I gave my nephew that is 15 a copy of "Death in the Long Grass" He has killed a boatload of deer and he just likes to hunt. He doesnt care what as long as he is hunting.
Hoping when I get to go to Africa he will want to come too.

I did the same with my 19 year old cousin after I made my first trip in 2000. It didn't have the desired effect. In all my trips back he has never shown any interest in tagging along.

Death in the Long Grass started me dreaming about Africa. My first hunting trip to Africa followed a couple of years later, but I spent a great deal of time dreaming about it and never believing that it could happen. In the past 8 years and countless trips, Africa has taken over my life.

IMHO part of becoming addicted to Africa is spending some time dreaming about going while not really believing that it could ever happen.

I have conflicting feelings about fathers who take their teenage sons hunting in Africa. I could be wrong, but I believe taking someone who has not had the chance to really dream about it first can cheapen the experience.

I base this on conversations that I have had with teenage hunters in airports. They rarely know exactly where they are hunting and can only name a few of the animals they will be hunting. I always feel that this is a real shame. I might be full of BS on this, but I think that having Africa handed to you spoils the experience to some extent. Because they have nothing invested, the experience is more superficial. I do think that enjoying the hunt together might mean more to a son than a love affair with Africa would.

My advise would be to let your nephew read the book then see if he mentions anything about a desire to go. I would not mention your plans until he has had a chance to start really burning to go.

Part of the reason I fell so hard for Africa is because I did not know anyone who had ever done anything as huge as hunting in Africa. From the time I made my first inquiry to an outfit, until I was walking through the bush, rifle in hand, I could not really believe what I was doing.


Jason

A subscription to Outdoor Life from the time I was in sixth grade circa 1964 got me interested, especially the stories by Jack O'Connor. What set the hook was being a member of the Outdoor Life Book Club and getting stuck with a copy of Ruark's "Use Enough Gun" that I was at first reluctant to pay for. Thank God I didn't send it back in time, because reading it left me a changed human being.
I think Africa, like a passionate kiss, is best if one has longed for it for a long time ...

I like JBrown's 4th and 5th paragraphs. I had never given it any thought, but I agree.

I think it means much more to the father than it does to the son if the hunt is just given without the son paying any dues. Meaning, wanting it enough, and not in the sense of him "wanting" to attend the hottest rock concert, or buying a Wii.

Maybe it's as simple as the son being the "driver" for the hunt. If out-of-the-blue the son said he wanted to hunt Africa, or can explain why he wanted to hunt Africa, that might be enough for me to think he was ready.

My brother's son, my nephew, hunted deer a little. My brother, his dad, hunted deer some, and jackrabbits with me a bunch when we were growing up in New Mexico. I told them I was going to Africa hunting some years ago. (It had been a dream all my life.) My brother was immediately interested, but I noticed it didn't seem to be any big deal to my nephew. I was surprised. It was AFRICA for God's sake, not the Davey Crockett National Forest.

I'm glad I hadn't told them the rest of my plan. I would be the one providing the rifles for the Plains Game hunt, and I had got it straight in my mind that after the hunt I was going to gift my Remington .308 Win that I had grown up with to my nephew after he finished the hunt with it. (That would be a big deal to me, because my son doesn't hunt, and I had always planned giving HIM my rifles.) I thought that would blow my nephew away, because he and my brother don't own "deer rifles". They always borrowed from friends when they hunted deer.

Anyway, I kept my plan secret and watched as the excuses started piling-up over time. Eventually they backed-out. The son "had a girlfriend", and my brother wasn't sure post-9/11 whether he was comfortable flying internationally.

The simple fact; they didn't want to hunt Africa bad enough, they hadn't earned it. I've never asked them again, and won't. If they asked me, I would probably get switched back on, but just telling some teenager "we're going to hunt Africa" doesn't do it for me, I would rather just buy him tickets to the rock concert of his choice and tell him "enjoy".

Quote
"Ihave conflicting feelings about fathers who take their teenage sons hunting in Africa. I could be wrong, but I believe taking someone who has not had the chance to really dream about it first can cheapen the experience.

I base this on conversations that I have had with teenage hunters in airports. They rarely know exactly where they are hunting and can only name a few of the animals they will be hunting. I always feel that this is a real shame. I might be full of BS on this, but I think that having Africa handed to you spoils the experience to some extent. Because they have nothing invested"

"I think it means much more to the father than it does to the son if the hunt is just given without the son paying any dues. Meaning, wanting it enough, and not in the sense of him "wanting" to attend the hottest rock concert, or buying a Wii."



