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Should I Switch Rifles for my Elephant Hunt?
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posted
I'll be hunting a trophy bull in Malapati this coming fall with SSG Safaris. I was planning on using my Ruger RMS in 416 Rigby. I love the rifle and shoot it well.

But, I'm intrigued with using a double rifle on this once in a lifetime elephant hunt. I can't afford a double in a "proper" elephant caliber, but could possibly purchase a Chapuis in 9.3x74R.

Please give me your guidance.


"There are worse memorials to a life well-lived than a pair of elephant tusks." Robert Ruark
 
Posts: 4781 | Location: Story, WY / San Carlos, Sonora, MX | Registered: 29 May 2002Reply With Quote
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Stick with the 416.
1. It's plenty big enough (if you put it in the right place)
2. You shoot well with it (so your more likely to put it in the right place)
 
Posts: 559 | Location: UK | Registered: 17 November 2006Reply With Quote
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Do you want someone to tell you to buy that double? Oh Hell go for it! dancing rotflmo thumb jumping beer
 
Posts: 5338 | Location: Bedford, Pa. USA | Registered: 23 February 2002Reply With Quote
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Nice "problem" to have.....

If you shoot the 416 well, you will shoot the 9.3x74R well.

To me, a "Once in a lifetime" ele hunt just screams double rifle.

Enjoy your "problem" and good luck on your hunt beer


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Posts: 860 | Location: Arizona + Just as far as memory reaches | Registered: 04 February 2007Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by R.Jolly:
Stick with the 416.
1. It's plenty big enough (if you put it in the right place)
2. You shoot well with it (so your more likely to put it in the right place)


Well said...DITTO.
 
Posts: 353 | Location: tanzania, east africa | Registered: 27 March 2008Reply With Quote
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If you want to hunt your elephant with a double, do not go down in caliber from the range you are in with the bolt gun.

You are usually better off with the platform with which you have the most experience. If you can handle a double (in a comparable caliber) with the same degree of expertise under pressure then take one.

Just my worthless opinion based on limted experience. Ask Will what he thinks. He may suggest a single-trigger double Wink, but I think he will vote for the heavier bolt gun.
 
Posts: 8773 | Location: Republic of Texas | Registered: 24 April 2004Reply With Quote
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Scott,
I've only shot three elephant but all of them with the .416 Rigby... and PHs like Buzz Charlton carry them as their primary rifle for a reason. I agree with the conventional wisdom that says "stick with what you know". And Charles is right, going to a 9.3 is actually a downgrade from a 400 grain solid to a 286 grain solid unless you handload! Take the old girl and make some new memories with her... unless you need an excuse for a new double.


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Posts: 7561 | Location: Victoria, Texas | Registered: 30 March 2003Reply With Quote
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Scott,

I believe Will took a 9.3 double to Zim a couple of years ago to hunt elephant. His conclusion was that it was a nice rifle to carry all day, but it was not enough for elephant.

I would rather hunt elephant (or anything for that matter), with a rifle like the .416 that I have confidence in, than take a chance on being under gunned or ill-prepared with a new rifle that wasn't thoroughly tested.
 
Posts: 1046 | Location: Kerrville, Texas USA | Registered: 02 August 2001Reply With Quote
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Hell yes, buy the double. It's an international law that you MUST buy a double rifle for an elephant hunt!
When you are there however, shoot him with the 416, you already shoot it well and you don't want to screw up a once in a lifetime shot.

TerryR
 
Posts: 1903 | Location: Greensburg, Pa. | Registered: 09 August 2002Reply With Quote
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I say buy the double, but go with a 470 NE caliber. When you are done with the hunt, and if you can ever part with the rifle, the 470 NE will bring a better used value.

Me, I would never sell my double if it bagged an Ele. Smiler

Regards.. PAH


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Posts: 1015 | Location: PA | Registered: 08 June 2002Reply With Quote
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Use the .416 it is plenty. Remeber what i told you about your instructions to Nixon though...
 
Posts: 2857 | Location: FL | Registered: 18 September 2007Reply With Quote
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If you get into a situation where you must take a 50 yard shot on trophy bull that is late in the day or very early in the morning, you will be glad to use the scope on your 416.
 
Posts: 527 | Location: New Orleans,La. | Registered: 27 September 2003Reply With Quote
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SBT, if I were you - of the two rifles you mention - I would definitely use the .416.


Mike

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Posts: 13699 | Location: New England | Registered: 06 June 2003Reply With Quote
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Love the Chapuis.

Could do the job with solids placed well in the brain were it a legal option in the area.

Still, I must concur I'd prefer a larger calibre.

