As featured on the last episode of Top Gear. This Range Rover is the ultimate luxury off road hunting vehicle. Aside from all the usual appointments, it has a custom made gun cabinet in the trunk and a "self-replenishing" liquor supply for the first year of ownership! Figured most of the H&H fans would miss this if I posted in the 4x4 forum.

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/0...un-and-booze-haulin/

Thanks for the interesting post. However the Land Rover is most likely the most overpriced vehicle in the World already. So, this special edition must really put it out of sight. I am sure some status seeking individuals will pony up just to make an impression? Something for everyone I guess?

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

The 2012 redesign target price is going to run $200k

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My order is in... I will of course be living in it for the next 25 years!

"One hundred tweed-wearing pheasant slayers" Love it Top Gear is on US TV then??

And under all that bling? Typical British automotive junk. Why can't the Brits make a decent auto?

consecutive serial numbers????

quote:

Originally posted by TOP_PREDATOR:
"One hundred tweed-wearing pheasant slayers" Love it Top Gear is on US TV then??

Yeah it's on BBC America. I catch it from time to time.

I am hooked on "Top Gear" it comes on BBC America on Monday evenings 8pm Eastern.

Land Rover people can make a mean Range Rover with a great engine that is tough....Unfortunately....their electronics are still stuck in the 20th century. I loved and hated my RR at the same time until I got rid of it.

quote:

Originally posted by TWL:
And under all that bling? Typical British automotive junk. Why can't the Brits make a decent auto?

They never have and they never will. This from a guy who drove MGB's for twelve years. I was young and patient in those days. And mechanically skilled. I wasn't at first, but became so out of a strong sense of self preservation. That was before I discovered German engineering.

The Range Rover is overpriced crap. The only good thing about it is the Scotch doesn't run out for a year.

OTOH, you can buy a hell of a lot of Scotch for two hundred grand...

For 200K, one may purchase a very nice Ferrari.

Or a Cessna 210.

Or a very nice 500 NE.

C'mon guys, the Brits have made some superb cars. How about the Rolls Royce, Aston Martin, Bentley, AC Cobra, Bristol, Jaguar & Land Rover to name but a few? The Landies might be basic but there's no doubt they tamed the world and even now have the highest ratio of vehicles (worldwide) ever made/still on the road of any motor vehicle.

The Range Rovers are good cars but admittedly now dramatically overpriced and cursed with far too much technology. If they reverted to the old mantra of simplicity and threw away all that electronic shit, they'd be a great motor vehicle...... But exactly the same could be said of nearly all the modern day cars. Look for example at the new, top of the range Mercs with all that stuff on 'em such as proximity sensors and auto braking and the oh so common auto windscreen wiping sensors that are fitted nowadays..... all that shit is fine when it's new, but 10 years down the road, when it all starts breaking, the cars become a nucking fightmare and lose all their resale value.

One thing I will say about Range Rover is that they effectively stole the marketing possibilities of a luxury 4x4 from Jeep..... but really, that was the fault of the American automotive industry, who had produced the first and best luxury 4x4 damn near 10 years earlier with the wonderful Jeep Wagoneer but they failed to market it as such and virtually failed to market it at all to the overseas market. - God alone knows why because it's still one of the finest luxury 4x4s ever built and will still beat the pants off of pretty much anything even now on overall comfort and capabilities. Some newer vehicles might do some things better but I doubt there's anything that does everything as well as the the old Waggies do.

My 1980 Jeep Wagoneer has the quadratrac 4x4, auto transmission, cruise control, air con and luxury ride. The first Wagoneer had not quite that level of luxury, but not much less and was introduced in 1963. The first Range Rovers were no-where near as good or as luxurious and only hit the market in 1970 and it was only about 5 years later they started to get the luxury side of things right..... and even now, (IMO) the 4x4 system isn't anywhere near as good or as reliable as the quadretrac.

The American motor industry produced and produces some fantastic vehicles but let's not forget many had handling and other problems and they also built some real lemons such as the Edsel.

