For you more experienced guys, does this sound like the proper ballistics for African plains game, leaving out the big hummers?
The bullets can be solids, round nose or semi-spitzers.
Jim

A namibian friend of mine just got an original 1895 win in .405 It's marked .405 win - .405 express by the way!
I sent him dies, brass and some Horn 300 grn sft pts.
He does a tremendous amount of hunting/culling so he will give it a good test. I'm very curious to see what he thinks of it myself.

I guess it would depend on the where you were hunting as I would suspect this would mostly be useful out to 150-yards or so. Wouldn't be my first choice for Namibia, some areas of South Africa or the plains of Tanzania.

DB Bill,
where my friend lives in the north bushveld country, 90% of the shots are under 150 yds, likely more like 98%!

Sounds like a great rifle, but suited only for the low veld hunting and so much of Africa is open that I consider the 300 H&H or 338 Win. a much better choice for plainsgame...

Your spending a lot of bucks for a hunt and traveling around the world, why lock yourself into a short range caliber, unless you just want to, then thats up to you....

Pete,

As I recall the .405 Winchester uses .411" - .412" bullets, so a 300 grain bullet is a bit light in sectional density compared to the 400 grain bullets in the .408"/.411"/.416 cartridges.

North Fork has a 300 grain bullet (SD = .254) which would be a good one if it will work through the M95. The North Fork 360 grain bullet makes the magic SD cut-off with a .304 value.

jim dodd

Yup
Just got it. It's newest edition 95 with the case colors. Right now I'm laying in a stock of brass (200) and designing a bullet mold and ordering up a stock of Rl-7.
I sort of figured that if 'Teddy' thought the 405 was 'Big medicine' I may as well give it a whirl.
Jim

Jim
The rifling twist on this cartridge is a bit mystical, 1 in 13.5 which would do a fine job on 450 grain bullets.
The bullet weight I'm leaning towards in cast bullet is 350 to 375 grains. I'm thankful for your information about the Northfork 350s.
I'm not planning to hunt with the cast bullets but plan to use buckets of them breaking in the rifle and getting me used to shooting the rifle. I should be able to load and shoot a couple thousand rounds between now and 2005.
Jim

You will want to stick to semi-spitzer or Woodleigh's round nose geometry to obtain maximum case capacity while still fitting the magazine. I find Rel 7 to be the best powder. You can easily duplicate the tropical loading for the 450/400 3" NE, but pressure will be around 50ksi to 55 ksi. Getting up to the full 2150 fps will drive pressures over 60 ksi so be warned.

Good luck with your development and keep us informed. Some pics would be nice too, haven't seen one with case colors.


Scott

Here are a few pics detailing what it takes to get a 400 gr Woodleigh to work in the M1895 Winchester.

Turning a new cannelure:



Bullets (with new cannelures) and brass:



Loaded cartridge in the dial caliper (3.208" COL) also showing my preferred powder, which this cartridge is loaded with:



You can see the bulge in the case walls, this shows just how deeply the 400 Woodleigh seats in the case. The COL of 3.208" places the bullet ~ 0.032" off the riflings.

Here is a shot showing a couple loaded rounds in the magazine, again the COL is 3.208":



Last but not least, one round in the magazine and one in the belly of the beast:



This particular load has a muzzle velocity of 2070 fps. This is right inline with the tropical loading for the 450/400 3" NE. Pressure is estimated to be in the mid 50ksi range.

Scott

HI,


ScottS, they look very nice. I have just started to work on some 600grain PPSP and some 570RN, I got the 600PP after taking some off the top to about 560 grains with a flat nose of .435, the length of the Woods now is 1.098 and my 525HC are 1.050, so they are very close where I am sure they will work. I maybe able to put more powder in the case with the woods as the length is shorter from base to cannelure on them than my 525HC that I have been shooting. I still have to load some up and really fine out,Thanks for the pics, Kev

HI,

ScootS,you make a new cannelure with a lathe?, is that right.You just make the new one right about the old cannelure. By doing this it gives you a OLA that will work in the lever. I think this is what you are doing and that is good idea,. Now I guess I will have to get one.Kev

ScottS
While eating Chinese tonight a buddy and I discussed doing a 405 Winchester improved.
You suppose that putting a shoulder on the 405 case I could some extra umphhh?
Jim

arkypete,

You won't realize any appreciable improvement since you can only achieve a shoulder of ~0.014" per side. Maybe you would get an extra 30 fps with a 400gr bullet at equivalent pressure, and this only if you keep the case OAL identical. IMHO, not worth the cost and effort. The 405 Win, as I currently have it loaded - 400gr @ 2070fps, is the equivalent of the 458 Win mag for all practical purposes.

