I was asked about escrow accounts and how they work.

And I am afraid I had no answer.

Some think all money is kept in this account until the end of the hunt.

This sounds not so true as African PHs I have spoken to say they MUST have all the daily rate money before the hunt starts??

What are the facts?

Saeed,
I think your title terminology is probably most correct with respect to the Safari application??!!

I am not an attorney, thankfully, however as an old Corporate controller type (financial) with an MBA, and a real estate broker license, now retired, I relate escrow more to real estate. Where 2 parties enter into a buyer, seller relationship, seller takes the title "to escrow" with a Title Company or Law firm, buyers funds are placed into "escrow," title docs are prepared and signed by both parties, titles are researched to ensure they are free of leins, the buyer receives the title and it is recorded with the County recorder/ Assessor/treasurer, the Seller receives his proceeds, less real estate commissions and escrow fees.

I think what they really mean is "trust account" which can be any legitimate party, but usually a bank;or law firm, Booking Agent, funds held in designated trust account in a bank, and where parties agree, ie Country of hunter/depositor, or Country of Hunting Company, currency may be an issue. The trust account is set up for the benefit of the Hunting Company in our situation, however with protection strings to the depositing party, ie our hunter. The deposit is made when the contract is signed, and can only be disbursed when date or terms are met in the agreement. The terms are agreed to by contracting parties, and terms must be clear, and what might trigger return to depositing party, ie government cancellation of concession, or death or illness of either party....or hopefully the beginning/ending of a successful safari. It could be set up to receive 25-33% at signing, and then maybe balance 30 days before safari, maybe some REFUNDABLE deposit of trophy fees....I certainly would NOT ever deposit 100%, or trophy fees unless 30-60 days before hunt!!

Hunters SHOULD NEVER BE BANKERS FOR HUNTING COMPANIES!! There are Banks for that, just like farmers go to the bank to get loans for seed and fertilizer for planting!! If a Hunting company isn't strong enough to fund concessions and setting up for hunts, or doesn't have mutual in his clients, I wouldn't book with them!!

In other words it can be what ever both parties agree to!! It is filed with a bank or law firm, booking agent, who interprets the agreement and makes disbursements accordingly. Charging fees for service. Both parties have control and approval to disburse funds.

I hope this helps, this is basic, and could be very complex based on circumstances and parties requirements!! It should not be taken lightly, or assumed it will be handled diligently unless both parties agree to rules!! Read the terms and conditions!!

Thank you.

I understand that much.

But the confusion arises from some outfitters in the US who claim to hold all the money until the end of the hunt.

This is direct conflict to what PHs say.

That a large deposit is made months, or years, ahead.

And the balance of the daily rate well ahead of the start of the hunt.

Trophy fees are paid at the end of the hunt.

Unless you are a crooked outfit and demand NON REFUNDABLE trophy fees in advance!

.

I believe that the only reason for this post is for Saeed to stir the shit again and have his weekly rant about Buzz being a crook, a thief and a criminal!

Funny however how every second report on the Africa hunt reports is CMS, so I guess they must be doing something right! Since Cal's very sad passing, Mark Sullivan seems to have taken a back seat to Buzz!




.

quote:

Originally posted by Charlie64:
.

I believe that the only reason for this post is for Saeed to stir the shit again and have his weekly rant about Buzz being a crook, a thief and a criminal!

Funny however how every second report on the Africa hunt reports is CMS, so I guess they must be doing something right! Since Cal's very sad passing, Mark Sullivan seems to have taken a back seat to Buzz!




.

Would you pay non refundable trophy fees??

My reason is some American outfitters aren’t telling the whole truth.

Not a single African professional hunter said he would accept his daily payments being help by an agent until after the hunt.

Demanding non refundable trophy fees is on a different planet!

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by Charlie64:
.

I believe that the only reason for this post is for Saeed to stir the shit again and have his weekly rant about Buzz being a crook, a thief and a criminal!

Funny however how every second report on the Africa hunt reports is CMS, so I guess they must be doing something right! Since Cal's very sad passing, Mark Sullivan seems to have taken a back seat to Buzz!




.

Would you pay non refundable trophy fees??

My reason is some American outfitters aren’t telling the whole truth.