Sent you a PM about an available .470 rifle. (Not mine)


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Posts: 4593 | Location: TX | Registered: 03 March 2009Reply With Quote
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I have hunted with my 9,3x74R Chapuis quite a bit. It is one of my most favorite hunting rifles.

I have taken cape buff and elephant with it.

Both with one shot. However I do consider it light for elephant.

If you are buying a double for elephant, I would recommend a 450/400 or bigger.

Sad thing is, the bigger doubles do cost a fair amount more than a 9,3.

I have used my big bore doubles for deer, wild pigs, black bear, caribou, and even coyote.
So you can hunt with them here and have a lot of fun.

But, because I like hunting with double rifles, and I like to get close to the elephants, I would rather hunt with a double 9,3x74R, than a bolt ANYTHING.

For the first shot, I would use ONLY brain shots with the 9,3.

I would also instruct the PH to follow up, IF I had fired my 2 shots and the elephant was not down, and was able to run off.


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Posts: 16134 | Location: Texas | Registered: 06 April 2002Reply With Quote
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SBT,

I have only shot 3 elephants, 2 with a 470NE Merkel and 1 with a 416 Rem. All were fun. I think the 9.3 may be a little small for ele and if anything goes wrong your PH might end up shooting your ele.

I no longer have my 470 as it was bought to shoot elephant and after I had shot 2 ele and a couple of buff with it I sold it.

So I think a good option would be to buy a 470 such as a Merkel at the right price and sell it after the hunt. You may lose a little money but I would guess not that much. Plus you would get to shoot your elephant with a big bore double.

BigB
 
Posts: 1401 | Location: Northwest Wyoming | Registered: 13 March 2001Reply With Quote
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Only 2 ele. 416 is my weapon of choice. If you shoot it well you have your answer.


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Posts: 1366 | Location: SPARTANBURG SOUTH CAROLINA | Registered: 02 July 2008Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by TANZ-PH:
quote:
Originally posted by R.Jolly:
Stick with the 416.
1. It's plenty big enough (if you put it in the right place)
2. You shoot well with it (so your more likely to put it in the right place)


Well said...DITTO.


Tritto(?). Not even close in my mind. I have heard stories from PHs about experiences of folks trying to use 9.3x74Rs on elephant, not good.


Mike
 
Posts: 21746 | Registered: 03 January 2006Reply With Quote
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416 Rigby will work fine. For that matter 375 H&H will work fine, however you have the perfect excuse to buy a double. I know of no one that has said, "I wish I didn't own a double".
Go gettem elephant hunter.
 
Posts: 444 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 11 February 2008Reply With Quote
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Ive seen it dozens of times on the outdoor channel, Hunter shoots elephant with a rifle he isnt familiar with. He blows the brain shot and his PH kills his elephant. So you flew 10,000 miles and spent 40 grand to watch someone else kill your elephant. Use the rigby and shoot him in the shoulder that way he is yours no matter how many time the PH shoots him.
 
Posts: 914 | Registered: 06 January 2005Reply With Quote
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Scott,

Listen to gunny's sage advise. Use what you know. AND you have beat yourself to death looking for that cheap ele hunt. Now you've found it and you want to buy a double just for the hunt??? PLEASE!!!!

Mark


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Posts: 13050 | Location: LAS VEGAS, NV USA | Registered: 04 August 2002Reply With Quote
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Stop and think...

- Use the .416, good gun, you know it, you'll use it well, you'll get your ele, that's the ultimate goal.

- Use the money you'd have spent on the 9.3 to do more African hunting while you're there.

- You can always buy a double later.

- You can't buy the hunting you've not done later.

What you do is much more important than what you do it with...


Philip


 
Posts: 1252 | Location: East Africa | Registered: 14 November 2006Reply With Quote
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Yes, agreed with all of the above - use what you know best. But buy the double anyhow!

Dave
 
Posts: 2270 | Location: Zimbabwe | Registered: 28 February 2007Reply With Quote
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Buy another ele and shoot one with a double and one with the 416.Problem solved dancing
 
Posts: 203 | Location: South Africa | Registered: 28 October 2007Reply With Quote
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Hands down stick with your Ruger RSM in .416 Rigby! You are way ahad of the game with this rifle cartridge combination.
 
Posts: 2627 | Location: Where the pine trees touch the sky | Registered: 06 December 2006Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
I have hunted with my 9,3x74R Chapuis quite a bit. It is one of my most favorite hunting rifles.

I have taken cape buff and elephant with it.

Both with one shot. However I do consider it light for elephant.

If you are buying a double for elephant, I would recommend a 450/400 or bigger.

Sad thing is, the bigger doubles do cost a fair amount more than a 9,3.

