Dear AR Hunter guests /

Message JUSI rec'd from my taxidermist in RSA

Regards, Peter
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Please be advised that we are not permitted by US Customs to pack more than one client's trophies in a crate. Each client also needs it's own set of hunting documents in order to apply for the export documents.


Subject: MULTIPLE HUNTER SHIPMENTS ON ONE HUNTING PERMIT

FOR MANY YEARS IN AN ATTEMPT TO SAVE MONEY, HUNTING PARTIES HAVE BEEN CONVINCING THEIR PH'S TO PROVIDE ONE HUNTING REGISTER/PERMIT FOR ALL THE PARTIES TROPHY'S BEING SHIPPED.

WE HAVE BEEN SPREADING THE WORD FOR MONTHS NOW THAT U.S. FISH AND WILDLIFE WILL NO LONGER TOLERATE THIS PRACTICE.

WELL THE SEIZURES HAVE BEGUN!

THE HUNTER LUCKY ENOUGH TO HAVE THEIR NAME ON THE REGISTER/PERMIT ARE GETTING THEIR TROPHIES. ALL THE OTHERS ARE HAVING THE CHOICE OF EITHER EXPORTING THE TROPHIES, AT THEIR EXPENSE BACK WHERE THEY CAME FROM FOR NEW DOCUMENTS AND
RE-EXPORT TO THE U.S. OR HAVING THE TROPHIES SEIZED.

THE FISH AND WILDLIFE SERVICE IS QUICK TO POINT OUT THAT FAILURE TO OBTAIN SEPARATE HUNT REGISTERS/PERMITS FOR EACH HUNTER SKEWS THEIR STATISTICS WHICH DOES NOT PERMIT A TRUE REFLECTION OF WHO IS, WHERE IS AND WHAT IS BEING HUNTED.

IF A HUNTER HAS THE FUNDS TO GO ON A HUNT, THEY SHOULD HAVE THE MONEY TO PAY FOR THE NECESSARY HUNTING REGISTERS AND PERMITS WHICH SUPPORTS THE ECONOMY OF THE AREA THEY ARE HUNTING IN

AS A REMINDER EACH HUNTER MUST BE PACKED IN THEIR OWN CRATE(S) TO MEET THE CUSTOMS AUTOMATED MANIFEST REQUIREMENTS.

PLEASE GO BACK TO THE PH'S YOU ARE WORKING WITH AND SPREAD THE WORD THAT THIS PRACTICE IS NOW A THING OF THE PAST.

THANK YOU.

quote:

IF A HUNTER HAS THE FUNDS TO GO ON A HUNT, THEY SHOULD HAVE THE MONEY TO PAY FOR THE NECESSARY HUNTING REGISTERS AND PERMITS WHICH SUPPORTS THE ECONOMY OF THE AREA THEY ARE HUNTING IN

I wonder if the above statement includes kickbacks from taxidermists to outfitters to be chosen for taxidermy work, or similar payments from shippers to taxidermists or other dubious shipping charges?? Both phenomenons have been well documented of late in the Hunting Report.

As far as I can tell, the taxidermy and shipping professions of (Southern) Africa have smelled blood, and have been doing their best to make sure as much of it as possible stays in their bank accounts. From what I have seen of (South) African taxidermy, they pay 3rd World wages, employ largely unskilled labour, often deliver 3rd World quality at 1st World charges. That, plus their cosy relationships with outfitters and shippers often makes it a pretty unsatisfactory deal for the visiting hunter, regardless of whether the taxidermists believe we should have the dough they deem satisfactory.

Naturally, this comment has nothing to do with the legality (or otherwise) of shipping and importing the trophies of multiple hunters in one crate. The bureaucracy works in mysterious ways, but it does not seem very logical that US Customs should care greatly how many crates were used for shipment and import, as long as hygiene requirements are met, and customs fully paid. But, maybe I'm wrong??

On the other hand, it is easy see a direct interest of (South) African taxidermists and shipping companies in making sure as many separate crates were built, packed and shipped. But maybe I'm seeing conspiracies where surely there is none??

Peter, btw, none of the above reflects on you, so pardon me if I reacted negatively to your post. Nothing personal.

- mike

It may be possible that US Fish and Wildlife is keeping tract of individual hunters kill numbers and species in Africa, but I REALLY DOUBT IT.

Someone who is more concerned about this issue than I should check with US Customs.

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo:
It may be possible that US Fish and Wildlife is keeping tract of individual hunters kill numbers and species in Africa, but I REALLY DOUBT IT.

Someone who is more concerned about this issue than I should check with US Customs.

I am at a loss myself to understand all this bull..it, but I guess like everything in this new world we live in of red tape and spying they want to know more about us than our wives do (-:

I am just the bearer of the bad news, others are the ones whom will benefit from it ... maybe someone can rev
up Fish & Wildlife and see where it gets them

I had to laugh loudly when I read it, have a close look at this paragraph below, see the funny side, looks like a free flight in the hold for the hunter ??

AS A REMINDER EACH HUNTER MUST BE PACKED IN THEIR OWN CRATE(S) TO MEET THE CUSTOMS AUTOMATED MANIFEST REQUIREMENTS.


