At what point is a rifle too heavy (in weight, not caliber) for African hunting ?
Once spent two weeks with a 60+ year old PH who had just had surgery on his Achilles tendon a few weeks before. He walked everywhere carrying a 13 pound double rifle plus shells.
For me, 11 pounds is my practical max for a long walk at a quick pace. 13 pounds is ok for a long walk at a moderate pace. 15 pounds is too much, period.
I heard about some weenie who had a 7.5 pound .416. Ouch. Better to lose a few pounds around the waist than to go to that extreme.
Posts: 18352 | Location: Salt Lake City, Utah USA | Registered: 20 April 2002
Seems like a few people are saying around 11 lbs. I was about to post a similar question about max weights for bigbore rifles which are to be carried in the field. I was thinking of getting my bigbore to weigh around 11 lbs. I noticed my deer rifle weighs around 10 lbs and I start feeling it a bit after a long walk and start moving it from sholder to sholder on the sling.
Nassos Roussso weighs around 130 lbs. During the elephant Champaign (AS WE LIKE TO CALL THOSE DAYS) he carried, for the most part, a 7 1/2 lb .458 Lott. It started out as a .458 Win. Mag but that's another story. Anyway, it was fired many times and accounted for many wounded elephants. I personally sighted the thing in (filed the iron sights) and split the fiberglass stock at the forend screw twice before the builder could get it to hold. I used a standing bench. It was a very practical gun for Nassos. He covered lots of ground in a day and prefered to carry his own rifle most of the time. Recoil is momentary but gravity goes on forever!< !--color-->
Rich Elliott
Posts: 2013 | Location: Crossville, IL 62827 USA | Registered: 07 February 2001
Quote: Recoil is momentary but gravity goes on forever!< !--color-->
Rich Elliott
Rich,
Very well said .
My personal limit is 10 pounds, but I prefer lighter. My 375 weighs just under 8 1/2 pounds, and is my favorite of all my general purpose rifles. I have used it on my last half dozen or so hunts, and do not want to go heavier again.
I have carried an 11 1/4 pound double at times, but it was not as comfortable for me. That is one of the main reasons that I don't have a 577 Nitro or larger double at present . Even the old elephant hunters did not carry their heavy double themselves in most cases.
Jim
Posts: 1206 | Location: Georgia | Registered: 21 July 2000
My 458 Lott is 9.3 pounds and I pack that bugger every day for months. It seems heavy to me after a long day and I'm in very fit condition. My 375HH is about a pound less and much easier to handle weight wise. The Lott is easier to pack around because it has no scope. The over the shoulder carry is much easier without a scope on the gun and relieves the weight being held in your hands. I have a sling on the rifle too but rarely use the sling when in the bush. I do use the sling across my back when I need two hands to climb a ridge or steep ledge.
I think the functional limit for me and probably for most folks is 10 pounds scoped and loaded. That is for a rifle you will pack all day. The bottom end for realistic recoil limits on a bigger rifle of 375 and up would be about 8.5 pounds. Those are the limits in my opinion not a suggested target weight. Somewhere in between those levels would be about right.
My 30/06 is 7.5 pounds scoped and loaded. It's an absolute dream to pack. Probably why I hunt so much with it!
Posts: 1261 | Location: Rural Wa. St. & Ellisras RSA | Registered: 06 March 2001
Quote: I have carried an 11 1/4 pound double at times, but it was not as comfortable for me. That is one of the main reasons that I don't have a 577 Nitro or larger double at present .
The above is the exact reason I got rid of my 577NE double rifle. At 14 lbs even,It was just too damn heavy to carry all day, and the jolt it handed out wasn't a pleasent thig either! My heaviest hunting rifle today is a 11 lb double rifle, and it is heavy for caliber, it is a 458RCBS. 9 1/2 lbs would be far better for this particular double!
I think a lot of folks look at the manufacturer's weight and think that is what they will be carrying. An 9lbs bolt rifle chambered for 458 LOTT,with a drop box holding 4 down, and one in the spout,If scoped in QD rings, and bases, will weigh in at around 11 lbs, and 10lbs unscoped but loaded. What I mean to say by all this is, most guys are carrying more than they think!
Posts: 14634 | Location: TEXAS | Registered: 08 June 2000
Most of the hunting was in the rain forest. Every thing very close. If the elephant didn't go down at the clients shot, Nassos gave him one. Then to, the follow ups usually resulted in a stand or a charge. Nassos was tusked once from behind (runing like hell I suspect). His size and weight helped save him as it pretty much just pushed him out of the way. How we kept from getting some one killed is still a miracle. Ah, the good old days!
Rich Elliott
Posts: 2013 | Location: Crossville, IL 62827 USA | Registered: 07 February 2001
Quote: Nassos Roussso weighs around 130 lbs. During the elephant Champaign (AS WE LIKE TO CALL THOSE DAYS) he carried, for the most part, a 7 1/2 lb .458 Lott...
This just begs for the paraphrasing of a joke about elephant hunting.
A 130 pound hunter fires a 7 1/2 pound 458 Lott at a 4500 pound elephant.
The elephant goes down. The hunter goes down. Whoever gets up first is the winner!
Quote: My 12-pound .416 Remington Magnum is going with me to Africa next year. I don't think it's too heavy.
