I have been trying to keep up with the Lion hunts in Botswana so far this year to see if these high priced lion hunts would produce extra exceptional lions. As we all know the outfitters in Botswana went wild with their lion hunts and especially the prices for a lion hunt. Most of the lion hunts that I saw being offerred in Botswana were going from $80,000 to $130,000 just for a lion hunt Which I guess if you look at the price of a Desrt Big Horn Sheep at $80,000 it doesn't seem too bad for a nice MGM lion.

But is Botswana really going to produce all of these extra big MGM lions as outfitters were hopeing for?

Well as of today I know of 5 lion safaris that have already taken place in Botswana with 5 different outfitters and PH's. So, far no one that I have heard of has shot a lion yet! Out of the 5 lion hunts that I have heard of, all 5 clients returned home without a lion.

Now, do not get me wrong, I do think that 2-3 very good lions will be taken in Botswana this year that are exceptional, and I do know that there are some great lions there, but seems like these lion hunts are not producing like most people thought they would.

I was not able to book any lion hunts to Botswana for those prices, as most of my clients decided it was better to spend $80,000 in Tanzania and go home with 20 + animals to show for it. I just think it is interesting that out of 5 lion hunts so far, not one has been taken, and just thought the rest of you would be interested in knowing this as well.

That's amazing Adam. I wonder how many of these hunters had shot opportunity at a "good" male, but was holding out for something "exceptional" (as one would reasonably expect at these prices).

Assuming Botswana works like the rest of Africa, I also wonder what these licenses will sell for the second time around...

Bill do not quote me, as I am just passing on what I have heard for what it is worth. I heard that 2 of the hunters were offerred a return trip later in the year to try again, but not sure on the other 3. I also heard that on 1 of the safaris they did see 6 male lions, but none that were old enough to shoot. One of the other hunters I heard about hunted 21-days and did not see a lion at all. Have not heard what happened with the others and if they had any opportunity or not.

So, what would you tip on an $80,000 lion hunt if you went home empty handed?

Just kidding.

Cheers,
Canuck

Nothing like having to spend a hundred grand and then rentrer bredouille, eh? Only in hunting or in Las Vegas, right? At least they left with their shirts on their backs!

One thing's for sure: These guys can afford it!

Govt rescinds restriction on killing of lions
03 May, 2005

GABORONE - The Ministry of Environment, Wildlife and Tourism says government has rescinded its statutory instrument that restricted the killing of lions and cheetahs.

A statement from the ministry says however, that a new statutory instrument has been published to prohibit the killing of cheetah.

Their protection is maintained and it will remain prohibited to kill cheetahs as problem animals, the statement says.

Government has also approved that cheetahs and wild dogs be included in the list of animals that attract compensation for damages to property caused by these animals with immediate effect.

The statement says a person may kill a lion where a lion or a groups of lions have killed livestock or where a lion or group of lions threaten human life in terms of Section 47 of the Wildlife Conservation and National Parks Act.It says it should be noted that where a group of lions is involved, a person may kill only one lion to scare away the rest.

A lone lion, which has entered a kraal and has killed or is about to kill livestock, may be killed.

Furthermore, a persistent problem lion in a livestock area may be killed provided that sufficient evidence can be provided to the director of wildlife and national parks that the lion has damaged property in that area or was a threat to human life.

The statement adds that farmers will be required to demonstrate that they had taken adequate measures to prevent predation through herding their livestock during the day and kraaling them at night in a properly constructed and secure kraal.

It says a person who kills or wounds a lion in defence of his or her property should prove that the lion that was killed or wounded or the group of lions to which that lion belonged at the time it was killed or wounded caused damage to his or her livestock or property.

The person must prevent damage to the lion and livestock carcases; skin the lion and livestock carcases in a manner, which preserves the skin of the lion or livestock for forensic investigations; and preserve the area where the lion or the livestock were killed or wounded for forensic investigations. BOPA

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
So, what would you tip on an $80,000 lion hunt if you went home empty handed?

My guess would be that they would tip about $5000 US. I would think that someone who spends that much for a lion hunt would be paying for the sport and the fun of the hunt and cost was not a big factor. If any AR members went on one of these hunt, please feel free to correct me.

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
So, what would you tip on an $80,000 lion hunt if you went home empty handed?

$0

quote:

Originally posted by safari12:
... most of my clients decided it was better to spend $80,000 in Tanzania and go home with 20 + animals to show for it.

I knew Tanzania was costly but is it really that high? Wow.

If you could just plunk down $X and kill a big
cat, what would be the point.I'm glad to see lion hunts be difficult.
How much less the trophy if everyone just pour themselves out of thier tents and killed a MGM.

I've never been,but a fair chase lion hunt should be tough.Further,if these were tough
hunts,we don't know the clients abilities.
They could had been gassed on day one.

I'll help prove a point,everybody kick into a
kitty to send me to hunt lion.We'll see if youth
and determination prove out.

quote:

The person must prevent damage to the lion and livestock carcases; skin the lion and livestock carcases in a manner, which preserves the skin of the lion or livestock for forensic investigations; and preserve the area where the lion or the livestock were killed or wounded for forensic investigations. BOPA

This sounds like the NJDEP's statement for killing a black bear. Except that the bullet wound must be in an area exposed to the person (read shot in the face or chest). Any bear shot going away or too far from the shooter, and you have big problems.

A big one was on my deck a couple of years ago. By the time I got my .338WM, it had turned around.

BTW, would they be able to tell by tissue damage which way a solid entered?

Thanks,

Minkman

Was able to walk up on a MGM lion in Zimbabwe in 1997. We were returning from an elephant trek and just stumbled into him. The 3500 dollar trophy fee I had to pay seems real reasonable at this point. Could have killed one last year same circumstances but I couldnt afford the taxidermy.

quote:

Could have killed one last year same circumstances but I couldnt afford the taxidermy.

They have an uncanny ability to smell that you are broke or don't have them on license. I've seen them under every acacia tree when I wasn't in a position to shoot one.

quote:

Originally posted by Cunningham:

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
So, what would you tip on an $80,000 lion hunt if you went home empty handed?

$0

May I ask why?

I was in Africa this past 3 weeks and saw a video of hunters in botswana on their $140K lion hunt, they passed on more MGM lions than MGM has ever owned. Once they decided to shoot one they had a choice of 2 standing there a blond or black, they chose the latter, they also took a couple jumbos in the low 60's. It was a group of 3 hunters, Granted it was expensive but I guess you get what you pay for, i do

Sadly I couldnt have a copy of the video it wasnt my property-I met the editer and watched it with her.

quote:

Originally posted by Bwanamich:

quote:

Originally posted by Cunningham:

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
So, what would you tip on an $80,000 lion hunt if you went home empty handed?

$0

May I ask why?

Because the hunt was unsuccessful.

Folks,

This thread brings a couple of things to mind. What if you were lucky enough to be able to hunt trophy elepahant let's say every year and you always wanted to get a larger bull than you had shot before. Would you not tip the PH and crew if you did not get a shot at a 80 pounder? I think not. Now if you did not see any shootable bulls that might be a different story.

There is a lion permit available in RSA right now on 187,000 acres bordering Kruger for about $50,000. These lions may rival anything Botswana can produce and somehow it seems like a better deal to me.

Regards,

Mark

Damn right, Mark, on the tip issue, I mean. The lion issue I'll leave for others still after their lions to decide.

I don't deny that success will usually sweeten a tip, but it's the whole ball of wax, the hard work, the effort, the hard fought chase that count.

Failure to kill the game animal of one's choosing does not, in and of itself, make a hunt unsuccessful. Success has far more dimensions than that.