Not a single African professional hunter said he would accept his daily payments being help by an agent until after the hunt.

Demanding non refundable trophy fees is on a different planet!

The only funds typically held in a separate third party account (like you said typically in the US by a trusted agent) are the trophy fees. This gives the outfitter piece of mind that the monies are there, verified, and will be paid upon completion of the hunt. It simultaneously gives the hunter piece of mind that they don’t have to transport large sums of money, budgeting, and if they don’t shoot the allotted amount their money will likewise be returned by a trusted part.
I believe the root of the question (or part of it) is when you hear this people don’t differentiate in their comments that this does not apply to the daily rates as that is “generally understood”. It is for the balance of the hunt

.

I understand that re day fees and yes most (not only Africa) want them upfront. Many times I have settled day fees on arrival in cash. I get the idea of not wanting to take large amounts of cash when flying and hence placing it with an agent as escrow where the parties don't know each other. In Africa I have never been asked to lodge deposits up front and always settled my accounts on or after departure.

The only hunt where I paid all upfront was Kyrgyzstan in 2019, which was riddled with balls-ups and where the trophies never made it home! They are lucky it was paid up front as I would have held back cash on that one pending safe receipt of the trophies.....


.

quote:

Originally posted by Charlie64:
.

I believe that the only reason for this post is for Saeed to stir the shit again and have his weekly rant about Buzz being a crook, a thief and a criminal!

Funny however how every second report on the Africa hunt reports is CMS, so I guess they must be doing something right! Since Cal's very sad passing, Mark Sullivan seems to have taken a back seat to Buzz!




.

Ain't that the truth. Afraid Saeed has joined Alice and fallen through the looking glass. One outfitter controls his own safari areas, plows money back into anti-poaching efforts, produces legions of successful hunt reports by satisfied forum members many of whom are repeat clients . . . he is a crook. On the other hand, another outfitter sells a forum member an expensive hunt in a closed concession, gets the client to pay an $80,000 deposit to the concession operator who apparently uses the money to refund deposits on other hunts, then when the client is left holding the bag tells the client to go deal with the operator it's not his problem . . . he is an innocent victim. You really cannot make this stuff up.

Folks,

To the initial question most safari operators and outfitters I deal with will want everything paid other than the trophy fees before the start of the safari or hunt. As that money comes in it goes almost immediately to the hunt company. Unless we are instructed otherwise the only money we hold back are trophy fee deposits which only go to the hunt company once we know exactly what the hunter has shot.

Happy Thanksgiving!

Mark

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Charlie64:
.

I believe that the only reason for this post is for Saeed to stir the shit again and have his weekly rant about Buzz being a crook, a thief and a criminal!

Funny however how every second report on the Africa hunt reports is CMS, so I guess they must be doing something right! Since Cal's very sad passing, Mark Sullivan seems to have taken a back seat to Buzz!




.

Ain't that the truth. Afraid Saeed has joined Alice and fallen through the looking glass. One outfitter controls his own safari areas, plows money back into anti-poaching efforts, produces legions of successful hunt reports by satisfied forum members many of whom are repeat clients . . . he is a crook. On the other hand, another outfitter sells a forum member an expensive hunt in a closed concession, gets the client to pay an $80,000 deposit to the concession operator who apparently uses the money to refund deposits on other hunts, then when the client is left holding the bag tells the client to go deal with the operator it's not his problem . . . he is an innocent victim. You really cannot make this stuff up.

Exactly!

You cannot make this up!

Pay non refundable trophy fees or you don’t hunt!

Who would even IMAGINE such a stupid policy from anyone??

If a prospective client didn’t bring it up here, that stupid policy would most probably be still in effect!

We do weed out the crooks!

“They complain about me demanding non refundable trophy fees! So I am NOT going to come back here”

GOOD RIDDANCE!

Saeed, a suggestion for you. You might also mention it to Andrew. Will Rogers once said, if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging. Good advice.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Saeed, a suggestion for you. You might also mention it to Andrew. Will Rogers once said, if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging. Good advice.

Maybe some of you fucking ass clowns could grow up and stop making all the threads go to shit. Some come here to learn things and read stuff that may help them.

