The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting How bad are Booking for 09-10Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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Booking must be getting really bad! In the last week I have got emails for a, Tent camp hunt in South Africa for $100 a day! ( with reasonable trophy rates) A South African lodge hunt 11 days / 10 days hunting with airfare for $2877 One of the best Namibian Bow hunting operations offering hunts for $275 and discounted trophy rates Kyrgyzstan Ibex for $6000 / Even cheaper if you bring a group of 4 I can tell you its just as bad here in Alaska, Everybody's booking are way down! With lot of cancellations It going to be a tough couple of years for outfitter and guides world wide! Robert Johnson | ||
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WHAT?!?!? Haven't you heard that here on AR everyone sold out at SCI?!?!?!  Seriously, I heard some first hand accounts from SCI and FNAWS that the shows were a total bust. I'm talking guys selling NOTHING. I had one outfitter buddy (A VERY GOOD business man) simply cancel everything at FNAWS and Ovis in order to cut his losses and save the travel expense. Sounds like it was a smart move on his part. | |||
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I'm looking for a 2009 Plains Game hunt and with a few exception, people tell me there are no discounts and there are no cancellation hunts. I was hoping to be able to pick up a deal but I'm not really not finding any deals.  | |||
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There's plenty of cheap deals on offer right here on AR: http://forums.accuratereloadin...ms/a/frm/f/832100588 My guess is they won't get much cheaper than a lot of these offers simply because there's a baseline below which the business either loses money or has to reduce standards. | |||
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http://forums.accuratereloadin...2100588/m/6221074301 Frederik Cocquyt I always try to use enough gun but then sometimes a brainshot works just as good. | |||
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I should have been clearer. I'm interested in a free-range PG hunt. | |||
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Certainly there are "stories" everywhere and you can probably find one that fits your interests. For what it is worth I will be going to Zim and I am told that '09 is pretty full as a lot of "deposits" were made early in '08 BEFORE the current disaster struck. 2010 seems to be almost wide open for those who want to "dicker". Best of luck and let us all hope that the sky does not fall in - Obama did say just last night that those of us making LESS THAN $250,000/yr will not see a "single penny" more income tax - yeah right! "Trust me"! | |||
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It cannot be that bad. When i booked my flight for July09 there where only a few seats left and for some dates no seats left. regards dennis | |||
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I understand that the airlines have cut capacity because of lack of demand and are flying fewer planes and routes to better match demand. (And not just in regards to African Hunting.) JPK  Free 500grains | |||
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I already booked my 09 hunt-----leave in a few weeks also booked for late 2010---I thought that bookings for 2010 went fairly well at SCI Reno. Is that wrong???? It seemed to me that there was a slow down for 09 but people were booking for 2010, just pushing their hunts out farther nothin sweeter than the smell of fresh blood on your hunting boots | |||
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Seems to vary from outfitter to outfitter, i have some good friends that are 99% sold for 2009 and things look good, ...however they normaly book 2-3 years in advance on certain DG and speciality hunts and at the moment 2010 is looking bleak with very few deposits and not much sold for then | |||
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Can't be to bad. I am looking for a leopard hunt for 2 people and 1 sable in ZIM or MOZ and still can't find it for 2009. The sable seems to be the problem. | |||
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Every guy I spoke to took a bloody nose in the States.....and it is down with at least 30%....I wonder what all the wise heads say now about the prices that dropped so much in South Africa suddenly Charl van Rooyen Owner Infinito Travel Group www.infinito-safaris.com charl@infinito-safaris.com Cell: +27 78 444 7661 Tel: +27 13 262 4077 Fax:+27 13 262 3845 Hereford Street 28A Groblersdal 0470 Limpopo R.S.A. "For the Infinite adventure" Plains Game Dangerous Game Bucket List Specialists Wing-Shooting In House Taxidermy Studio In House Dip and Pack Facility In House Shipping Service Non-Hunting Tours and Safaris Flight bookings "I promise every hunter visiting us our personal attention from the moment we meet you, until your trophies hang on your wall. Our all inclusive service chain means you work with one person (me) taking responsibility during the whole process. Affordable and reputable Hunting Safaris is our game! With a our all inclusive door to door service, who else do you want to have fun with?" South Africa Tanzania Uganda | |||
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Plains game hunt prices are likely being supported to some extent by hunters who would otherwise book more expensive hunts. They can drop back from or postpone a hunt for buffalo and leopard to hunt antelope, etc. for less than half, perhaps even a quarter, of what they would otherwise spend and still make their annual/bienniel African pilgrimage. What's the situation with European hunters? My understanding is that the majority of Namibia's hunter clients are from Europe (largely Germany). How are bookings by Europeans going? | |||
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I can tell you this, the hunts at my SCI chapter auction were very cheap. One hunt I remember was the following - 6 days hunting for 2 hunters, included was 1 kud, 1 gemsbok, 1 zebra, 2 impala, 2 warthog, $200 in dip and pack credit, $300 in freight credit, $1000 per man in taxidermy credit back in the states. Hunt sold for $2000, with very few bidders. | |||
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then you are talking to the wrong people Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… To quote a former AND CURRENT Trumpiteer - DUMP TRUMP | |||
