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Hello! I am planning to go to Africa for the first time. I only own a .308 at this time. Do you find it acceptable for PG? Or should I buy a 30-06? Kindly. fat chicks inc. | ||
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The .308 will work just fine for plains game. Be sure and use good bullets, and you will be good to go. A PH I have hunted with twice uses a .308 as his plains game rifle. | |||
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Use 180 grn premium bullet - Nosler, Barnes, Swift etc. all will workout well Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Goldeneye Your .308 is more than enough. I do however disagree with the use of 180 gr bullets, they are far too long for the standard twist and give you a disadvantage on the longer shots. I personally have and continue to use either 130gr or 150gr monometal bullets like the Barnes or gs custom. The 130gr bullets have taken animals all the way up to eland and wildebeest without any trouble and have more than enough penetration and flat trajectory. With the GS custom 130gr bullet loaded up to 3200 fps we have had end to end penetration on warthog, more than enough. Get the stability right by matching a bullet length to your twist rate and the rest will follow. One other benefit to the .308 is that there is ammo in every gun shop across the country so if yours was to get lost you could easily get yourself back in the game with no hassles. If you shoot well with your .308 then you should use it in Africa Good luck Ian | |||
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165gr TSX and you are set to kill anything with it. Frederik Cocquyt I always try to use enough gun but then sometimes a brainshot works just as good. | |||
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If it were me, I'd ld up some 165gr Nosler Accubonds and feel very confident in my rifle and load combination. The only animal I'd be extra careful on would be Eland - I'd still use my .308 but I'd want to be extra sure on my shot placement. Pancho LTC, USA, RET "Participating in a gun buy-back program because you think that criminals have too many guns is like having yourself castrated because you think your neighbors have too many kids." Clint Eastwood Give me Liberty or give me Corona. | |||
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.308 is acceptable, I used it on one of my hunt as well. But if buying another rifle isn't a problem, come to Africa with a .30-06. 180 grains .308 energy at 100 yards at range of 2200 foot pound depend on type and load 180 grains .30-06 energy at 100 yards at range of 2500 foot pound depend on type and load. What ever caliber you choose; Good Hunt & Bucks! | |||
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My son, then 14, had 6 one shot kills using his .308 with 165 gr Trophy Bonded Bear Claws (Fed Factory load). This included 2 Oryx and one Kudu. I shot similar animals with a .300 Win Mag with 200 grain Nosler Partitions and could tell zero difference in the end results. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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+1 Mrs Blacktailer used her 308 on zebra and I used it on the small stuff (impala, bushbuck, warthog). No problems whatsoever. Have gun- Will travel The value of a trophy is computed directly in terms of personal investment in its acquisition. Robert Ruark | |||
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Charlie dead is dead but a good bullet, and I like the TSX, but better shooting will always be the way to go... Mike | |||
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On my 1st trip to Africa for PG, I took my old Sako 308 and took blue wildebeast, impala, warthog, blesbok, steenbok, zebra, and baboons with it.. Had a good ol straight 6 Swaro on top. Plenty of gun and plenty of glass on top. | |||
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Yep, 308 is fine. Use good bullets as others have suggested. The 308 is vastly under-rated in my opinion. | |||
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I'll second Ian's recomendation on the lighter Barnes bullets for the 308! ________ Ray | |||
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My wife used a 308 for Plainsgame in Zimbabwe on our last Safari. With the Federal factory 165 Trophy Bonded Bearclaw she took Impala, Zebra, & Wildebest. With Federal factory 180gr Barnes MRX she took 2 Kudu and a Giraffe [head shot]. I took a Bushbuck with the MRX, a Heyena and a Honeybadger with the 165TB. She also shot a Kudu and a Warthog with a Federal factory 180 Nosler Partition with the 30/06 barrel of her Drilling. No problems at all. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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Can't say I agree that 180 grainers are a problem in the 308 or that 165's are better. If your rifle shoots 180s accurately that is what I would go with. The difference in trajectory inside of 250 yards is negligible and if I am shooting at 300 yards, I am a) going to have a rock solid rest so I can hold a couple inches higher and b) likely going to try and get closer. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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My 10 Year Old son used a 7mmm-08 with 140 grain TSX bullets in Namibia this summer. He took blue wildebeest, black wildebeest, oryx, red hartebeest and warthog. All one shot kills. In fairness all his shots were under 110 yards. If you put a quality 180 grain bullet in the right place, you will do fine. Go Duke!! | |||