Saeed,

More than a few hunters have had to pay the trophy fees before departing.

Guess what, when they never were able to take the Leopard or Lion that they were looking for....

Now hear this, the hunter did not receive a refund for the trophy fee's that were paid for the animal's that they did not have a chance to take.

This happens, so that make's a hunter look real close at who one is booking with.

Almost all hunters have to put a deposit down to secure your hunting dates, then prior to departure you will need to have the remaining daily fees paid. Usually 30 days before you depart.

I also have visited with PH's from different countries that require you to have a X amount of money paid before departure for trophy fees on top of the daily fees. this amount varied on the duration of the days booked. nothing was in the paperwork to indicate that a refund would be forth coming if you were un successful.

So to target Buzz, is being unfair, for putting in place what others have been doing for years.

BINGO, Saeed!!

Sadly I have been ripped off several times by African outfitters or PHs, and about 80% screw rate with Booking Agents!! Including my first trip to Africa specifically booking the owner/PH....booked by personal friend/ agent!!

There is very good reason to put daily rate money in a Trust account they I have the trigger points!! Depending on the operator, if anything more than a 25-33% deposit advanced before the hunt to secure dates. What if the operator is a no show or a stand in?? I think most operators think that if you have flown halfway around the world, you will stay, regardless of conditions!! NOPE, NOT ME!!

I will NEVER book a hunt with trophy fees included, as in a Caprivi Buff hunt now offered on AR in OUTFITTER DUSCOUNTED OR CANCELATION hunts!! What us daily rate and what us trophy fee, on $17k 7 day Buff hunt!! What if you don't pull the trigger?? Is there a refund??

There are about 4 Booking Agents presently I would book with!! I have more hunting experience than most, and international travel and business experience!! I

Now with all of the "hangers on" between the PH/OUTFITTERS, and your trophies arriving home, we now have another element of financial commitment and chance to be ripped off!!

And finally, it is sad that even some of the high profile hunters, will knowingly refuse to pay at the end of a safari... Outfitters must protect themselves!! Then that affects all of us honorable clients!!

Go Figure, Glad I am old and most of my great hunts are behind me, and I have a FULL TROPHY ROOM!!

Has international hunting become "Honor among Thieves??!!"

Well now that UK has banned import of trophies, and Canada has just shut down import of Elephant and Rhino imports... the sun is setting on our Sport!!

Let's be clear regarding CMS ... once again.

The prepaid trophy fees were for 2, count them, two, species ONLY. And it was ONLY for hunters desiring to hunt those 2 species in a concession that CMS didn't control. The controlling outfitter forced CMS to prepay for those 2 species if CMS had a hunter wanting to target those species, ONLY. This is because the controlling outfitter had limited quota for those 2 species and would forfeit their ability to sell those animals to their own clients if they were promised to CMS.

CMS had a couple of hunters reserve those species, in that concession not controlled by CMS, then refused to hunt them once they had been purchased by CMS on their behalf, leaving CMS holding the bag.

BUT ... here is the kicker ... CMS reversed the policy and never charged a single client a pre-paid trophy fee for hunting those 2 species in the concession they didn't control, nor any other concession. No client was forced to do anything regarding prepaid trophy fees. It was simply asked for if they wanted to hunt either or both of those 2 limited quota species in that specific area not controlled by CMS. Once it became evident this was not popular with clients, CMS dropped the policy and continued to operate in a manner where CMS were at risk of paying for said limited quota species should a client reserve them and later decide to pass.

This may have been an unpopular policy but was clearly stated, giving clients an opportunity to make the choice of reserving the quota or not. Nothing "crooked" about it. Period.

Now ... CROOKED ... is selling a hunt in a concession that's closed, then when it becomes clear the concession isn't going to open for said hunt, an additional $20,000 is taken, without informing the client the concession is still closed, then using said deposit funds to pay the other clients refunds for hunts sold in that same closed concession.

For me, the choice between the two outfits in question is clear. I previously inquired about hunting Zambia with Fairgame. For whatever reason, that hunt never materialized. After this fiasco with Cory and his un-refunded $80,000 deposit, I'd never consider it now. After 6 safaris with CMS, I will be booking with them again. Hopefully soon. If wrong, I'll stand corrected but I do believe CMS now controls the concession in question that started the controversy. And they don't request or require pre-paid trophy fees for those 2 specific, limited quota species. On that I'm 100% sure.

quote:

Originally posted by Bwana338:
Saeed,

More than a few hunters have had to pay the trophy fees before departing.