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Yeah, they're parking aircraft and cancelling orders. | |||
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To whom should I speak for a discounted free-range plains game hunt? | |||
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Karl Stumpfe of Ndumo Safaris on this forum Charl van Rooyen Owner Infinito Travel Group www.infinito-safaris.com charl@infinito-safaris.com Cell: +27 78 444 7661 Tel: +27 13 262 4077 Fax:+27 13 262 3845 Hereford Street 28A Groblersdal 0470 Limpopo R.S.A. "For the Infinite adventure" Plains Game Dangerous Game Bucket List Specialists Wing-Shooting In House Taxidermy Studio In House Dip and Pack Facility In House Shipping Service Non-Hunting Tours and Safaris Flight bookings "I promise every hunter visiting us our personal attention from the moment we meet you, until your trophies hang on your wall. Our all inclusive service chain means you work with one person (me) taking responsibility during the whole process. Affordable and reputable Hunting Safaris is our game! With a our all inclusive door to door service, who else do you want to have fun with?" South Africa Tanzania Uganda | |||
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Damn, Stonecreek, what happened to all those millionaires flying to Africa on those full jets? I'll personally bet that plains game hunt participation will wind up being hurt the worst. There will be a somewhat long time gap between the use of "paid for" or "committed to pay for" current bookings but looking further out, to late 2009 or 2010, it will get much worse. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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I guess I live in a parallel universe because I don't see the discounts that everyone is so anxiously waiting for. I got a quote yesterday from 3 different outfits for a 6 member group bow hunt in '10. Not one of the 3 quoted anything but the prices right off their new '09 pricing and none offered a group discount. What does that mean? To me it means that these folks are not crapping their pants about the economic situation in the States or anywhere else. I have offered several safaris here and some with very good pricing but only two of these offered hunts are truly discounted and these were both with the same outfit. I know this sounds like a broken record but waiting around for some pie in the sky deal is apt to give you a scenario like this. "We were not there at the ideal time so X was hard to find, I couldn't take as much time as I would have liked to because work is really busy, the kids are X, I had to take what seats were available on the planes etc. I didn't get a chance at X,X,X bcause the quota for those animals was already shot BUT I saved $50 a day. How come that does not sound like a good deal? Oh! I forgot. "Buying the airline tickets on short notice cost me a boat load more but I still saved $50 a day". Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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That is brilliant!  Regards, Chris Troskie Tel. +27 82 859-0771 email. chris@ct-safaris.com Sabrisa Ranch Ellisras RSA www.ct-safaris.com https://youtu.be/4usXceRdkH4 | |||
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Hello dla69, There are some specials out there, but it is tough to discount a PG hunt too much. Profit margins are too thin. Lots of competition for PG out there. Look at it this way, if the profit margin is 25% on a PG hunt, a 12.5% discount (not that much) represents a 50% reduction in profit. So the total amount in pocket for the operator is now very small, and may not even be worth it to them. There is no incentive for a huge discount on a PG hunt because their quota does not expire and is not due payable at the end of the year. For most dangerous game operators (not all) they must pay for their dangerous game quota whether it is shot or not. This gives motivation to the operator to sell it, even if it is at a loss. Bookings are down this year. I called some big name booking agents after the shows and asked what they thought. Their experience mirrors my own. I would suspect bookings were down at SCI by 50% for most guys. I did see some guys who did better, without fail, all of these guys were Zimbabwe operators ... Zim seems to be doing well in this economy. Interesting. | |||
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I know of an operation in the Luangwa that still has 4 of 5 Lions to sell, i am sure they will sell some but there will be some good bargains during the season as things get tighter, BUT, as Mark says what you may save on a daily rate you could easily pay on booking your flight late. It doesnt make sense! If anything you may be able to get 2nd or 3rd animals of a species (where govt law allows) at a good price. In the past you may not have been able to get a 2nd at any price. Rather than waiting for a hugely discounted hunt why not negotiate a better hunt? Now is as good a time as ever. | |||
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If a guy had the money, I think the real deals are going to be found in the high end hunts this year. Buff, Elephant, Sheep etc. The entry level plains game or low end deer/elk will either be filled by the DG guys downshifting into PG (or NA big game) or it may go unsold because of the thin margins and inability to discount too much. This is less true for NA than for African PG I think. Still, ranchers who can't sell their landowner elk tags are going to be blowing them out for next fall if the big money guys hold their cash and dont downshift from top shelf sheep hunts to elk/deer hunts. Now, I would bet a lot of Buff and Elephant and sheep will be discounted this year. Think about it, for every HUGE money guy who hunts sheep or elephant, there is a once in a lifetime sheep/ele hunter who has saved the money to do it. Those guys aren't hunting this year and the big money guys might downshift to something less pricey. The end of the season Africa specials are going to be everywhere this year. Frankly, even on North American hunts, the deals were starting to show up even last year. I personally saw some BIG discounts on cape buffalo and North American hunts between 9 months to a year ago as I think people were already slowing down the bookings. This year is going to be a BIG opportunity for those with a chunk of cash and the willingness to spend it. Remember...."Be fearful when others are greedy and be greedy when others are fearful" | |||