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No problem with your .308 if bullet placement is good. IF you are buying a new rifle, the difference between a .308 and a .30-06 isn't worth it IMO. Upgrade to something larger such as a .300 Win Mag, .338 Win Mag or better a .375 H&H Mag. I bought a .338 Win. Mag. to compliment my .30-06 but would have bought a .375 H&H in the world of hindsight. | |||
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A .308 win + any good bullet + GOOD SHOT PLACEMENT = dead animals! [Mostly DRT!] My standard twist .308 shoots PMP [Pretoria Metal Pressing] and Hornaday 220 grainers very accurately, even though it is not supposed to! I have hunted with my own .308 win with anything between 130 grains and 220 grains and good shot placement invariably results in DRT animals! Have seen it with so many clients that also use .308 win - good shot placement results in DRT trophies. What really counts is my casual observation that 'my' hunting clients that used a .308 win all make better shot placement and DRT animals than 'my' clients that use almost any other calibre! I do admit that I have had clients that shot very well with other calibers, but I have yet to guide a client that does not shoot well with a .308 win! Think that over a bit before you decide to waste money on a new rifle! Your .308 win will do well on plains game! My advice is: Do not upgrade to anything bigger - save the money for a new rifle and rather pay additional trophy fees with it! In good hunting. Andrew McLaren Andrew McLaren Professional Hunter and Hunting Outfitter since 1974. http://www.mclarensafaris.com The home page to go to for custom planning of ethical and affordable hunting of plains game in South Africa! Enquire about any South African hunting directly from andrew@mclarensafaris.com After a few years of participation on forums, I have learned that: One can cure: Lack of knowledge – by instruction. Lack of skills – by practice. Lack of experience – by time doing it. One cannot cure: Stupidity – nothing helps! Anti hunting sentiments – nothing helps! Put-‘n-Take Outfitters – money rules! My very long ago ancestors needed and loved to eat meat. Today I still hunt! | |||
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Lots of good advice already here, but I'll add a bit of my own opinion  If your rifle happens to group wih a decent quality 180gr bullet you are extremely lucky, and please sell it to me at the end of your hunt! I personally have not seen any .308 that likes that weight, and have often thought of re-barreling mine to achieve just that... The advice above that you must be extra carefull on eland  TIMES TEN!You don't say where you're going and what the quarry will be. Buying a 30-06 rather than taking the .308 is hardly upping the ante. For most purposes on plainsgame they are just about one and the same gun, save for the "06s" likely ability to shoot 180 grainers better. The .308 will have an edge in my opinion if its a springbuck/blesbuck area. Again, depends on area & quarry. If you're going to buy another gun, get something like a 375 H&H and you'll have a fine dovetailing pair of calibres for your hunt. Cheers Stephen http://www.bigbore.org/ http://www.chasa.co.za Addicted to Recoil ! I hunt because I am human. Hunting is the expression of my humanity... | |||
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Stephen Strangely enough I have never shot a 308 with 180gr bullets that did not shoot plenty good enough for hunting. Most Blaser R 93, K 95 and their Combo guns all shoot 180's into near one hole. Just buy a Blaser R 93. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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My hunt report will be forthcoming on my recent trip with Andrew McLaren who posted above but I the short and sweet version is: multiple clean kills on various PQ with a .308Win launching Fed 165gr TBBC's. Besides, with what you save on buying cheap and readily available 308 ammo, you can afford to practice. Shot placement trumps fps and bullet construction any day of the week. Right Andrew? ChetNC | |||
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The .308 is king, because most people who shoot them have practiced. I have found the Fed. power shock ammo, around $15 a box, to be very accurate. They use Speer core-lok 180 or 150 gr. bullets. Shot placement is the biggest factor, by far. I was in Namibia last year with a 14 yr. old who shot one using Power Shock ammo. He took about 35 animals. Lots of Rock chucks and spring hares, 11 Springbuck. 3 Gemsbuck, Zebra, Blesbuck, 2 pocupine, warthog and Kudu. His first big game animal ever was a one shot DRT at 367yds on a Zebra. You can't go wrong with the .308 Good Luck......Tom SCI lifer NRA Patron DRSS DSC | |||