Guess what, when they never were able to take the Leopard or Lion that they were looking for....

Now hear this, the hunter did not receive a refund for the trophy fee's that were paid for the animal's that they did not have a chance to take.

This happens, so that make's a hunter look real close at who one is booking with.

Almost all hunters have to put a deposit down to secure your hunting dates, then prior to departure you will need to have the remaining daily fees paid. Usually 30 days before you depart.

I also have visited with PH's from different countries that require you to have a X amount of money paid before departure for trophy fees on top of the daily fees. this amount varied on the duration of the days booked. nothing was in the paperwork to indicate that a refund would be forth coming if you were un successful.

So to target Buzz, is being unfair, for putting in place what others have been doing for years.

I have paid trophy fees in advance.

BY CHOICE!

Because I did not want to carry money with me.

Buzz, on the other hand, made it an OBLIGATION!

There is a world of difference between the two.

I used escrow accounts early in my hunting career, before I developed relationships. They are used when the parties don't truly trust each other.

Now, I hunt with people I know and trust and they trust me. I send them an estimated amount that may or may not be adequate. Sometimes I send a wire as soon as I return to cover the deficit and sometimes I let any overage ride to next year.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Let's be clear regarding CMS ... once again.

The prepaid trophy fees were for 2, count them, two, species ONLY. And it was ONLY for hunters desiring to hunt those 2 species in a concession that CMS didn't control. The controlling outfitter forced CMS to prepay for those 2 species if CMS had a hunter wanting to target those species, ONLY. This is because the controlling outfitter had limited quota for those 2 species and would forfeit their ability to sell those animals to their own clients if they were promised to CMS.

CMS had a couple of hunters reserve those species, in that concession not controlled by CMS, then refused to hunt them once they had been purchased by CMS on their behalf, leaving CMS holding the bag.

BUT ... here is the kicker ... CMS reversed the policy and never charged a single client a pre-paid trophy fee for hunting those 2 species in the concession they didn't control, nor any other concession. No client was forced to do anything regarding prepaid trophy fees. It was simply asked for if they wanted to hunt either or both of those 2 limited quota species in that specific area not controlled by CMS. Once it became evident this was not popular with clients, CMS dropped the policy and continued to operate in a manner where CMS were at risk of paying for said limited quota species should a client reserve them and later decide to pass.

This may have been an unpopular policy but was clearly stated, giving clients an opportunity to make the choice of reserving the quota or not. Nothing "crooked" about it. Period.

Now ... CROOKED ... is selling a hunt in a concession that's closed, then when it becomes clear the concession isn't going to open for said hunt, an additional $20,000 is taken, without informing the client the concession is still closed, then using said deposit funds to pay the other clients refunds for hunts sold in that same closed concession.

For me, the choice between the two outfits in question is clear. I previously inquired about hunting Zambia with Fairgame. For whatever reason, that hunt never materialized. After this fiasco with Cory and his un-refunded $80,000 deposit, I'd never consider it now. After 6 safaris with CMS, I will be booking with them again. Hopefully soon. If wrong, I'll stand corrected but I do believe CMS now controls the concession in question that started the controversy. And they don't request or require pre-paid trophy fees for those 2 specific, limited quota species. On that I'm 100% sure.

100% correct.

I will say that I totally get the issue. However , the first attempt to solve the problem was not well thought out. It could have been handled differently.

No client was ever actually charged trophy fees in advance .

470EDDY,

FYI:The TROPHY IMPORT BAN to the UK did not go through.

Mark

quote:

Originally posted by Bwana338:
Saeed,

More than a few hunters have had to pay the trophy fees before departing.

Guess what, when they never were able to take the Leopard or Lion that they were looking for....

Now hear this, the hunter did not receive a refund for the trophy fee's that were paid for the animal's that they did not have a chance to take.

This happens, so that make's a hunter look real close at who one is booking with.