Hmmm....I don't know about that. I've only been to Africa once, so I'm a rank beginner. But I am a parent of a teenager so I have some knowlege there. If you wait until you son/daughter "earns it" or "pays their dues" you will be missing out on experience that you will never be able to make up. Never, and I mean never.

If your teenage son/daughter is willing to spend a week with you hunting or whatever, you drop what you are doing and jump at the opportunity.

The other day I asked my teenage son to go goose hunting with me. The birds were really flying and I knew it'd be a good hunt. We had it all planned. About 30 minutes before we were ready to go (it was a afternoon hunt) a teenage girl called and asked him to go to a movie. That was it, I was relagated to second place. And I'll probably remain there for another decade.

You wait until your teenager somehow "earns it" and before you know it you will be an old man and your teenager will be out on his own and that will be that. There is no rule that you have to be a fat bald 50 year old before you go on safari to Africa. It just turns out that way.

I took my son to the Selous when he was 15. I spent 8 days, just he and I and his mom. All the rest of you parents out there tell me the last time you spent 8 days alone with your teenager one on one.

When I read about parents taking their kids on safari whether PG or the big 5; I'm jealous. Jealous that they got to see it all unfold and spend uninterrupted time with their kids. Jealous because I had to wait unti I was a jaded 50+ year old before I went to Africa.

Sure your kid may not appreciate it at the time but wait, as the years go by you'd be surpised how the subject comes up.

It has been almost 2 years since we went to the Selous. The other day I told my son that he better get his room cleaned up or there'd be hell to pay with his mother. He responded: "Heh, I faced down a charging cape buffalo; I'm not afraid of Mom."

He was wrong, of course.

My problem is having to say "No, you cannot go with me this time" to my sons when I tell them that I'm going to Africa.

I have seven sons, ranging in age from 41 years old to nine, the youngest going with me in March 2009 to hunt in South Africa. Some have become avid hunters in their own right. Some have come to love Africa almost as much as the land of their birth but have no further desire to shoulder a rifle to hunt game. As for my daughters (I have seven), some I have hunted with in Alaska and some had rather spend their leisure on the beaches of Hawaii or Mexico, but none of them are adverse to hunting.



My 11-year old son, Rizal, with his Namibian springbok.


I probably will not take my grandsons with me to Africa. I'll leave that to my sons and daughters do that in their time.

I have not had to ask my children to accompany me hunting. It's them that have to ask. Why they would rather leave their friends, cars, and electronic games to endure the hot of the African day and hear the chilling cries of the veld in the night, I don't know. It's not for me to formulate their thoughts.

Namibiahunter

I have always dreamed about Africa...hell hunting abroad period! My dad hunts every year..but only 1 place, and with the same people. My brother as well. They just don't have the desire I do to get out and see other parts of the world and hunt in exotic places. Heck it took 2 seasons of me going antelope hunting 3 hours away before my brother considered going as well.

I got my urge the same way a few others mentioned...even if dad only liked the idea of being the great outdoorsmen, his life long subscriptions to Outdoor Life and Field & Stream is what gave me the lust. I can still remember sitting on the floor near our front door in the afternoon when I got home from school, when the sun was shining in, and him reading me stories about Africa and other places. Now, for the longest time it was just PG that interested me, but it was Death In The Long Grass, that gave me the hunger for DG. This forum hasn't helped much either lol My plans for a simple PG hunt have turned into saving an extra year or two and tackling some big boys.

While I like Capstick, he is a bit sensational. I suggest that you try HUNTER by J.A. Hunter. Since Hunter recounts his youth and was only a bit older than your nephew, it may well be of added interest to the young man. HUNTER was the first book I read about Africa and at the age of 12, I knew that safari was in my future.

My daughters asked me to take them to Africa this past summer. I had no idea how they'd like it so I did some touristy stuff, some hunting stuff and some visiting friends stuff.

I knew that I'd done the right thing when I looked at my respective daughters' dorm room and apartment this fall after our safari.

The hunter had pictures of dead animals everywhere and the non-hunter had pictures of Victoria Falls and African sunsets.

Both pay attention to the Zimbabwe political system, both went to the P.H.'s website to find their pictures (before I even told them they were "up"), both are planing on coming home from college when the P.H. visits in late January.

