I’ve obtained one of the five SA black rhino CITIES permits, and are therefor earnestly looking for someone interested in hunting one of these animals.

This will obviously be a very unique hunt, and the trophy fee will also be “uniqueâ€. We will be looking at something in the region of $ 200 000.

If you’re interested, or know any one that may be interested, please e-mail me at rniemand@shisas.com

Regards to all.

PS. Please pardon me if I don’t reply promptly to any e-mails or messages on the forum, I’m hunting at the moment.

I'm sorry, but I just wanted to make sure that you meant $200k?

How much if you keep the rhino after I shoot it?

I've heard these figures. Can you help us understand where these dollars go?

HOLY SH.T that is a small packet for the beast ....

I tell you what .... how about this offer !!!

I will seriously considered selling anyone with an interest a (bells whistles and lights) 100% going concern 6,000+ acre hunting ranch in SA for the price of 3.25 x Black Rhino. Then add onto that price the equavalent of another 1.5 Black Rhino and you can have all the species on the property as well, including 4 x White Rhino ...

And I am not joking

Peter

The U.S. Fish and Wildlife will not let you import a Black Rhino is the story I got at the past SCI Convention.

I spoke with them at length. The Rhino cannot be on a commercial game farm/ranch, according to the U.S. Fish and Wildlife directive. Also, it has to meet specific purposes for harvest. And they said, even then they would not issue a Import license. (from the horses mouth).

Unless there has been a big change at the U.S.F.& W. Americans are out of the picture.

Best,
Phil
www.go-on-safari.com

This so called "hunt" is only suitable for those members of SCI who like to pat each other on the back and give each other all sorts of silly prizes for being members of of one silly circle and another.

In my wildest dream, I cannot call shooting an animal in an oversize pen "hunting"!

It is always interesting to read responses to offers like this. Immediately people jump to conclusions. This could very well be a black rhino hunt in a large game reserve arranged by one of the official Park's Boards. You can be sure that there are not many black rhino kept in a 'pen' for 'shooting' purposes. Black rhino conservation is strictly controlled in RSA and the animals are only sold to bona fide game farmers who have been carefully vetted before hand.
If you don't want to take up the offer just say 'No Thanks'. Why crucify the guy before establishing the facts?
There are 10 genuine CITES permits available so why should'nt your guys allow importation?

Balla Balla,
Please put your offer into Rands & cents. Sounds like a good offer.

Springbok,

I have nothing against people wanting to shoot black rhino, white rhino, lion or buffalo in South Africa.

But, I would certainly never do it.

I enjoy hunting planes game in South Africa. I know I am hunting on a farm, with game animals either bred there or bought from another farm. This does not bother me at all.

But, to say that lions, black rhino, white rhino are "hunted" in South Africa is stretching the point a bit.

Man , S.A. is starting to sound like Texas.

As I'm particularly interested in following what's happening with the Black Rhino's new status I followed this up via the person who manages the issuance of RSA's CITES permits, the response just received is as follows:

"No permits have been issued, but the hunts were allocated to 4 provinces namely Mpumalanga (2), North West (1), Limpopo (1) and Free State (1). As far as i know , no hunt has taken place to date."

Now I'm left a little confused and am trying to get more detail lest I miss something and jump to conclusions.

Either which way, I'm really keen to see how this will unfold ito the precedent it may set wrt a change in species status and the spirit within which it is done. Lets hope sanity will prevail in the long run for the benefit of all.

I agree with Saeed and that is why I do not belong to SCI and likely never will. That group is worse than the Academy Awards and Country Music Awards - the members give each other prizes. Go figure.

I feel sorry for you dogcat, to judge SCI by only what happens at the Nat'l convention. Local chapters keep 70% of what they raise for local projects such as protecting wet lands, providing Safari Wishes for youngsters with disabalities of various sorts, youth field days etc. please don't paint with a broad brush. My friends and I work very hard (as many other chapters do also) to raise these funds.

Are they cheaper if you buy a half-dozen?

***

I don't see the problem. If the rhino is in a big enough reserve, not hand fed or out the back of a bakkie, in as wild a state as possible, why not?

Except for the price.

At least a black rhino is a true "Big Five" animal unlike the tamish white rhino.

If it aids black rhino conservation and is a true 'un-canned' hunt, go for it (if you have a quarter mil $).

I'll agree that SCI has some "issues", but overall the organization does more good than harm.

Our local chapter for example has sent a lot of kids to camps, funded research here in Texas and the list goes on and on. Most importantly it brings likeminded individuals together for a common cause, same goes for this forum.

SCI trophy scores / awards; really, at the end of the day, who cares. It's about beig able to go hunting period. Remember this: The anti-hunting activists want just this sort of thing to happen - infighting among the various hunting communities. This will weaken the overall pro-hunting cause and give the advantage to the "Antis". Don't want that happenng.

As for the 200K Rhino hunt - great! Somebody will pay it and so frigg'n what! It's just cash and some folks have plenty of it to burn - it's their business if they are foolish enough to pay that kind of fee.

