Aaron,

Sorry mate, I have to disagree with you about weight. Numerous scientific papers (I've even directed you to where you can find some of 'em and incidentally, some of the contributors are the same guys who contributed to the TBGS lion study, so they're hardly lightweights) have proved the weight of a big cat can vary enormously dependent on a variety of factors.... esp breeding. It's not a matter of opinion it's that they can sometimes spend several days breeding and during that time, they lose all interest in everything except pussy. (sorry, couldn't resist that one!)

Also, just think how much the back half of something like an impala weighs and as we all know, half an impala is (reasonably easily) eatable at one sitting for a leopard. That weight doesn't just disappear when it's eaten as Newton's 3rd law proves. (OK, I appreciate I'm misapplying the 3rd law but I'm sure you get the idea ).

Alternatively, if you disagree that weight can vary a lot dependent on the previously mentioned factors, perhaps you could direct me to where I can find some scientific studies that prove your opinion? I've seen a fair few studies that agree with my point of view but I've never seen a single one that agrees with yours.

Nope. 'fraid I can't tell you how to judge a skull but as we've discussed before I do always use sizing marks on the bait tree so I know if the cat is of legal size or not.

Pics. As you probably know, all you've got to do to see pics of cats I've taken is to go look at either of our websites. Incidentally, if you try to right click them, you'll find the function is disabled. The reason for that is I'm sick to death of dodgy bastards (esp instant agents) stealing my images for their own use and without permission....... which is also why I don't post many pics here. (Unless I've posted them previously and/or before I realised how often image theft happens)

As Nakihunter pointed out, size can be, and in the past, has been, abused very easily. The same can be said of weight.

As I said previously, size is of course desireable but the only real way of making any meaninful assessment of trophy quality is skull measurement..... which is why it's the only method used by the record books.

ADDED

A quick Google search has just shown me several references to big cats being recorded as able to eat 25% of their own body weight when the need to. All you gotta do is ask any of the search engines and there's plenty of info there.

quote:

Originally posted by robncolorado:
My leopard taken in zim last year weighed right at 180, had a skull measurement of 17-3/8 and I was told this was a monster..... I am fairly strong and it was a bitch to lift!!

That my friend is truly a massive Leopard.

Note big Leopard have big skulls so the weight guess is fairly indicative of age.

I have found that Leopard rarely gorge themselves as the bait is presented in a fashion that it is difficult to feed. It is important to keep the cat hungry when baiting.

Steve - As I have said several times, I agree with the fact that skull measurement is the ONLY real way to score a cat.

As for the rest, you can keep reading your books, and I'll stick with the 350 plus days I've spent hunting cats throughout Africa as my guide.

Good day, gotta go!

Righto mate, but if you don't mind I'll continue to be guided by proven science and my 30 years of hunting Africa.

Hey, at least we agree that skull measurement is the only realistic way to score a cat trophy and I'm sure we also both agree that the size of the cat mentioned at the beginning of this thread is a very nice cat indeed.

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
Righto mate, but if you don't mind I'll continue to be guided by proven science and my 30 years of hunting Africa.

Ya, I'm still waiting for all those pics of you & your clients together, with lions & leopards. After "30 years" of hunting em, you must have a bunch!

Mate, I've told you where to find some of them and I've told you why I only post pics I've previously posted before I got wise to image theft and I've told you why the right click function is disabled on our sites.

If you don't think image theft is serious try doing a Google on the titles of the pics on your own site and then click images and I bet you'll find your own pics all over the place there as well...... it really is a real bastard situation and damn near impossible to stop completely.

We've even found dodgy bastards who have stolen our logo and pics and used them to market hookey DVD copies.

I'll post my old pics or someone elses if I'm asked to and bugger all else.

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
Mate, I've told you where to find some of them and I've told you why I only post pics I've previously posted before I got wise to image theft and I've told you why the right click function is disabled on our sites.

If you don't think image theft is serious try doing a Google on the titles of the pics on your own site and then click images and I bet you'll find your own pics all over the place there as well...... it really is a real bastard situation and damn near impossible to stop completely.

We've even found dodgy bastards who have stolen our logo and pics and used them to market hookey DVD copies.

I'll post my old pics or someone elses if I'm asked to and bugger all else.

Hmmmm!!!!

Aaron,

I will of course remove this image if you like but I post it as an example of how easy it is.



This took me all of 3 minutes to do but anyone who knows the basics of photoshop could do a similar thing, add whatever message they wanted and even remove your face and replace it with something or someone else etc in a fairly short time..... and that's just if they know the basics.... if they're real fundis, there's virtually no end to what they can do.

We've disabled the right click function on our sites but even that doesn't stop them and there's no end of ways someone can swipe your images and/or content.

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
Aaron,

I will of course remove this image if you like but I post it as an example of how easy it is.



This took me all of 3 minutes to do but anyone who knows the basics of photoshop could do a similar thing, add whatever message they wanted and even remove your face and replace it with something or someone else etc in a fairly short time..... and that's just if they know the basics.... if they're real fundis, there's virtually no end to what they can do.

We've disabled the right click function on our sites but even that doesn't stop them and there's no end of ways someone can swipe your images and/or content.

Yep, maybe you're right - Image theft! Something I've been worried about for years now. But I got over it, and decided to take my chances. To me, it was more important to SHOW my experiences, and that of my clients, so those that considered a hunt with GHR, would know that I have the experience, background, and knowledge, to steer them down the right path. But that's just me.

Appreciate the expertise and insight on cats. Very interesting.

This particular cat was taken over bait in a southern camp of the Bubye.

muygrande,

The lowveld of Zimbabwe including the Bubye and Save Conservancies may be THE place foe a really big leopard.

Mark