Peter ( just a peasent downunder with no authority )

Just that much more incentive to leave Africa with some good pictures and a smile and leave all the critters there...

I spoke to a US customs officer about this last month and was told that as long as each hunter has separate documentation there is no need to worry. My understanding is that you can share a crate with other hunters but each person must have their owen paperwork. I think this is just an attempt by the shipping companies to make a few more bucks.

Rosco you're correct. There is a lot of hype in this message. One problem with the concept is that the USA does not give a rip about the amount of species from another countery nor do they give a rip about "who is where or what is being hunted"

This is not a US F&W issue! furthermore if all te trophys are on a single PH register and going to a single person then who cares? the game tally and statistics are the same in RSA or anyother country.

Example a husband and wife or father and son hunting together hunt 10 animals total but all the trophies are in the husbands or fathers name. US F&W will accept this without question as the paperwork from Africa reflects only one hunter. How is this confusing to anyone?

Use this as an Example. Every year there are husbands and wives that will come hunting . The Wives are rare hunters but occasionally a wife will shoot an impala or something. That impala goes onto the husbands regester. Do you really expect that she would have to crate that impala seperate and send it as her own? That is non-sense!

So what would the difference be if it were two buddies that hunted together or a father and son? So long as the register shows all trophies taken, and all are shipped under one name no law is being broken and no worries.

I see and hear this so frequently now that it's just getting silly. US F&W has no idea whether there are 1 hunters trophies or 4 different hunters trophies if all of them are on a single register under one name when they leave Africa.

How could they? More important they don't care! Just talk to them I do all the time and they really don't give a rip about game management in foreign countries or "who is where over seas" One Customs guy told me he would prefer this system to all the additional work it would require to have four seperate inspections and sets of documantation for 4 hunters.

No offence Peter but whom ever sent this out is trying to hype up and panic people. It's simply not at all true the way it is being suggested.

quote:

Originally posted by Balla Balla:
SHOULD HAVE THE MONEY TO PAY FOR THE NECESSARY HUNTING REGISTERS AND PERMITS WHICH SUPPORTS THE ECONOMY OF THE AREA THEY ARE HUNTING IN.

The key sentence. Someone at the 'origin' wants more business.

quote:

Originally posted by JJHACK:


No offence Peter but whom ever sent this out is trying to hype up and panic people. It's simply not at all true the way it is being suggested.

Hi JJHACK

Wonderful to hear from you again ... sounds like all is going exceptionally well for you in Africa, keep up the good work and exceptional client relations as always.

YES this whole fiasco of consignments has stirred up a HORNETS nest, we have not heard the end of it believe me. The information I got was via my taxidermist BUT from their FREIGT company in Jo-burg so I will keep our esteemed guests posted as I have rattled their cage and p[assed on some of the concerns covered

PS: JoAnne is doing well, she is helping Dene a lot in Zambia as we are very busy up there with cape buff as you know /// to all your good people in USA/SA and yourself

Cheers from Peter

Roscoe is right, you can have a couple of different hunters share a crate, but"all" their names must be on the crate and they must have their own paperwok ..

quote:

Originally posted by mho:

As far as I can tell, the taxidermy and shipping professions of (Southern) Africa have smelled blood, and have been doing their best to make sure as much of it as possible stays in their bank accounts. From what I have seen of (South) African taxidermy, they pay 3rd World wages, employ largely unskilled labour, often deliver 3rd World quality at 1st World charges. That, plus their cosy relationships with outfitters and shippers often makes it a pretty unsatisfactory deal for the visiting hunter, regardless of whether the taxidermists believe we should have the dough they deem satisfactory.

You are right on the money.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 500grains:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by mho:

"From what I have seen of (South) African taxidermy, they pay 3rd World wages, employ largely unskilled labour, often deliver 3rd World quality at 1st World charges. That, plus their cosy relationships with outfitters and shippers often makes it a pretty unsatisfactory deal for the visiting hunter"

Allow me to disagree on a few areas:
Yes they pay Third World Wages, what would you like them to do pay exorbitant "First World" union wages? that's nonsense, part of the reason I can save up to 40% of the taxidermy costs here in the US is because of the lower wages over there. Frankly, it's none of my business what they pay.

As to the "Third World Quality" you appear to "broad brush" all African Taxidermists with, you are way off base there. Once again I was given prompt, quality service from the taxidermy work I had done in RSA. I had my stuff imported from Zimbabwe and even with the air freight factored in, I had my trophies on my wall in less than a year and for a lot less money and the quality was excellent. I don't for a minute doubt there are unscrupulous folks in africa and elsewhere, but don't label them all as so. jorge

This worry came to the fore just after our trophies were shipped surface from RSA in late June. Two of us had our trophies crated together but all of the paper work was present and the person to pick up the trophies had a signed Power of Attorney for the trophies from me.

We got a call from the agent yesterday that the trophies had cleared, but that they had to talk the authorities out of sending the shipment back. The agent had to break down the shipment into two parts before it could be cleared.

So ... the warning may not be inappropriate! The federal folks are adding considerable exdpense for us to simplify their task. Some service philosophy!