Almost all hunters have to put a deposit down to secure your hunting dates, then prior to departure you will need to have the remaining daily fees paid. Usually 30 days before you depart.

I also have visited with PH's from different countries that require you to have a X amount of money paid before departure for trophy fees on top of the daily fees. this amount varied on the duration of the days booked. nothing was in the paperwork to indicate that a refund would be forth coming if you were un successful.

So to target Buzz, is being unfair, for putting in place what others have been doing for years.

bwana338,

Where did you get that info in the first four lines of your post? The hunter paid for trophy fees up front, did not get his animals and did not get a refund. I've never heard of anything like that.

Mark

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:

quote:

Originally posted by Bwana338:
Saeed,

More than a few hunters have had to pay the trophy fees before departing.

Guess what, when they never were able to take the Leopard or Lion that they were looking for....

Now hear this, the hunter did not receive a refund for the trophy fee's that were paid for the animal's that they did not have a chance to take.

This happens, so that make's a hunter look real close at who one is booking with.

Almost all hunters have to put a deposit down to secure your hunting dates, then prior to departure you will need to have the remaining daily fees paid. Usually 30 days before you depart.

I also have visited with PH's from different countries that require you to have a X amount of money paid before departure for trophy fees on top of the daily fees. this amount varied on the duration of the days booked. nothing was in the paperwork to indicate that a refund would be forth coming if you were un successful.

So to target Buzz, is being unfair, for putting in place what others have been doing for years.

bwana338,

Where did you get that info in the first four lines of your post? The hunter paid for trophy fees up front, did not get his animals and did not get a refund. I've never heard of anything like that.

Mark

Mark,

There have been occasions when this has happened.

Not sure if it was posted on here or I got privately.

Saeed,

You've jogged my old brain. I do remember a guy who had paid everything up front for an elephant hunt and got totally screwed. I don't remember anything about a cat hunt though.

Mark

I am incredibly inexperienced and perhaps equally naive as I have only traveled to Africa once on Safari. However for that trip I sent a deposit equaling 50% of the day fee three months in advance and settled up remaining day fee, videographer fee in total, and all trophy fees by wire at safari's conclusion. In point of fact, the outfitter did not receive their payment until I was actually home.
I can't imagine sending more than that halfway around the world to a country/continent known to be corrupt and coming off a pandemic that created financial hardship to the entire industry.
I expect to return again soon and will not be hunting with any outfitter that requires my resources to float his boat.

quote:

Originally posted by swm:
I am incredibly inexperienced and perhaps equally naive as I have only traveled to Africa once on Safari. However for that trip I sent a deposit equaling 50% of the day fee three months in advance and settled up remaining day fee, videographer fee in total, and all trophy fees by wire at safari's conclusion. In point of fact, the outfitter did not receive their payment until I was actually home.
I can't imagine sending more than that halfway around the world to a country/continent known to be corrupt and coming off a pandemic that created financial hardship to the entire industry.
I expect to return again soon and will not be hunting with any outfitter that requires my resources to float his boat.

Ideally, this is how it should be done.

But, sadly, just as we have crooked outfitters, we do have even more crooked clients.

Hear of one who paid his trophy fees by Travellers Cheques - wonder how many remember these??.

As soon as he got home, he reported them stolen!

The outfitter got nothing!!

Yep, that was llamapacker who occasionally posts here IIRC…..

Meanwhile, Buzz and Myles continue to create great memories for hunters as evidenced here by all the terrific hunt reports, act as stewards of the land and animals that they help manage including via aggressive anti-poaching activities (DAPU), employ many local people, support staff, and numerous reputable professional hunters, and benefit the communities which they have partnered with. For example, from Myles recently:

quote:

We just commissioned the building of a new classroom block at Gonono Primary School. Hope it is ready by end of Feb. 2024. A massive thank you to the Jack and Marjorie Schillinger Foundation for their donations and ... another well wisher who wishes to remain anonymous!

