I change planes at Jo'berg on Friday, flying to Harare. Is there any truth in the rumour that I need a transit permit (from RSA) for the guns to be transferred from the Qantas flight to the Harare flight?

mike

An update - apparently British Airways "piggybacks" on SAA firearms carriage permits for carriage of firearms on flights from Jo'berg. SAA has recently issued an edict that it will not allow British Airways to use this arrangement if there is an SAA flight leaving for the same destination within 1 hour. Thus, if I keep my booking with BA I have to clear my rifles through customs and do RSA paperwork. If I change my flight to SAA I can check my guns straight through to Harare.

I contacted Qantas who made my bookings and asked to have the booking changed. They informed me that it would cost $287. They stated that it was my responsibility to check with other carriers, even though I was not told this, even when I attended their booking office in person last Friday (dragging several kilometres around the city on crutches) and got them to approve the carriage of firearms. I was speaking to a mifddle aged woman who said she had never come across anyone wanting to transport firearms before and contacted head of security who gave approval. It was never stated that we needed to do the same thing with other carriers, however, it appears that the computer record shows that approval was given for Qantas flights only. I suspect that this was a boilerplate insertion (ie a standard phrase that the security guy could pick off a menu) as the woman relaying the information did not say that and I could overhear much of what "Laurie", the security guy said.

I used to fly, in Australia two or three times a week and stopped using them because of their appalling customer service. This time I booked with them so I could use credit card frquent flyer points to upgrade to business class. Never again!

BTW - board members from Europe, Africa, America etc who are tempted to fly Qantas because of its safety record should bear in mind that Qantas has just decided to have its planes serviced in China because it's cheaper than Australia.

mike

Mike,
This was not required in October/ November last year. But if you have time at the air port just get them to check on the computer that your bags are in the process of transfer, not geting lost somwhere. Do this again when boarding.
Happy hunting,
Adam C.

Anne, from Air2000 has been very helpful, especially as I'm not spending any money with them. She sent me a copy of a letter dated 14 March 2006 which was a response to an incident she reported and this letter stated the above info.

Air2000 and Anne were really helpful and I wouldn't hesitate to use them if I was travelling to RSA.

mike

It seems to me that even if you have to claim your bags in RSA, you should be able to recheck them to another intl destination without going through customs in RSA. You just stay in intl departures. Hell, I have had my bags get lost en route and somehow they caught up with me in Namibia and I wasn't even IN SA to clear them.

I have never heard of a situation where your primary carrier could not check your bags to your final destination...the airlines have agreements with one another that allows them to do this. The only case where you have to clear them through customs is if you want to enter the country yourself, eg for an overnight stay.

Did you book your connection through your primary carrier, or separately?

Is this another of those Air2000 plugs?

Russ,

Did you read ANY of AussieMikes posts?

It seems fairly clear that he was looking for confirmation of a new situation and looking for help dealing with it.

I, for one, appreciate hearing about any new developments in the african travel routine.

Let's try to keep it positive here!

Les

quote:

I have never heard of a situation where your primary carrier could not check your bags to your final destination...the airlines have agreements with one another that allows them to do this. The only case where you have to clear them through customs is if you want to enter the country yourself, eg for an overnight stay.

Did you book your connection through your primary carrier, or separately?

Is this another of those Air2000 plugs?

Russ,

Air2000 had nothing to gain by telling me this information and Anne provided a copy of a detailed email from Comair explaining the situation. Anne sent this to me within a few minutes of my speaking to her and I am quite, quite sure it was genuine. To summarise, if an SAA flight is going to your destination within an hour of the BA flight you'll have to buy a SAA ticket and try and get a refund on your BA flight.

My experience is that sometimes you cannot check your baggage through and you cannot recheck collected baggage without leaving the "sterile area" and going to the check in. This was the case in Beijing when I used to fly to Mongolia. What was worse, you couldn't check in until an hour and a half before your flight was due and, with a 10 hour layover you just had to get your Thermarest out and sleep on the floor near the check in counter.

This is just a case of SAA trying to get a few more people on their flights.

regards,

mike

Have you gotten BA's version of the facts? I believe that if a bag is checked through to a third country, whether it contains a firearm or not, it comes off one plane and goes on another. I don't see customs in SA having any legal jurisdiction over your bag. Only BA has any say-so, for reasons of security. And I don't see them voting for this version of the facts.

And Mr. Howell, there's nothing negative about questioning a post that flies in the face of experience and logic. And yes, I am skeptical about Air2000s version of the facts, it plays to their hand. After all, if you have to get a permit in SA to transit to Namibia or Zimbabwe, they have just doubled or tripled their potential market.

Apparently airline security is responsible for firearms carriage and this requires various approvals. BA does not have these approvals and piggybacks on Comair's arrangements.

At any rate, why take a risk - I love my 470 and really want to have it in my hands when I see an elephant. Qantas has already lost it once in Jo'berg and I don't want it to have happen again.

regards,

mike

AussieMike

Not to be cheeky at all ... BUT one would think that your contracted Travel Agent in Aus or from wherever you are departing from would be able to tell you A-Z everything as applicable, or are you not using a bona fide top notch T/A and doing it DIY on the internet !!

Cheers, Peter

Peter

Sadly, as mentioned earlier, I used Qantas travel (a bona fide travel agent as well as an airline, according to the letterhead on my itinerary) as I wanted to upgrade to business class. They were most unhelpful.

In fact, I think it would be better to do it on the internet - I'm being charged $A25 each time I change a flight. It is rapidly reaching the point where, with the discount available on the 'net, I would have had a cheaper flight if I had just booked business class directly and I would have checked firearms transport requirements directly with the airlines involved.

The quality of service you receive these days from any large business is appalling. Computer screens with tick boxes where for example, the agent can indicate as a matter of routine, that they have fully informed the client about the conditions of the ticket whether they have or not.

Thankffully, I've booked with with Buzz directly, have had telephone advice from him, Myles and Carla and Charmain, in their office. They have been great - even arranging two boxes of birdshot for me.

I can't help but be disappointed by travel agents - last month I travelled via KL to the Maldives for business. I'm disabled and need a wheelchair at airports. The travel agent had indicated that they had arranged an appropriate meet and greet service at KL both ways but no-one turned up, leaving me to struggle into a cab. Then they emailed me to say that they had extended my reservation at the Marriot in KL but the hotel knew nothing about it. Finally, my itinerary showed I was arriving at KL on the 24th but also showed that my booking at the Marriot started on the 23rd. I emailed to point this out but the Marriot was not informed.

Any travel agents out there - were you aware that the above change in procedure at Jo'berg had occurred.

kind regards,

m

AussieMike,

Thanks for posting this. This information could be very important for anyone flying through Jo'burg and changing planes and airlines there.

I wonder if SAA has singled out BA only for this treatment, or if it affects other carriers, such as Air Namibia, etc.?

And it's not clear to me what SAA means by the "one hour" limitation.

Could you post the actual full text of the letter that Anne sent you?

BTW, I have also found Anne to be a very generous and helpful source of information on things like this, and I have never spent a nickel for her company's services. If that's a plug, then so be it.

Mr Lexma,

I don't feel comfortable posting the letter without Anne's agreement and I leave for Africa in a few hours. Perhaps you could email her and ask? I think, in terms of other carriers, it depends on whether they have their own firearms security arrangements or whether they use SAA security.

Must go, I've still got 10 9.3x74 woodleigh FMJs to load.

regards,

mike

Please see these recent developments on the attached AR thread

Les