Russ
My father's M-1 weighed about the 12-pound mark with a full load of ammo, buttstock full of cleaning gear, and an extra clip or two attached to the sling. He carried it from France to Germany with no major problems
Posts: 262 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 09 July 2004
IT all depends how you are carrying your rifle. If you are using a rifle strap like the Biathlon shooters are using then the rifle can be real haevy. If you plan to carry the rifle in the hand then it all depends how strong you are and even how big your hand is., the diameter of you rifle must fit your hand. My sonn can not carry my .500 Jeffery as fare as I can small hands small guns
Cheers,
Andr�
Posts: 2293 | Location: The Kingdom of Denmark | Registered: 13 January 2004
I just got my Ruger .458 Lott back from the smith, with Leupold scope, mercury tube and 4-rounds, weighs exactly 11.5lbs. At 1.5lbs more then the .416, I cannot imagine carrying anything heavier for any length of time (Will, here is where you get to call me a puss again ), and I'm not exactly small in structure.
Maybe I should start a separate topic...but anybody carry using the scope as a "handle"? The guide I had in Alaska swore by this, but I've never seen it done in Africa. After a few kilometers with the Lott over my shoulder, this might feel pretty good...
Posts: 3153 | Location: PA | Registered: 02 August 2002
I think that the lighter you are the better you can handle recoil because your body rolls with it.. Fat dudes like me on the other hand absorbs the recoil through the body. Aaron
Posts: 71 | Location: Kansas and Namibia | Registered: 07 January 2004
I would just feel wrong to hold on to what you are counting on.. Wait a minute I have done that many times....
When This question comes up it feels like people want to hear that they can get that big bore rifle that weighs 9lbs and is easy to handle but the fact is that if you want a big bore killer in a + 45 cal then you must get a heavy and well constructed rifle and have some strength and stubernness.
Cheers,
Andr�
Cheers,
Andr�
Posts: 2293 | Location: The Kingdom of Denmark | Registered: 13 January 2004
This thing would be a perfect candidate to rebore for 500x3" Nitro-for-Black-Powder Express .
Mbogo375, Yes it is a prototype of the origenal SER # 136, and is damn heavy to carry for long! It is very muzzle heavy as well! I think you are quite right about the 500X3" NFB, I have been thinking of either re-boreing to 500, or if I stay with the .458 dia., I've been thinking of milling the barrels down to octagon from 4" in front of the chamber end to muzzles, to balance it better, and to lighten it up some!
Posts: 14634 | Location: TEXAS | Registered: 08 June 2000
This is a good topic, as "what's too heavy" involves a myriad of variables and what is not heavy, one day, can be a telephone pole, the next. Prevailing weather, the lay of the land, the length of time afield, age, rifle weight, configuration and point of balance can all come into play. Hunt hard enough or long enough and this will come to pass. As with recoil tolerance, I view this subject as another crucial area where one must place ego aside, learn from experience and formulate an honest answer. To date, I've built my Africa guns rather light, but for good reason. I've learned that I now dehydrate faster than just a few years ago but also that I can deal with the heavier recoil of the light for caliber rifle. With that, I now find myself entertaining the foregoing of dropped-box magazines at the balance point, facilitating ease of carrying, going with smaller but still adequate cartridges. For each of us, when the time comes, concessions must be made.
My Searcy 470 NE weighed 11.25 lbs loaded and was all I wanted on a N NM cow elk hunt. I could've carried it all day in MUCH flatter terrain and could've shot it accurately. But I decided I'd rather use a bolt rifle and carry a couple of lbs less when I finally get to chase Cape buff. So, it'll be a 404 Jeff that weighs 9.5 lbs loaded unless I run into him when carrying my 375 H&H.
Posts: 6711 | Location: Oklahoma, USA | Registered: 14 March 2001
Quote: My heaviest hunting rifle today is a 11 lb double rifle, and it is heavy for caliber, it is a 458RCBS. 9 1/2 lbs would be far better for this particular double!
Mac,
Is that your Trail Guns Armory double?
I just picked up the used TGA double this afternoon that I purchased recently. I was under the impression that it was supposed to weigh about 10 pounds, but it felt VERY HEAVY . When I got it home, I slipped a leather-covered recoil pad on to extend the length of pull a half inch and weighed it. The rifle plus pad weighed 11 1/4 pounds . I can now see why they are heavy enough to rechamber to 450 No2 . This thing would be a perfect candidate to rebore for 500x3" Nitro-for-Black-Powder Express . The barrels are .820 at the muzzle for goodness sake!!!!!
This is definitely the right double for the heavy-for-caliber camp, but I wouldn't want to carry it all day. It would weigh nearly 12 pounds with sling, recoil pad, and ammo, ready to go (not to mention that I normally use an elastic shell carrier on the buttstock rather than a culling belt).
Jim
Posts: 1206 | Location: Georgia | Registered: 21 July 2000
Quote: I think that the lighter you are the better you can handle recoil because your body rolls with it.. Fat dudes like me on the other hand absorbs the recoil through the body. Aaron
Aaron I absolutely agree with the above! When I only weighed 145 lbs I could shoot anything, without a problem. As you say I simply moved with the rifle, but now that I weigh 220 lbs, I absorb the whole punch!
Posts: 14634 | Location: TEXAS | Registered: 08 June 2000
This thing would be a perfect candidate to rebore for 500x3" Nitro-for-Black-Powder Express .
Mbogo375, Yes it is a prototype of the origenal SER # 136, and is damn heavy to carry for long! It is very muzzle heavy as well! I think you are quite right about the 500X3" NFB, I have been thinking of either re-boreing to 500, or if I stay with the .458 dia., I've been thinking of milling the barrels down to octagon from 4" in front of the chamber end to muzzles, to balance it better, and to lighten it up some!
Mac,
Let me know if you find a deal on either of these conversions, as I would be very interested in doing my rifle at the same time.
Jim
Posts: 1206 | Location: Georgia | Registered: 21 July 2000
. Even the old elephant hunters did not carry their heavy double themselves in most cases.
. I can now see why they are heavy enough to rechamber to 450 No2 