…and from Dallas Safari Club:

quote:

DSC Foundation is proud to continue its longstanding support of DAPU. This recent grant will provide fuel and maintenance for the two DSC Foundation Landcruisers that play a vital role in this incredibly successful Zimbabwe-based anti-poaching initiative.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill C:
Meanwhile, Buzz and Myles continue to create great memories for hunters as evidenced here by all the terrific hunt reports, act as stewards of the land and animals that they help manage including via aggressive anti-poaching activities (DAPU), employ many local people, support staff, and numerous reputable professional hunters, and benefit the communities which they have partnered with. For example, from Myles recently:

quote:

We just commissioned the building of a new classroom block at Gonono Primary School. Hope it is ready by end of Feb. 2024. A massive thank you to the Jack and Marjorie Schillinger Foundation for their donations and ... another well wisher who wishes to remain anonymous!

…and from Dallas Safari Club:

quote:

DSC Foundation is proud to continue its longstanding support of DAPU. This recent grant will provide fuel and maintenance for the two DSC Foundation Landcruisers that play a vital role in this incredibly successful Zimbabwe-based anti-poaching initiative.

Excellent. I guess some people have trouble distinguishing between crooks and genuine stewards of the land , people, and the game animals….

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:

quote:

Originally posted by Bill C:
Meanwhile, Buzz and Myles continue to create great memories for hunters as evidenced here by all the terrific hunt reports, act as stewards of the land and animals that they help manage including via aggressive anti-poaching activities (DAPU), employ many local people, support staff, and numerous reputable professional hunters, and benefit the communities which they have partnered with. For example, from Myles recently:

quote:

We just commissioned the building of a new classroom block at Gonono Primary School. Hope it is ready by end of Feb. 2024. A massive thank you to the Jack and Marjorie Schillinger Foundation for their donations and ... another well wisher who wishes to remain anonymous!

…and from Dallas Safari Club:

quote:

DSC Foundation is proud to continue its longstanding support of DAPU. This recent grant will provide fuel and maintenance for the two DSC Foundation Landcruisers that play a vital role in this incredibly successful Zimbabwe-based anti-poaching initiative.

Excellent. I guess some people have trouble distinguishing between crooks and genuine stewards of the land , people, and the game animals….

Some genuine stewards get drunk sometimes and do stupid things!

Like who??

Just an FYI, for those of you wishing to hunt in Ethiopia be prepared to pay 100% of the trophy fees in advance and don't ask for a refund if you don't shoot what you went for because you are not going to get a refund.

ETHIOPIAN GOVT. RULES


Arjun Reddy
Hunters Networks LLC
www.huntersnetworks.com
30 Ivy Hill Road
Brewster, NY 10509
Tel: +1 845 259 3628

Watch GUNSTIX Shooting Sticks in action
Short version https://youtu.be/HYoF1nR9JFo?si=aUeCBW_G5OJAK26f
Long version https://youtu.be/NJ96K8T-ttc

2024 SHOW BOOTHS:
DSC (Dallas 11th-14th January) booth #950
SCI (Nashville 31st Jan-3rd Feb) booth #411
Western Hunting and Conservation Expo (Salt lake city 15th-18th February) booth # 319

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:

quote:

Originally posted by Bill C:
Meanwhile, Buzz and Myles continue to create great memories for hunters as evidenced here by all the terrific hunt reports, act as stewards of the land and animals that they help manage including via aggressive anti-poaching activities (DAPU), employ many local people, support staff, and numerous reputable professional hunters, and benefit the communities which they have partnered with. For example, from Myles recently:

quote:

We just commissioned the building of a new classroom block at Gonono Primary School. Hope it is ready by end of Feb. 2024. A massive thank you to the Jack and Marjorie Schillinger Foundation for their donations and ... another well wisher who wishes to remain anonymous!

…and from Dallas Safari Club:

quote:

DSC Foundation is proud to continue its longstanding support of DAPU. This recent grant will provide fuel and maintenance for the two DSC Foundation Landcruisers that play a vital role in this incredibly successful Zimbabwe-based anti-poaching initiative.

Excellent. I guess some people have trouble distinguishing between crooks and genuine stewards of the land , people, and the game animals….

Some genuine stewards get drunk sometimes and do stupid things!