Me personally, I'd put that cash into that SA land deal mentioned earlier and hunt to my heart's contentment

JW

Folks,

I hunted with Riaan last June. We hunted at a place calles Moketsi. It was a HUGE place and while fenced, it was 75K acres and the game was as wild as could be. They had several white rhinos there at the time. One day they chased Riaan all around the place (He went back for the truck and kept bumping them).

If the the Black Rhinos are on the same place, and I assume they are as Riaan mentioned that they are now there, then this would be a hell of a hunt. I certainly can't afford the hunt, but then again I can't afford a private jet. Doesn't stop me from dreaming about both or begrudging those that can...

-Steve

Guys,
I don't have the desire or cash to spend on a black rhino. $200K would be a lifetime of hun ting for the future, but this is probably beneficial for the long term survival of the black rhino. The answer to people who want them released in the wild is that they would be poached off in a week. In the Zambezi River valley, where I last hunted, they had numerous black rhino which were poached out not so many years ago. Maybe the high price will help governments value them and finally protect them. It always seems that it is the hunters who pay the way for game conservation.

Dak

Hello Riaan,
I will take the hunt....but you must take three of my $95,000.00 cats in trade, and of course the rest in cash...

This is a unique hunt and the first in a long time I believe...Considering the cost of a White Rhino, this Black Rhino will sell I assure you of that...

I hope they film it, it would probably recover most of the bucks spent if marketed correctly...It could actually be a good investment if someone has the capital..

That is a bunch of cash, but I think its all a matter of what each one of us is used to. I spent $5,000 on an elk hunt for this year, and it should be a good hunt. Some will think that is way out of line and that spending $1,000 on an elk hunt is more like it. I will get out of my hunt what I want to, and the guy that spends $1,000 will get what he wants. And he will go on 5 hunts to my one. But then I could go on 5 goose hunts for each of his elk hunts, and so on. If I had the kind of $ this hunt is for, woould I do it? Probably not. I would probably buy Ray's 3 cats, which Ray and I would be using for bait on 3 very long and fun safaris!

No animal worth $200,000 is allowed to roam free.

I think the fee is fine, assuming that 150K of the 200K goes to the protection & proliferation of the species.

I wonder if that's the case?

Or is it just a hugely-profitable "crop" for the owner?

To each his own, but I would much rather pay the $200,000 for a Black Rhino trophy fee rather than pay $200,000 to $250,000 for one of the sheep hunts. That is the price even if you don't pull the trigger!

Riaan,

Out of curiosity, how much would a Black Rhino dart hunt cost? Since you may not be able to bring back the animal, my taxidermist can make me a fiberglass replica off the measurements.

quote:

Originally posted by Springbok:
Balla Balla,
Please put your offer into Rands & cents. Sounds like a good offer.

There are some interesting posts on the Black Rhino offer,

I personally dont take any issue with the hunt perse or where it might be held, just the price gives me a cold shiver and I only wanted to put it inperspective really when compared to a operational game ranch. Mind you I remember a few years back I think some enthusiest paid $250,000 for a rifle at one of the SCI hunting shows I think !!

Springbok re the ranch in Limpopo Province .... proberbly at the present exchange rate ( my brother ) would look seriously @ any reasonable offers around say (rand 6.25 mill ) walk in walk out price ... He has three full blown hunting ranches in Africa and being a family business his resources are somewhat limited and he also is getting close to that dreaded retirement age after busting his butt for many years of hard work

Regards, Peter

I'm way interested in a black rhino but it's beyond my means. If I was in a situation where $200,000 would not hurt me, the hunt was offered on a sizable property and that particular rhino had not been purchased just so I could shoot it you better believe I'd be all over it. I'm extremely sorry that when I started safari hunting that a rhino was no longer a part of a full bag safari.

I think the black rhino is as African as the zebra or any other animal and I applaude the effort to make them again huntable.

Regards,

Mark

A looonnnnnngggggg time ago, the Southern White Rhino was nearly extinct. The South African game ranchers brought it back because it was potentially profitable to do so and because they couldn't stand the thought of the beastie going away. Now it seems that the black rhino is getting the same treatment. Hallelujah! No, I will never be able to hunt a rhino or an elephant or a lion and am damned unlikely to be able to afford a leopard. Buffalo and hippo (maybe!) are as dangerous as I can afford. However, I am delighted to hear that the numbers of black rhino are up to the point where the game officials think that a few can be cropped. That can only be taken as good news whether any particular member of this forum likes the style of hunt or not. It means that the species now has a chance. From that point of view, shouldn't we all be celebrating?