Also bear in mind that you Americans are blessed with what must be one of the best automotive taxation policies in the world. I don't know what you pay for a double cab Dodge Ram with all the trimmings but (going from memory) here in SA we pay about a ludicrous US$100K for a new one!...... and that's without a Holland & Holland badge!

I'd say both countries have produced many fine and many crap vehicles over the years...... but I don't think it's fair to condemn either of them as never having produced a good car.

Here's my 1980 Jeep that gets regular use and still takes us to Botswana where the roads are absolutely shite, every year and (touch wood) has never let me down.

My only complaint is they fitted the steering wheel on the wrong side!

Hope I don't sound biased!

quote:

Why can't the Brits make a decent auto?

What, like the Americans? I agree that the Rover is overpriced but as Steve mentioned Aston Martin and Bentleys are still world class automobiles. I have owned a Triumph TR2 as well as a Spitfire. Having said that a Jaguar XK8 is still on my bucket list!
Peter.

The new Range Rovers look great, but are way over priced.I have several friends who own them here in the UK and when they work they are fine, but they have a terrible reputaion for being unreliable. Typical case of " all fur coat and no nickers" - as we say in Lancashire.

how about the E Type Jag as a good example of Britsh automotive excellence?

Even Enzo Ferrari called it the the most beautiful car ever made!

I've had two of the 4x4 Grand Wagonneers (a 1975 bare bones model and a late Ltd model with leather seats, air conditioning etc.). Both were fabulous off road vehicles (turning radius was very small for such a large vehicle). Dana axels and an awesome low range. I had a 4" Softride lift kit and 33/9.50s on the latter one. The downside, gas mileage (11 mpg up or down hill didn't matter), vapor lock in the 401 V8 until I put in an electric fuel pump, and bad electronics (half of the dashboard was wired through the electric rear window (ask me how I know this lol). I did love those Jeeps until I hit a bump and had an electrical fire 17 mi up a 4 wheel drive road (see earlier comment about rear window ...)

My older son has a Toyota FJ Cruiser, a very capable 4 wheel vehicle that drives nice on the road as well, but not cheap.

I'm still driving my 2001 4x4 diesel Excursion (it's paid for).

Chuck

Certainly no doubt they are thirsty bastards but with all that weight and the AMC 5.7 litre V8 engine, it comes as no suprise.

Mine is even worse than standard as it has a few Edelbrock bits on it, including an Edelbrock carb..... the in car entertainment is provided by watching the fuel gauge dropping!

Buddy of mine had an E Type in 1964. Beautiful car. Trouble was, you had to pause two seconds when upshifting from first to second to give the balk ring time to catch up with the gear. If you didn't, you got this horrible grinding sound as the gears unsuccessfully attempted to mesh. Pretty? yes. Practical? I'll take a Benz any time.

And BMW owns Rolls, and powered it for several years prior to purchasing it.

My best friend's wife just traded an Aston Martin in on an AMG Benz because it was falling apart with less than five thousand miles on it.

No matter what anyone says, British engineering has a long way to go in the consumer car department. Two hundred grand for a Range Rover is outrageous, unless it's gold plated and then you're paying for the gold, not the engineering.

The Brits have produced many lovely cars. One of my favorites was the Jag 3.8 sedan. But they are so maintenance intensive that few British cars or bikes are imported any longer. I've had several Benzes and they were very good cars. One, a '74 280C, made 260,000 when I sold it. I have no idea what happened to it since.

I now drive a Ford F-150 that is going strong with about 130,000 on it. Gas, oil and water and down the road you go. I'm sure it's good for another hundred thou at least.

I spent a lot of time third world and the ubiquitous Toyota was the vehicle of choice in most places. The Land Cruiser is a magnificient truck. The difference between the third world version and the American version is substantial. They understeer terribly and I wouldn't want one, but for engineering and dependability, they're unbeatable. They have eclipsed the Land Rover throughout Africa.

If you own a Land Rover, you'd better own a good pair of shoes, because you are going to be doing some walking.