I have used my big bore doubles for deer, wild pigs, black bear, caribou, and even coyote.
So you can hunt with them here and have a lot of fun.

But, because I like hunting with double rifles, and I like to get close to the elephants, I would rather hunt with a double 9,3x74R, than a bolt ANYTHING.

For the first shot, I would use ONLY brain shots with the 9,3.

I would also instruct the PH to follow up, IF I had fired my 2 shots and the elephant was not down, and was able to run off.


YUP!


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Posts: 4593 | Location: TX | Registered: 03 March 2009Reply With Quote
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Thanks all, I have received some very savvy advice.

Mark, if I used your thought process on buying a hunt, I would have never been able to go to Africa for the first hunt. Using mine, I've been able to shoot a lion, 4 buffalo, a plethera of plains game and now an elephant. I think I'll continue to search for bargains AND maybe be able to buy a double. Quality and cost are not mutually exclusive. Your welcome.


"There are worse memorials to a life well-lived than a pair of elephant tusks." Robert Ruark
 
Posts: 4781 | Location: Story, WY / San Carlos, Sonora, MX | Registered: 29 May 2002Reply With Quote
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SBT

I would advise when you get your double that you shoot it a few hundred times, in the field not just at the range.

Do some wild pig hunts if possible.


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Posts: 16134 | Location: Texas | Registered: 06 April 2002Reply With Quote
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If you want a double, buy one! There are some rather unlikely circumstances where it would be handy.

It would be difficult to narrow down the possibilities to what are most important, but two biggies are using enough gun and knowing where to shoot, even it if doesn't get done.

As the recent video posted here shows, nothing is going to ruin your video legacy more than not knowing where to shoot an elephant. If only more of these guys got stepped on .....


-------------------------------
Will Stewart / Once you've been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun.
---------------------------------------
and, God Bless John Wayne.

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Posts: 19373 | Location: Ocala Flats | Registered: 22 May 2002Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by BigB:
SBT,

I have only shot 3 elephants, 2 with a 470NE Merkel and 1 with a 416 Rem. All were fun. I think the 9.3 may be a little small for ele and if anything goes wrong your PH might end up shooting your ele.

I no longer have my 470 as it was bought to shoot elephant and after I had shot 2 ele and a couple of buff with it I sold it.

So I think a good option would be to buy a 470 such as a Merkel at the right price and sell it after the hunt. You may lose a little money but I would guess not that much. Plus you would get to shoot your elephant with a big bore double.

BigB


BigB is right, and infact I bought his Merkel double 470NE, and it is a very nice rifle, and he shot a couple of real nice ele with that rifle, plus a couple of Buffalo as well.

If I wanted a new double rifle I would buy the 9.3X74R Merkel, or Chapuis, scope it, and take it along, with the 416 bolt rifle. Carry the 9.3 and have a tracker carry the bolt rifle. If the ele presented you with a good angle for a brain shot, take it, followed close behing with the second barrel, then trade rifles with the tracker, for follow-up if needed. If the ele you want doesn't cooperate, then just shoot him with the 416 bolt rifle.

Then use you little double for all the plains game you want!
The 9.3X74R double rifle is a rifle you will use on all deer,elk, moose, and bear in the USA. Like NE 450 No2, I find my 9.3X74R Merkel is my favorite double rifle for just about everything smaller than elephant, but I would not hesitate to shoot an elephant with it if that is what I had in my hands at the time!

Today my pair of rifles for Africa are the two Merkels a 470NE, and the 9.3X74R! Both can be replaced if lost, and both are rifle I shoot well!


....Mac >>>===(x)===> MacD37, ...and DUGABOY1
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"If I die today, I've had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"~ME 1982

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Posts: 14634 | Location: TEXAS | Registered: 08 June 2000Reply With Quote
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I am using the two ele option. I have a 470, and booked a multiple tuskless cow hunt this year with Buzz. Instead of bringing my 375 RUM as a back up rifle, I bought a 416 Rigby. I will bring both, may use the same gun or change over, and have something with a scope for other opportunities.
Like most people, I have far mor experience shooting a bolt, but still want the opportunity to take at least one with the "classic" weapon.
DGR's are admittedly expensive, but you may get more out of it someday than if you used the money to buy stocks.
 
Posts: 1981 | Location: South Dakota | Registered: 22 August 2004Reply With Quote
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I would either use the 416 or buy a 450NE-476WR double rifle and shoot the hell out of it before the trip. The double would be my choice for many reasons, but especially if I was thinking that I might do more elephant hunting.

Also, assuming your elephant hunt is a daytime tracking type hunt, I would get rid of any scope on the 416, if that is the rifle you choose, and become very familiar with the irons. The more so the earlier the season you are hunting.

