, I would really advise winter. December or January would be best as when I was in Luxor just a few weeks ago, I think it was about 105 degrees F....and this was "spring weather". Maybe we can arrage a December AR trip over here. Ducks and Doves in the Fayoum Oasis and then a trip down to Aswan for BIG nile Perch.



Sure makes those good sized Yellow Perch I caught as a kid look like bait!

Best,

JohnTheGreek

JTG,
That sounds good. Really would like to land one of those HUGE Nile perch, and maybe a few Egyptian geese. I could send you a half a dozen duiker skulls - my expense of course!

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
I would have just shot another duiker on the next trip.

STORAGE CHARGES = $25.00
TERMINAL CHARGES & SVCS = $20.00
CARTAGE & SERVICES = $70.68
CUSTOM ENTRY SERVICES = $100.00

I think those are all Coppersmith handling/service charges.

Ann,
Those are exactly the charges I paid Coppersmith.

Got enough Duiker skulls....although their value seems to be increasing rapidly. Send Jack Daniels. That is the truly rare commodity here. It can be had but the black marktet price is a bit excessive at over double the US level.

Best,

JohnTheGreek

OK, Jack it is. I can mail it, or I will fill my carry on with it!!

See you in December!

Storage charges and terminal charges are paid to the airline. Cartage (local trucking) is paid to whomever delivered it to your door. $140.00 is the total charge for their service. It looks more like roughly 1/4 of the charge is services charges, not half. Still, alot of $$ for a small skull.