I love my Range Rover. It is bar-none without-a-doubt abosolutely-for-certain the best snow vehicle that I have ever had.

We have lots of visitors to our place and had cars from H1 Hummers, H2, Volvos, jeeps, you name it get stuck in our driveway. My Rover just drives around them and on up the hill.

It is a great car, but some credit has to go to BMW.

John

And I didn't even broach the subject of that lovely Triumph TR6(B) bike I rode. I loved that bike. This was in 1962. We had a huge club at Fayetville, NC. Most of us were 82nd Airborne guys, with a smattering of XVIII Abn Corps and Special Forces guys. Nortons, BSA's and Trumpys strung out for a mile or two when we went on road runs. My battery caught fire one night, smoke boiling out between my legs at 60 mph on a curvy Smokies road. No harm done and it garnered some laughs. The mechanic with us removed the battery and short wired it direct from the generator and voltage regulator, which worked.

Some punk went AWOL on it and wrecked it pretty good and I didn't have any insurance, so I had to sell it to pay for the repairs. I truly loved that bike.

Just about then, a Honda 305 Super Hawk showed up in the crowd. It would keep up with the Nortons and BSA's and such, all 650cc motors except an Ariel Square Four. That was the beginning of the end for the British bikes, and what a sad day it was. Those Brit bikes were elegant, more than I can say for any Honda ever built. I would love to have a Bonneville to cruise around town on, but I'm blind in my right eye so I stay off bikes. Damn the bad luck, anyway.

I like Land Rovers like the Defender 10 and the Safari cars because that is what I think of when I think of Safari. A diesel one would be very nice. I to drove an MG in several flavors. The problem was that if it rained the dam car would just sometimes quite running, fun to drive but hell on the pocket book or if you actually had to drive some place. As for Cessna 210's now that would be a good use for 200K, you would redo one with all the latest and greatest from Garmin for that kind of money. As for Jags, nice cars. Bentleys and Rolls Royces. Great cars to, you just have to write a check for a lot more that 200K to buy one these days. On the other hand a MB 300 Diesel would be the last car you would ever have to buy. I never was a motor cycle guy so I can comment on those. As for airplanes, a 210 is one of cessna's best efforts I would say, I would not go with the Pressurized version, but that just me.

It really does belong on the 4X4 page.

I wonder why the vehicle of choice for 90 % of PH's in Africa is the Toyota Landcruiser ! Oh must be because Land Rover is crap, unreliable and basically a vehicle for posers, wannabes and soccer moms, and also because the majority of Land Rovers/Range Rovers NEVER go off road - as owners are too scared they will breakdown far from help - hence the scotch - to help drown ones sorrows for purchasing a heap of trouble ! Here in SA we have a magazine called the Auto Trader - advertising all makes of vehicles - new and used - in the used section Land Rover and Range Rover are a dime a dozen - but you will be hard pressed to find a fair selection of second hand Land Cruisers on offer - as they are too busy doing the hard work that Land Rover wished they could do !

Peter:
The American auto industry is quite capable of making crap. Never said otherwise. Pinto, Chrysler K Car, Corvair, etc, etc. But the Brits have a long, long history of poor automotivie engineering. Yes, they make stuff that looks good, all bright & nice, fine leather, etc....until you get to the working parts.
The only reason one sees so much British product throughout the world is because their autos followed their colonization policies.

If there is no oil under it there wasn't any oil in it!!!

I'll take a Jeep Rubicon extended length over a land rover any day and be able to own 2 for the price of the rover. Overpriced garbage is correct in my mind.

When I think of Africa I do not think of Land Rover...I think of Toyota Land Cruisers. They are much much more RELIABLE !!!

P.S. Astin Martin is another basket case brand. Probably ok to own if you have a fleet of cars and want to have one for the gee-whiz-of-it especially if you want a LOUD & flashy vehicle.

quote:

When I think of Africa I do not think of Land Rover...I think of Toyota Land Cruisers. They are much much more RELIABLE !!!