The brain shot is the classic shot, and done correctly is imensely satisfying, but ~50% of hunters will miss it. If this is your one and only elephant hunt, and you do not want your PH joining the frey, talk to him about a heart shot. BIG target that a blind man can hit. And eles die quickly from a heart shot. Even from a relatively puny .416", .458" or .476" hole.

JPK


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Posts: 4900 | Location: Chevy Chase, Md. | Registered: 16 November 2004Reply With Quote
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Open sights are the plan with the 416, but will have a 1.1-4 Kahles on Talleys, with a 1.5-6 as a secondary scope for other opportunities. I had JJ put on one of the NECG skeletonized rear sights, and really like it. I was very well treated at Champlin. A problem or two needed sorting out (see earlier posts) but patience was well rewarded.
I would certainly prefer a classic brain shot, and will take my direction from Buzz. I can't say if this will be a one and only elephant hunt, but will treat it as such. None of us can predict the future. I'm glad I've taken the multiple cow option, in case it is my only ele hunt.
 
Posts: 1981 | Location: South Dakota | Registered: 22 August 2004Reply With Quote
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Oh what a curse to be faced with such a problem....may I please be cursed with it & may I never recover rotflmo


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Posts: 118 | Location: Margaritaville, Oregon | Registered: 30 April 2008Reply With Quote
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quote:
I would certainly prefer a classic brain shot, and will take my direction from Buzz


Gee, I hope you don't get stepped on.


-------------------------------
Will Stewart / Once you've been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun.
---------------------------------------
and, God Bless John Wayne.

NRA Benefactor Member, GOA, N.A.G.R.
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"Elephant and Elephant Guns" $99 shipped
“Hunting Africa's Dangerous Game" $20 shipped.

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_________________________

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Posts: 19373 | Location: Ocala Flats | Registered: 22 May 2002Reply With Quote
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Scott, I know exactly what you are talking about... I used a bolt rifle first my only choice but AHH the second time around and you know the rest is history...
That 416 has been by your side for a while and proved itself... I practiced with my double for a year before the 06 safari...

Mike


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Posts: 6768 | Location: Wyoming, Pa. USA | Registered: 17 April 2003Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Marty:
Open sights are the plan with the 416, but will have a 1.1-4 Kahles on Talleys, with a 1.5-6 as a secondary scope for other opportunities. I had JJ put on one of the NECG skeletonized rear sights, and really like it. I was very well treated at Champlin. A problem or two needed sorting out (see earlier posts) but patience was well rewarded.
I would certainly prefer a classic brain shot, and will take my direction from Buzz. I can't say if this will be a one and only elephant hunt, but will treat it as such. None of us can predict the future. I'm glad I've taken the multiple cow option, in case it is my only ele hunt.


Marty,

I was more responding to SBT's original post and his bull hunt. Bulls are a hell of a lot less likely to drop or even stagger from a close miss with a brain shot, and a hell of a lot more likely to spin and go remarkably quickly.

Bone up on Buzz's video for your tuskless hunt. Buzz will have you take brain shots. And your two choices should provide some margin for error on cows.

JPK


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Posts: 4900 | Location: Chevy Chase, Md. | Registered: 16 November 2004Reply With Quote
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For me an classic 21 day elephanthunt will be a "once of a lifetime"...so I would use my 10boredouble, and nothen` to spare. As my back-up rifle my .416Rigby would be taken along.
Elephanthunt just scream for a doublerifle + some long hard tracking days, with heat,sweat, bugs and a breathtaken scenery of africa. fishing


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Posts: 2805 | Location: Denmark | Registered: 09 June 2005Reply With Quote
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Regretfully (actually thankfully) the double I was considering sold and I haven't found another at a price I can afford. So, the RSM 416 Rigby it is!


"There are worse memorials to a life well-lived than a pair of elephant tusks." Robert Ruark
 
Posts: 4781 | Location: Story, WY / San Carlos, Sonora, MX | Registered: 29 May 2002Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by MJines:
quote:
Originally posted by TANZ-PH:
quote:
Originally posted by R.Jolly:
Stick with the 416.
1. It's plenty big enough (if you put it in the right place)
2. You shoot well with it (so your more likely to put it in the right place)


Well said...DITTO.


Tritto(?). Not even close in my mind. I have heard stories from PHs about experiences of folks trying to use 9.3x74Rs on elephant, not good.


Quatro ditto(?) or Amen Mike


"An individual with experience is never at the mercies of an individual with an argument"
 
Posts: 1827 | Location: Palmer AK & Prescott Valley AZ | Registered: 01 February 2005Reply With Quote
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