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I picked up a Kimber Super America in .308 a couple weeks ago. The thing LOVES the cheap blue box Federal Power Shoks in 150 grain. I couldn't get Hornady Custom IB's to shoot nor could I get Remington Premier Scirroccos to shoot. I plan on taking this gun along with a .375 Ruger to Africa. Should I look for a better bullet (I was thinking TSX), or should I just go with my blue box Federals for plains game. (Lesser Kudu, Black Wildebeest, Springbok, Red Hartebeest are what's on the list.) | |||
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150 Power Shocks would probably be ok, but I would try some Federal factory 165 TBBC, 150 or 165 Barnes TX, 180 Nosler Partition, 180 Barnes MRX, or the 180 Trophy Bonded Tip. I would just feel better with one of these bullets on the bigger stuff especially if a raking shot or big bones are struck. The Bullet does ALL the work. I NEVER skimp on the Bullet. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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NE...I agree and will try the tbbc and the tsx 165's, it's just that the blue box stuff shoots less than a 1/2 inch at 100...In the end I am sure I will end up with a Premium Bullet. Back to topic: yes, the .308 is a great plains game rifle. | |||
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NE, thanks for the idea Now I just need to convince the missus (and our local authorities) that I need another gun  The question raised is "hunting" accuracy. For the bushveld, no doubt my rifle's performance with 180 grs is ok, but just knowing that your rifle can shoot much beter with another cartridge is a confidence knocker I think. Mine is a SAKO Forester, and it has simply always only grouped well with "poor" conventional bullets only and in the 150gr class. It did work well with the old orange box SAKO 155gr Super Hammerheads but they are no longer available here? Archer, I also think you should keep looking, but if you must use them those Federals will probably do seeing as you'll have the 375 for the bony stuff. If your ranges are long, the conventional bullets are reliable. It's the big stuff at close quarters where bullet failure is an issue. http://www.bigbore.org/ http://www.chasa.co.za Addicted to Recoil ! I hunt because I am human. Hunting is the expression of my humanity... | |||
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Stephen I am sure you may have tried this, but a good friend in the UK had his SAKO respond very well to seating the bullet right out as far is it will go. Apparently the SAKO's have very long throats and as such prefer the longer/heavier ammo as it engages the lands. Probably explain why the Hammerheads did well with their squat shape, they would have been pretty close to the lands when loaded, not like the speer type 150's which most of the other offerings would be. I know with my gs loads the further out I seat them the better they perform. Good luck Ian | |||
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I am enjoying this thread, as I'm a fan of the 308 and find it easy to shoot well. One question; are there problems with the laws of any country in Africa taking the 308 because of its military affiliation? In other words, is a gun and/or ammo at risk for confiscation for that reason? Thanks. | |||
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Goldeneye: This old man remembers firing the 308 when it was called the T-43 (US Army Ordnance designation) -and who loved the '06 and thought nothing was better -and came to like the 308. I found the 308 to be a murderously accurate cartridge and since African PG ranges are not anywheres as long as like shooting in the American West plains or even mountain country, I would bet the 308 would do just fine. (The PHs seem to think that only a magnum will do on animals that are hardly as big as even our US mule deer,much less an elk and I notice that the Africa outfitters who post in this forum seem to go along with that. I have a suspicion that none of them have ever seen an American mule deer or elk. If you like the 308 and can shoot it well, then go with it. It's the first shot that counts and I'll bet it's the same in Africa - just like anywheres else. Confidence in your rifle and your ability to shoot it is what counts. | |||
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Thank you all for posting! Regarding the ammo it is likely to be the Oryx from Norma. They shoot very well in my Winchester. http://www.norma.cc/sortimentj...libernamn=.308%20Win fat chicks inc. | |||
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.308 Winchester is good to go. | |||
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The ultimate .308W combination for Africa is with the 165 grain Woodleigh PPSN. I have had one shot kills with this combination on Gemsbok, Zebra, Blue Wildebeast, Impala, Black Wildebeast, Blesbok and I would without reservation use this combo easily on Kudu. With patience and correct shot placement I would even hunt Eland with the .308W and 165 Woodleigh PPSN. The Norma Oryx will do the same job. No worries. | |||
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No risk at all in South Africa. As long as the ammo matches the rifle you bring in. | |||
