quote:

Originally posted by ovis:
Savage99,

Just for the record(again), the guide on Admiralty short-stroked the action......not an action malfunction........remember the post on the BGH forum?????

Joe

Joe,

I just noticed that Kensco is still after a Sako 75 in 375HH. It seems that this post slipped by me as there are so many.

To follow thru on it now you say.......

"Savage99,

Just for the record(again), the guide on Admiralty short-stroked the action......not an action malfunction........remember the post on the BGH forum?????

Joe"

Not an action malfunction Joe but a rifle choice error. If the guide on Admiralty used a CRF rifle it would not have jammed on the short stroke! That's the whole point of a CRF on an action that can be operated wrong.

In line or centre feeding PF is the most reliable.

Staggered feed CRF is the nicest to watch working.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by Mike378:
In line or centre feeding PF is the most reliable.

Staggered feed CRF is the nicest to watch working.

Mike

Let's not forget the rotaries. The rotary magazines in my Savage 99 and Blaser R93 are exremely reliable too.

You all have to promise me that Blaser will not be brought up during a serious rife discussion.

quote:

Let's not forget the rotaries. The rotary magazines in my Savage 99 and Blaser R93 are exremely reliable too.

MR,

I think the rotaries could be classed as in line feed.


Mike

Mike,

Thanks for your valued input

They have a map of the world upside down with Australia on top in one of our favorite resturants the Outback. Maybe this is why you did not note that 99's are crf?



http://www.outback.com/companyinfo/international.asp

Savage,

I don't know anything about the 99, in fact I have never seen one in the flesh. But you can have in line feed and CRF and will be done to solve feeding problems with difficult calibres such as 500 Jeffery.

But even an inline feed CRF still has the additinal requirement to get the case rim to go under the extractor.

Mike

Thats why Mauser chose CRF and Kalishnakov selected push feed. Its the human operated gun that needs to be fool proof. The autoloader thinks for itself.

I dont think and auto or semi auto would work with CRF because the bolt would close to quickly.

First, I personally like CRF, but don't hink it makes that much difference; it's really almost a theoretical issue to me.

Second, I don't like 700's due to build quality. Triggers do go bad. Safeties do help kill people. More important to this discussion, bolt handles do come off, usually when put to hard use in a critical situation. This is not just a dangerous game issue, it has happened to people on elk hunts too.

Lastly, am I the only one who has a semantics problem with a lot of this thread? There has been a lot of talk of short stroking actions and this leading to jams in a PF rifle. I always thought short stroking referred to what it says, not cylcling the bolt completely rearward. It is a common problem (operator error again) with people who switch between short action, long action and magnum actions. When you first go to a longer action, your mental wiring tends to bring the bolt back as far as before. The result is not a jam, but an empty chamber whether it is CRF of PF. I have actually seen this happen to people relatively often in hunting situations.

As to the problem referred to here by several people, I always considered that double stroking, which is what really happens. You cycle the action, half chamber a cartridge and then cycle the bolt again to rechamber a round. This will certainly jam a PF action vs a CRF. The problem is, this is an incredibly unnatural sequence which wouldn't be connected to any reflexive action in a stressful situation. The tendency is actually to short stroke and try to shoot an empty chamber due to trying to fire rapidly. I have never seen anyone do this in my 55 years, and have a hard time imagining how it could happen except during a freak situation. The only situation I can envision is that someone cycles the action with the barrel pointed down, starts forward with the bolt, strips a cartridge which falls into the chamber and then looks down with the bolt half closed. Seeing no round, he might retract the bolt to pick up another then jam the rifle. This, however, doesn't seem likely in the context of a "hot" situation. I have a hard time seeing where this whole issue is really relevant.