. . . the more you post on this, the dumber you look.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:

quote:

Originally posted by Bill C:
Meanwhile, Buzz and Myles continue to create great memories for hunters as evidenced here by all the terrific hunt reports, act as stewards of the land and animals that they help manage including via aggressive anti-poaching activities (DAPU), employ many local people, support staff, and numerous reputable professional hunters, and benefit the communities which they have partnered with. For example, from Myles recently:

quote:

We just commissioned the building of a new classroom block at Gonono Primary School. Hope it is ready by end of Feb. 2024. A massive thank you to the Jack and Marjorie Schillinger Foundation for their donations and ... another well wisher who wishes to remain anonymous!

…and from Dallas Safari Club:

quote:

DSC Foundation is proud to continue its longstanding support of DAPU. This recent grant will provide fuel and maintenance for the two DSC Foundation Landcruisers that play a vital role in this incredibly successful Zimbabwe-based anti-poaching initiative.

Excellent. I guess some people have trouble distinguishing between crooks and genuine stewards of the land , people, and the game animals….

Some genuine stewards get drunk sometimes and do stupid things!

. . . the more you post on this, the dumber you look.

I have aloooong way to go to catch up with stupid lawyers.

And even more stupid professional hunters, too stupid to realize making money off people on a website, screwing himself with his new policy, and blaming them!

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:

quote:

Originally posted by Bill C:
Meanwhile, Buzz and Myles continue to create great memories for hunters as evidenced here by all the terrific hunt reports, act as stewards of the land and animals that they help manage including via aggressive anti-poaching activities (DAPU), employ many local people, support staff, and numerous reputable professional hunters, and benefit the communities which they have partnered with. For example, from Myles recently:

quote:

We just commissioned the building of a new classroom block at Gonono Primary School. Hope it is ready by end of Feb. 2024. A massive thank you to the Jack and Marjorie Schillinger Foundation for their donations and ... another well wisher who wishes to remain anonymous!

…and from Dallas Safari Club:

quote:

DSC Foundation is proud to continue its longstanding support of DAPU. This recent grant will provide fuel and maintenance for the two DSC Foundation Landcruisers that play a vital role in this incredibly successful Zimbabwe-based anti-poaching initiative.

Excellent. I guess some people have trouble distinguishing between crooks and genuine stewards of the land , people, and the game animals….

Hear! Hear!

.

Put your money in an escrow account via an agent (who charges 20% of the daily rates) and when the deposit is paid and things go tits up is the agent responsible for a full refund?

When things go wrong, ie the terms are not satisfied, the escrowing agent shall release your money back to you.

Instead of a crooked outfitter and a dishonest ph ting hide the ball w one’s funds.

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
Put your money in an escrow account via an agent (who charges 20% of the daily rates) and when the deposit is paid and things go tits up is the agent responsible for a full refund?

Interesting.

But we seem to understand that only the trophy fees are kept, not the daily rates.

Does that mean the agent still charges 20%?

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
Put your money in an escrow account via an agent (who charges 20% of the daily rates) and when the deposit is paid and things go tits up is the agent responsible for a full refund?

Interesting.

But we seem to understand that only the trophy fees are kept, not the daily rates.

Does that mean the agent still charges 20%?

Which would also open the door for a disgruntled client to block payment and enjoy a freebie hunt.
It would after all be the client's word against that of the outfitter.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
Put your money in an escrow account via an agent (who charges 20% of the daily rates) and when the deposit is paid and things go tits up is the agent responsible for a full refund?

Interesting.

But we seem to understand that only the trophy fees are kept, not the daily rates.

Does that mean the agent still charges 20%?

Trophy fees are always paid at the end of the hunt and that is the norm.

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
Put your money in an escrow account via an agent (who charges 20% of the daily rates) and when the deposit is paid and things go tits up is the agent responsible for a full refund?

Interesting.

But we seem to understand that only the trophy fees are kept, not the daily rates.

Does that mean the agent still charges 20%?

Which would also open the door for a disgruntled client to block payment and enjoy a freebie hunt.
It would after all be the client's word against that of the outfitter.

I have heard from very reliable sources that this actually happened.

Client paid with travelers cheques, and reported them stolen as soon as he got home.

Before the Pete hunted with were able to cash them.

Ultimately, there will always be crooked clients and crooked professional hunters.

One just needs to be on his toes.

Red flags are very obvious!

Non REFUNDABLE trophy fees are a ginormous RED FLAG!

One sees it in the dark even!