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Ian (Vlam), you are spot on: A couple of years back I tried the Hornady Interbonds in 150 & 165 gr. Again, the 150s proved much more accurate, but both were substantially better when seated far forward. So much so that they could not fit in the magazine! The solution for that was to "singe" the plastic tips off on a hot-plate. This did not affect accuracy. I then contacted Hornady with this info and within 48 hours they had sent me the new BC together with the expected aditional drop per 100 yards out to 500 yards. Pretty negligable numbers actually. That was great service! I deliberately took two impala rams that season on frontal slightly angled shoulder shots at relatively close range to try recover bullets; they retained 92% & 93% respectively. Problem is, there are none on the shelves in SA at the moment..... I see a lot mentioned here about Remington's managed recoil 135gr. I tried them for my son and they were stil a little bit hot for him, what with the gun not being a perfect fit. I've a few left and I'll let him give them a try again to see if he's grown into them. The load I did myself for him was a conventional PMP 150gr spitzer with 22gr Somchem S265 with filler. At 2048fps they are great for accuracy, but they drop quite a lot at 200m. Plenty penetration though.... http://www.bigbore.org/ http://www.chasa.co.za Addicted to Recoil ! I hunt because I am human. Hunting is the expression of my humanity... | |||
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Amen, I agree. Remember, forgivness is easier to get than permission. | |||
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I've had real good luck with federal HE 180 gr Nosler PT and my .308 win in Both South Africa and Zimbabwe. Mine is a scout rifle with a 19" barrel and 2.5 X fixed power scope. | |||
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how big(animals) is to big for a .308win/180gr? | |||
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I’ve killed a bunch of eland, blue wildebeest, sebra and waterbuck with 150gr bullets (mostly Nosler Partitions & Rhino’s) from a .308. I’ve also used a few GS C 130 gr bullets on the same animals. I would not consider a .308 a giraffe hunting caliber, but if I stumbled on a wounded giraffe and I had a clear shot at the boiler room, I’d take the shot. I used 150 gr bullets because my rifle loves them. I would use 180 grainers if I could get the same accuracy from my .308. | |||
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Stephan and Vlam, Used a .308 for 20 years now. The same rifle. It is also my working gun for PG, and I have two scopes for it (one a Leupold 4.5-14x50 boone and crocket reticule, and the other a Swarovski Habicht 1.25-5x25 with IR). I have used every imaginable and available load, catridge and bullet available to us in SA, from distances as close as 5 yards to 420 yards (Frederik filmed the wounded blesbuck I shot for a client). My rifle is a Brno 602. It loves 180gr. PMP, BarnesTSX, Swift A-frame and Rhino's, and gives very, very good groupings. I must admit that I do not like shooting it over 200 meters. The rifle struggles a bit with the lighter 130, 150 gr bullets (acceptable), but does good with the 168gr. PMP used to make. I was fortunate to come into a batch of them last year, and have made some very good long distance shots with them. To the poster, bring premium grade bullets and your .308 ANY day for any animal up to Eland (we'll just make double sure on the shot  )And Stephen, I'll never ever sell that rifle, although it will need another barrel in the next couple of years.... Charl van Rooyen Owner Infinito Travel Group www.infinito-safaris.com charl@infinito-safaris.com Cell: +27 78 444 7661 Tel: +27 13 262 4077 Fax:+27 13 262 3845 Hereford Street 28A Groblersdal 0470 Limpopo R.S.A. "For the Infinite adventure" Plains Game Dangerous Game Bucket List Specialists Wing-Shooting In House Taxidermy Studio In House Dip and Pack Facility In House Shipping Service Non-Hunting Tours and Safaris Flight bookings "I promise every hunter visiting us our personal attention from the moment we meet you, until your trophies hang on your wall. Our all inclusive service chain means you work with one person (me) taking responsibility during the whole process. Affordable and reputable Hunting Safaris is our game! With a our all inclusive door to door service, who else do you want to have fun with?" South Africa Tanzania Uganda | |||
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Well In SA as long as its not a Fully / semi Auto you are good and no military solids.(my trackers dont enjoy FMJ either) 308 in 150-165gr NORMA ORYX or BARNES and your good to go.bullet placement is the key.Remember good placement and you can kill and Eland with a 45pd bow (not recommeneded) ENJOY YOUR TRIP DaveDavenport Dave Davenport Outfitters license HC22/2012EC Pro Hunters license PH74/2012EC www.leopardsvalley.co.za dave@leopardsvalley.co.za +27 42 24 61388 HUNT AFRICA WHILE YOU STILL CAN Follow us on FACEBOOK https://www.facebook.com/#!/leopardsvalley.safaris | |||
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