Folks, should we not ask Saeed to implement some sort of screening/vetting procedure before people are allowed to advertise hunts on AR?

Most of the outfitters posting are the good guys, although competition might be fierce sometimes. It creates a healthy market.

But I have noticed some really shady advertisements from people on there, and I know they are only sitting behind a laptop somewhere trying to punt hunts, without knowing the area or the operators personally.

This create a very bad buying environment for some of our uninformed members?

My suggestion is that if someone wants to advertise their hunts, they should at least be recommended by two AR members.

Let's take Jan Dumon for instance who recently joined our ranks. I know both me and Aaron would have immediately vouched for him (And probably a hundred more guys)

But some of these people are not doing this right.....no proof....yet....but someone is going to get seriously burned.

Maybe it is not important, I think it is.

From a warmer, sunny South Africa!

Charl,

Personally, I think that as it's Saeed's forum it should be him that makes the rules & he details the rules for that forum perfectly clearly at the top of it & to me at least, they're perfectly adequate & if he required a proposer & seconder then it'd run the risk of becoming a bit like an old boy's club.

Sure a few dodgy offers get posted but most get sussed out fairly quickly.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Gentlemen,

Some of you don't seem to bother to read our rules at the top of this forumn. And continue to post offers which are lacking in all the relevant details.

We have put up this forum for the benefit of both you and your prospective clients.

We don't ask anything in return, except that you post ALL the details of the hunt.

Such as:

Price
Species on offer
Date
Location
Who is going to be the PH
In addition to what I have as ked for on my post at the top of this forum.

I am going to start making a note of those outfitters that do not post all the details, and I have to deleted their offers.

If I have to delete 3 offers from any one outfitter, the outfitter will not be allowed to post any more hunts on AR.

It has gotten quite bad lately, that I have to deleted some offers almost on a daily basis.

Thank you Steve, you about reflected my own idea too.

The purpose of that forum was to have a dedicated forum for outfitters and professionals to offer their hunts.

Our only stipulation is that all the relevant details are posted.

We have had a few who did not follow this very simple rule - the only reason we made it was to avoid any misunderstandings, and to shows us all that the offer is transparent and has no hidden costs.

I don't want to get involved in something we do not have any control over.

Clients here are well aware of what is going on, hence the fact that shady characters have never had much of a chance here.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by infinito:
Folks, should we not ask Saeed to implement some sort of screening/vetting procedure before people are allowed to advertise hunts on AR?
QUOTE]

No, we should not.

Firstly, this is a "free" site (free to members, that is), and as such we certainly have no right to ask the host to take on more work and more expense on top of what he is already providing.

Second, vetting an outfitter, PH or other principal in a transaction is only as good as the sources contacted--we would still have no iron-clad assurance that the operation in question is legitimate--or that while it was great last year, this year it fell apart; not an uncommon occurrence, especially in Africa.

Third, when one put his "stamp of approval" or something, there is the very real issue of liability if the event, and the customer's money, go south.

Finally, as adults it's our primary responsibility to do our own due diligence and not count on someone else to take care of us . . . or weed out our competition.

So no, Saeed has no obligation or need to examine those offering hunts or other goods and services, as long as they follow his rules.

I agree with Nitro. Personally I don't care to have "all" details of a hunt posted. First off, that is really impossible as most hunts have volumes of details depending on the person who is inquiring. Keep it simple, tell me who you are, where I can get in touch with you and what you are offering. If interested "I" will take the necessary steps to check things out, ask questions, and make a decision. Saeed should not have to "police" each and every outfitter who posts here. Most of us are grownups and can figure things out ourselves. (Sometimes???)

Larry Sellers
SCI (International) Life Member

Agreed. Self-policing works on this website.
We have had scams, partial scams, semi scams and then there is Blair Worldwide scam.

Sooner or later, scammers get found out here.

Charl, I understand your concern but isn't it my job as the consumer to do my research before booking a hunt? Blank vouches for you and I trust him very much but at the same time there are different ideas, hunts, etc for every person and it is my job to research, get input and then make the decision.

One man's garbage is another man's treasure. Not every hunt is for every person.

As a small time agent I don't really agree with the policing and the idea of having two AR members vouch for me. I honestly only know a few AR members from chatting online or over the phone. I know one personally but he hasn't posted here in quite some time. I think this is one of the better forums for self policing offered hunts, and while sometimes it gets out of hand, it is usually harmful only to shady characters.

I've done a few hunts that I booked over forums. I always did my research first and I've yet to have a bad experience. I think everyone here has a pretty good idea of what's legit and what isn't. I don't expect Saeed to steer me clear of a shady outfit at a convention that he knows nothing about, why should he be expected to do that here?

I have just paid deposit on my first African hunt.

While I have dreamed and fantacised about a lot of the offers, I actively corresponded with 5 or 6 outfitters in 4 countries.

It was clear in my mind that the options were South Africa (with my wife), Zimbabwe for buffalo, Zambia for an AR group hunt that would have been great fun & Mozambique also for buffalo.

I did a lot of reading & analysing - with a big Excel spreadsheet. The more analysis I did the clearer it became that the real cheap offers were not really worth traveling all the way from New Zealand.

In the end it was quite easy to short list the options. I did end up with one for each country but 3 for Zim.

I would not hesitate to book with any of the 6 people I have corresponded with.

I am sure there are many other great offers & the options are plenty.

Thank folks, that settles that then! IT makes a lot of sense what y'all say!

Cheers,

Thanks folks, that settles that then!

IT makes sense what y'all are saying.