Absolutely.

When we had our Sudan contract, the mechanics rented two Toyota pickups. They ran for years in the Kenyan Northern Territories, 120 degree heat and dirt and dust.

Out drivers in both Nairobi and Papua New Guinea drove Toyota mini-buses. Can't beat Toyota for reliability, both offshore and at home.

When I and my friends did the Ngorongoro Crater in July, the photo safaris were thick is fleas on a dog's hind end. All I saw were Toyotas. Not one Land Cruiser or Land Rover among them.

Ah! Bikes! The Triumph Bonneville, the Vincent 1000 and the Douglas DragonFly were bikes that all other bikes wish they were, oil leaks and all! Having said that, I remember well the first time the Honda 250's (Super Dream?) showed up at the Isle of Man TT and kicked ass all over the place. It was downhill from there. This was a real eye opener for the Brits. They had never seen engineering like that before. In more recent years, I loved my Honda ST1100. I would love to get a Kawasaki Concours but I am afraid I will get myself killed.
Peter.

quote:

The Landies might be basic but there's no doubt they tamed the world and even now have the highest ratio of vehicles (worldwide) ever made/still on the road of any motor vehicle.

Steve,
is that 'cos the owners left them where they broke down for the umpteeenth time and us Toyota owners got tired of towing them in?


in the Kalahari the old farmers have a saying, "the landrover opened the Kalahari, but the landcruiser tamed it"

quote:

All I saw were Toyotas. Not one Land Cruiser or Land Rover among them.

?????????????????????????????????????????

Could not help myself on this one

All those Toyota's one sees in the crater, they are all LANDCRIUSERS, yep TOYOTA LANDCRUISERS in TC format TC= "Troopcarriers"

But then it's like the PC vs MAC or the Nikon vs Canon camera debate, if you dont own a Landie you wont understand ! It's nothing to do with reliability or anything else, it has to do with heart and soul.

It is quite true that over 65% of all Land Rovers ever built are still in service and after the second world war they have been involved in every major conflict in the world.

No one mentioned Lotus as a reliable (?) British car.

Colin Chapman, Lotus founder, coined perhaps the most important and least understood phrase regarding automotive performance and reliability: "Simplicate and add lightness"

shakari: the Jeep Grand Wagoneer is indeed a fantastic luxury off road vehicle, especially when the engine bay is gutted and replaced with a GM 350 w/fuel injection and when several spare wiring harnesses are made available.

My family had a non-Grand wagoneer for many years. It brought my long suffering mother through hood-high snow drifts to rural Montana schools the whole time. People would wait for her, misplaced blue blood from Boston, to get to the outskirts of town and plow the way to the school. Awesome off road vehicles.

My brother has a '71 Jeep J4000 Gladiator pickup. Never has a more appropriate name been applied to a vehicle. Nothing stops the Gladiator.

The fuel injection conversion on the Waggies is a very popular idea but personally, I'd rather have the simplicity of a carb because there is so little to go wrong. I'm also more than happy with the AMC V8 engine.

I must admit to being a total classic car and bike nut but the best thing about the Wagoneer is that most things can be fixed with a half inch spanner and a big hammer. Hell, even the service items are a doddle to change.

Older Land Rovers (I'm not including Discos or RR here) have a lot of that same charm and that's why they managed to tame the world.

Sure the Landcruisers are more reliable but remember that the African version at least has only just got a factory fitted diff lock and even now, I'd say a Landie will still go places a Cruiser won't. It might break down more often but it's easier and usually cheaper to fix.

On the subject of transmission, try parking a Cruiser and a Landie on a on a steep shale covered or muddy hill and then pull away. A Landie will just do it without any fuss, tyre spinning or bouncing whereas a Cruiser will make a drama of it with slipping tyres, sideways movement and bouncing suspension and the Landies also have the bonus of that indefineable charm and character that a Cruiser totally lacks.

I've never seen one, but I would imagine the Aussie Cruiser is a much better vehicle than the one we get here because of the V8 diesel engine and better specification.