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tendrams, I think you may have figured it out. That is pretty close to my line of thinking. To speculate that an industry, funded by disposable income, would not be effected by a financial crisis and uncertainty would be preposterous. There are guys who are fully booked for 2009. Good for them. I work with some of these guys. There are guys who have been hit so hard by the financial situation, they are struggling. I work with some of these guys too. They are ready to deal! (Tanzania!) There are deals. If you do not see one, ask. There will be deals this year. | |||
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MARK H. YOUNG
 Seloushunter Nec Timor Nec Temeritas | |||
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If you are looking for deals for 2010 in South Africa don't hesitate too long. With the reduction in flights and the World Cup you may find a great deal on a hunt, but no seat on a plane. DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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Dla69 I just got back from a great free range PG hunt in Namibia. $150 p/day 1x1. Give me a shot for more details. | |||
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We still have leopard & sable on quota, available this year. All my clients (and also the outfitters) success was 100% on male leopard and trophy Sable last year. This is Tanzania hunt, and is the best block for leopard & sable I have ever seen! Sable bulls are plenty, and seen almost every day. We do still have some 2009 openings, and truthfully, we have seen better years for bookings! Reno was way down, and not a great show at all. However, I think there's outfitters who will probably never admit that.  | |||
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I think there is a misconception about the personal wealth of safari hunters. Most are not rich. Why do you think most of us fly coach? I believe the housing market is really hurting safari bookings. If your house is worth 500k more than you owe, you tend to think of it as money in the bank and are more likely to spend $25k on a hunt. If your house is worth less than you owe you are not too likely to spend an extra dime. Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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POLI POLI =no hurry in Africa | |||
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I dont know about the rest of you, but I am getting daily e-mails from agents that are discounted the hell out of hunts. These are from very reputable agents with outfitters they have worked with for years. Personally I am going forward with my hunt in a couple of months. At 44 years of age, I have many more years to pay off the unanticipated debt I am going to get into to settle my account at the end of 3 weeks. I like the saying at the bottom of one of the posters, "You can borrow money, but you can't borrow time" That works for me. Yes, I wish I could get a bargain, but I made an agreement with the outfitter back in January of 08 and will stand by it. | |||
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Just saw you comment, Chris. No airline people would find it humorous. That's what's happening in the aviation industry. Boeing and Airbus have had several orders cancelled and several airlines have long ago parked aircraft in the desert in Arizona because of decreased demand. I missed out on a seven figure commission because an Asian company backed out on a big airplane deal because of the crisis, a deal which looked like a sure thing before the shit hit the fan. So I see no humor in it at all. There went my full-bag 30 day Tanzania hunt down the drain. And a few other hunts as well. | |||
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Last minute airplane tickets aren't necessarily a problem either. I just checked Expedia (after several comments about the expense of last minute plane fares) and a ticket from Memphis to Kilimanjaro leaving on June 28th (3 days from now) and returning on July 22nd is less than $1,900. This is $300 less than I paid 6 monthes ago for the exact same ticket and $1,000 less than NW/KLM was asking for it in August, 2008. Likewise, just last week I helped my partner buy an $800 round trip ticket to Uruguay for a last minute duck hunt on less than 24 hours notice. 6 months ago the same ticket was $1,500. It just depends on where and when you are going. Richard | |||
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quiet good if you ask me !!but dg hunts have dropped a littel!i dont think the Skandinavians feel this as mush as in the states and elsevere!we have about 98% of bookings as last year! | |||
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Sort of a home court advantage, perhaps? Hunting: Exercising dominion over creation at 2800 fps. | |||
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Mark I seem to remember you and I in a friendly debate about waiting to book and discounts. I also seem to remember saying if you were right there would be no deals, you wait and you lose, you could tell me. If I was right I would tell you. I have counted over 20 discount hunts you posted since April 17th I suspect you will have 20 more posted by the end of Aug. Ready to man up and eat your words??? I have hunted some of the top companies in Africa at huge discounts. Tan. Bots, and Zambia Not everyone can pay full price. If you can travel on a months notice you can and will get deals and you will be able to hunt places and animals you never thought you could afford. In fact working on one now, just booked 2 business class tickets with points, totally free. Even your plane ticket line does not hold water. Discount hunts are good for both the hunting company helping them sell their excess unsold hunts and helps the rest of us who cannot pay 80 grand for a 21 day hunt. So far 2 ele. 1 lion, one leopard and 3 buff. NRA LIFE MEMBER DU DIAMOND SPONSOR IN PERPETUITY DALLAS SAFARI CLUB LIFE MEMBER SCI FOUNDATION MEMBER | |||
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No doubt economic conditions are tough all over the Planet. However, I do not want to fly halfway around the world, on a Bargain Hunt with a company I do not know. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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Exactly right. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting How bad are Booking for 09-10
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