One little trick you can do, which most likely won't require a rechamber (at least it did not in my rifle), is to run a 0.416" expander ball down through the 405 Win case. Do not run it all the way to the bottom, stop about 0.375" from the bottom, and then "neck size" the case with your 405 Win sizing die. This little trick gave me an extra 3 grains of powder capacity, which was beneficial in squeezing 56gr of IMR4895 into the case. Still does not outperform Rel7 (at a lower charge weight).

I will post a picture of such a case this evening if you are interested.

Scott

Dan,

Teddy was well known to be a terrible shot aslo. Wonder if that little fact had anything to do with his 15 shots / hits on a rhino?

Scott

Too my knowledge it's illegal to shoot rhinos today. Even if it were legal to shoot the rhinos, I can't think of a reason to shoot one, unless he happened to take offense to my after shave lotion. Yes, I know old John Cottar got bashed and buffeted after shooting a rhino with a 405, heck he was what 85?
I'll bet that an impala, kudo, warthog, would not take as many shots if I do my part.
Jim

Scott
Yes I would like to see a pic of the pre-expanded case.
I'll bring my digital camera home from work, I use it at work. I get a few shots of the new rifle and post them.
What reloading dies do you use?
Jim

Bwana cottar was trying to film a rhino charge, he let it get way to close before he tried to stop it. I have some of his old writtings. He used to shoot rhino with FMJ's in a 32 spl of all things.
Scott and arkypete, I have a corbin swage die I found at a gun show to size 416 bullets to 411. I found it will size a horn 240 grn 44 mag bullet perfectly to .411
I'm going to send it to my friend in Namibia as Horn 44 bullets he can get and can use them to practice with. If either of you would like to borrow it to make up some practice bullets before I send it over let me know.

TSj
Thanks for the offer, I'll pass. Would your buddy like some cast bullets, once I get the mold made and working?
Jim

Arkeypete,yes please let me know when you get it working. I'll buy some from you and send over. he can shoot a few warthogs with them.

arkypete,

Here is a pic of the cases in the dies (416 Rigby on left and 405 Win on right):



The 405 case on the left has had the 416 Rigby exander run completely down it. The case in the 405 Win die has been "neck" sized. The "neck" sizing process sets the 405 Win full length sizing die at approximately 50% of it normal full length sizing position in the press. You have to adjust the 405 Win full length sizing die down until you can get the case to fall all the way into the rifle's chamber. It is a trial and error, iterative process.

Here is a picture of one of the 405 Win cases in the 416 Rigby sizing die. The case / die in my hand is the first 405 Win, which has already been "neck" sized and is sticking out of the 405 Win full length sizing die.



Here are some loaded cartridges. The two on top (marked special) are the expanded cases and the two on the bottom are normally sized 405 Win. You will notice that the bullet bulge is plainly visible on the normally sized 405 Win cartridges. This bulge is non-existent with the expanded cases.



I do not use this process for Rel 7, as it is not necessary. I use it for powders such as IMR4895, IMR4064, Varget, etc so I can fit a little more powder into the case and attempt to achieve Rel 7 performance at a lower operating pressure. The two expanded cases in the above picture have been loaded to 110% powder compression with an IMR 4895. I will report later on the achieved ballistics.

COL for all four cartridges is 3.208".

Scott

Arkypete, still waiting on those pics. I am really interested in the looks of the case colored receiver!! I have been kicking around the idea of restocking mine with some nice black walnut, and case coloring may just have to be done as well. Hence the sense of urgency.

Scott

Just took the pics and will up load them in the morning. Right now they too large for the Hunting 101.
Jim

Thanks! Very nice rifle. Your stock looks just like mine.

Scott

When I was in high school I really wanted a vintage model 95. It was not a practical desire since a Savage 99 or Winchester 88 was lighter, shot farther, was easier to accurately place shots with, and took deer down quicker. But it would have been fun.



Now I am more practical I suppose. Maybe if I lived in TX or FL and had chances to hunt wild hogs a lot I would have a renewed desire for one of these rifles.



If a guy wants to take one on a plains game hunt, then I wish him the best and he should have great fun. Long shots will be out of the question, but that just means he will have to stalk, and stalking is part of hunting.









http://www.hunt101.com/img/118004.JPG

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