If I had to choose solely between the two as the best vehicle to buy nowadays, I'd choose a Cruiser every time but I'd then spend time and money improving it. That said, I reckon both are bloody good vehicles in their own separate ways but anyone who discounts the Landie as a pile of crap is (IMO) making a big mistake.

Fred, on the subject of good Brit bikes, how about the proper BSA Rocket Gold Star 650cc twin with RRT2 Isle of Man gearbox? - Now THERE was a bike!!!!!

I, and quite a few other off road vehicle afficioados, lust after a Rover Defender. Unfortunately the pillars are too narrow and you can't get them in the US. I'll stick with my Silverado for the time being I guess.

Think how much more comfortable the Derenders etc would have been if they hadn't fitted that bloody silly centre box and instead moved the seats and controls a little more inboard so you didn't have to sit with your shoulder against the door or your elbow out the window!

No one has mentioned the (fairly) obvious ie. the more highly tuned the automobile, the more maintenance it requires. Without this maintenance, they will eventually breakdown. This is true of ANY performance oriented auto, whether it be Jaguar, Aston Martin, Bentley, Lotus, BMW, Mercedes Benz, Ferrari, Maserati. Incidentally, the latest auto reviews do not rate Mercs or BMWs very high, again, not surprising if you agree with my point above. There is no free lunch when you are trying to optimize the engine for maximum power.
Peter.

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
how about the E Type Jag as a good example of Britsh automotive excellence?

Even Enzo Ferrari called it the the most beautiful car ever made!

there is a HUGE difference between beauty and quality engineering. of course Jaguar has always built beautiful cars that were as dependable as Obama's promises.

jdollar says: "There is a huge difference between beauty and quality engineering."
Finally! Someone gets it! Bingo, bingo, bingo!

C'mon guys, you can't be serious when you suggest the Brits can't produce quality engineering. Most nations can produce quality engineering if they build to standards rather than cost and if they don't have Government interference.

A good example of quality engineering are the Rolls Royce motor cars before they were taken over by damn Johnny Foreigners. The Silver Shadow for example was engineered to a stunning standard. After the foreigners took over you can see very different influences at work in everything produced thereafter. Not necessarily bad engineering and/or style but nevertheless very different. Rolls Royce incidentally, also produced some fabulous engineering in the field of jet engines. For example the Rolls Royce Snecma Olympus 593 engines they fitted to Concorde, which incidentally (in most ways) was a very fine piece of engineering in it's own right as was the Harrier Jump Jet.

A good example of American engineering excellence was the earlier Lincolns that had the nickname 'The American Rolls Royce' They got that name not only because of the similarities in the radiator grill but also because their standard of engineering was (almost ) comparable to the best automotive engineering in the world at the time, which came from rolls Royce.

A good example of engineering excellence from Europe is the Bugatti Royale. Bearing in mind when they were built they were an incredible piece of both beauty and engineering.

I'm not suggesting the Brits are the only nation that can produce fine engineering because they're most certainly not, but they can and have produced some excellent examples of quality engineering as have many other nations including but not restricted to the USA.

It should also be noted that a large percentage of top quality engineering from most if not all nations, originally came from studying products from other nations and manufacturers and them making improving on the original design or using technology from elsewhere to leapfrog design improvements. A good example of that is the Ford GT40 which was a fantastic car...... but it's design originated from the British AC Cobra. They started with the Cobra which was a great machine but the GT40 was a considerably better one after Ford got through with it.

There's also the matter of how does one define quality engineering? and everyone has their own ideas on that. For example, I reckon the old Jeep Wagoneer is one of the best 4x4s ever built. It's unbelievably reliable, brilliant at what it does and so strong it's damn near bomb proof but I could never call it top quality engineering but perhaps others might question that opinion.

Did I mention I like the Jeep Wagoneer?

Yeah, that BSA Gold Star was one hell of a machine. IIRC it was a 600cc one-lunger, or do I have that model confused with another one? It has been a while since 1962...