I'm a fan of the free enterprise system...supply dictates demand...if Riaan can get it...so be it...good for him.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeff Wemmer:

Me personally, I'd put that cash into that SA land deal mentioned earlier and hunt to my heart's contentment

JW

It's not nearly as easy as you imagine. For instance, as far as I know, you wouldn't be able to keep rifles on your place as a foreigner, nor would you be able to hunt on your place without a PH.

quote:

Originally posted by Oldsarge:
A looonnnnnngggggg time ago, the Southern White Rhino was nearly extinct. The South African game ranchers brought it back because it was potentially profitable to do so and because they couldn't stand the thought of the beastie going away. Now it seems that the black rhino is getting the same treatment. Hallelujah! No, I will never be able to hunt a rhino or an elephant or a lion and am damned unlikely to be able to afford a leopard. Buffalo and hippo (maybe!) are as dangerous as I can afford. However, I am delighted to hear that the numbers of black rhino are up to the point where the game officials think that a few can be cropped. That can only be taken as good news whether any particular member of this forum likes the style of hunt or not. It means that the species now has a chance. From that point of view, shouldn't we all be celebrating?

I like this perspective.....It's likely the best one.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
This so called "hunt" is only suitable for those members of SCI who like to pat each other on the back and give each other all sorts of silly prizes for being members of of one silly circle and another.

In my wildest dream, I cannot call shooting an animal in an oversize pen "hunting"!

Hear, hear!

AND HERE IS ANOTHER IDEA. How about we all donated 10$ to save the black Rhino when we went hunting in africa. I for one, cannot shoot an animal that is SO close to being wiped out from the face of the earth.

Are you kidding? Here in the US, we eat a species that was closer to extinction than the black rhino has ever gotten, the American bison. Yeah, it dropped to a much lower number than old hornonnanose and now we farm them. They're delicious and eating them instead of feedlot beef is a mark of environmental sensitivity because all bison are grass fed. Sorry, Niels, but at $10/hunter/safari, the rhino is doomed.

I am not interested in shooting any Rhino for some reason but I would bet the hunt sells and the buyer is happy. Look at what has happened with the price of cars and houses and you will see that most of us continue to spend regardless of how stupidly high the price gets...

My question is how much will the first Tiger hunt sell for?

Jeff old buddy, never put your money into any African land deal, it will be the last you ever see of that money! better you invest in buying hammers for $3.50 apiece and selling them for $2.50....

If the black gov'ts don't ffff-up Southern Africa (and there is a good chance they intend to have a decent try) I hope that in the 25 to 30 years (at least) before I hang up my rifles (or am dead first) that a black rhino may be approaching a price where I can contemplate a hunt.

White rhino were brought back, why not black rhino given time, efforts and sustainable utilisation.

Ray, point well taken.

I was thinking in texas terms of land versus, well, anything! Always go with land. Reckon that SA ain't the same game.

How many of those hammers have you got?

JW

Spoke to my good friend in Vegas , Cecil Fredi a few day ago . On his 30 day Kenya safari , prices were as follows :

Elephant : $285
Lion : $265
Buffalo : $40
BLACK RHINO : $56

Total 30 day hunt for himself , and hunting partner including 61 animals - $5000 .
This was in 1968 .

What went wrong ?

Brad

Hallo to each and all. Sorry for my slow response. Firstly I have a client from Houston Texas at the moment, and don’t have much time for anything other than ensuring that his safari is a success, and secondly the black rhino offer generated a big number of e-mail. I’ve attended to the e-mails in some sort of priority. Those that seemed real serious and interested have been answered, those that requested general info will be answered in due course, the obnoxious and naive has been deleted – and won’t be answered.

Thanks to all that made an effort to support me, either by assistance or encouragement.

As a general piece of info, we have 3 potential clients interested, and we’ll enter into the nut & bolt phase of negotiations with the first person to pay a deposit.

I have a few minutes down time now, and will therefore try to answer some of the questions asked by members.

500grains and Longbob: Darting a black rhino with me is not an option. I’m not willing to do that personally. If you’d want to pursue that option send me an e-mail, and I’ll get you in touch with someone that might be willing to work out a deal with you. I would suspect that a black rhino dart hunt would be in the region of $ 30 K.

Keith and new_guy, other than a few dollars for taxes, permits and some general expenses, all the dollars will go into the pockets of various entrepreneurs. These entrepreneurs have invested in the safari industry over a long time, and will continue to do so in the future. They are making a profit through sustainable utilization, thereby ensuring conservation. If it pays it stays.

NitroX: I can’t offer you half-dozen right now. But if this works out, and we get more to hunt – sure I’ll give you a discount if you take 6 black rhino. Even a South African can be reasonable!

Steve: thanks for the back-up buddy! I’m looking forward to ’06.

Ray: sure I’ll take your 3 x $ 95 K cats, but how much additional cash do you want to give me? I agree with your assessment that this might be a good investment if all involved thought big enough.

Mark and Oldsarge: thanks for words of wisdom.

Brad: I’ll answer your e-mail soon, but with regards to your post – nothing went wrong. Everything would have been wrong if you and I only received $5000 today after hosting a 30-day safari for 2, with 61 animals killed. We either would have lost interest in the safari business, or had to kill 4 x + that amount of animals just to make ends meet. It surely would not have been a sustainable deal.

Once again thanks to those that gave me words of encouragement and support.