I got lucky, I guess, because, I think they wanted to go (and asked to do so) initially because they wanted to know why their father always looked towards the southeast sky, hoping that the Southern Cross would magically appear. They didn't really prepare for the trip as I'd have liked them to, but they got hooked.... Both have even hinted that when the time for marriage comes, they'd like a small wedding and save the money for a honeymoon to Victoria Falls.

My kind of ladies!



Hunter daughter with camp meat impala that she first saw, stalked and shot while we all watched from several hundred yards away on the safari car. It was cool! I think she was happy doing it herself... nice smile, huh?


This sunset picture is poster-sized over the mantle in my non-hunting daughter's appartment.

We all have dreams and rightly so... That is what life is about... Keeping the dream alive and always look at the possibility of carrying out your wish.. I did just that, Yes I have read Capstick, Ruark, Hunter, Corbett, and many more.. But one has to take that step and make it come true... I did no regrets and have lived my dream...
Dreaming of simba now...Aug. 09

Mike
what dreams are made of...

quote:

Originally posted by Sidnye:
But I am a parent of a teenager so I have some knowlege there. If you wait until you son/daughter "earns it" or "pays their dues" you will be missing out on experience that you will never be able to make up. Never, and I mean never.

If your teenage son/daughter is willing to spend a week with you hunting or whatever, you drop what you are doing and jump at the opportunity.

That was why I said that I had mixed feelings about it.

quote:

The other day I asked my teenage son to go goose hunting with me. The birds were really flying and I knew it'd be a good hunt. We had it all planned. About 30 minutes before we were ready to go (it was a afternoon hunt) a teenage girl called and asked him to go to a movie. That was it, I was relagated to second place. And I'll probably remain there for another decade.

Growing up without anyone to take me hunting that would have never happened if I had a goose hunt planned when I was that age.....

quote:

You wait until your teenager somehow "earns it" and before you know it you will be an old man and your teenager will be out on his own and that will be that. There is no rule that you have to be a fat bald 50 year old before you go on safari to Africa. It just turns out that way.

You are correct, if you wait it may never happen. But you don't have to be old to have "earned it." I went alone at 25 and paid for it out of my own pocket. It is a question of desire, not age.

Jason

I suspect the dynamics can be different, a niece/nephew, grandchild or cousin may be different then a son/daughter. It all depends on the child, and the adult/mentor. Most of the PH’s I talk to have horror stories about “spoiled brats” who do not appreciate what has been given to them. This has not been my personal experience, nor does it need to be yours.

As many of you know, I have taken my boys to Africa for years. These shared experiences have been instrumental in our relationship and have provided me with countless fond memories. Most importantly and far more significant then just the hunting, Africa - the travel, adventure, people, culture, suffering, wonder - has become part of their identities, who they are and how they view the world. For my wife and I, it has helped make our job of parenting easier, and continues to be the best investment in time and money that we have ever made.

So far so good. Bill Jr is a sophomore at Penn State w/a 3.5 GPA in Engineering while playing on the tennis team and working part-time at Lowes. Brett is a senior in high school, a captain on football and volleyball, and taking college courses and participating in a program job shadowing doctors at the local hospital (he wants to become either a surgeon or an anesthesiologist). Both are athletic, mature, well-liked and grounded.

My point is… raising kids today is not easy, there are a lot of distractions and temptations out there – for the kids as well as the parents!!! Anything that can assist us is worth the effort. It does not need to be Africa, it could be the deer woods or the trout stream. I have been fortunate that I have been able to include my sons in on MY dreams, which has helped them to develop a firm foundation so that they are able to achieve theirs.

This being said, I test the waters every so often with statements such as “If you ever return to Africa again, blahblahblah….” And I always get an “IF!?!? - you mean WHEN!!!”

Brett 2001:






Billy 2003:








Billy & Brett 2005:










Brett 2007:








Billy 2008:






Man they grow fast – get what you can, and cherish every moment!

I have two kids, both boys. They have been out hunting with me since they were big enough to step over a stick. The older of the two has been hunting with a gun for these last two seasons. I plan to take them to Africa, probably Namibia, for a plainsgame hunt for a HS graduation present. I certainly see the point of not doing that and making them "earn" the hunt as I had to. On the other hand, life can be a lot shorter than you plan it to be. My guys look at me with these huge puppy dog eyes when I leave on a far-away hunting trip. If I had the financial wherewithal to take them with me, it would be real hard for me to tell them, "No, you haven't quite earned it yet."

Interesting topic, but I will definitely take each of my sons as soon as I can get the scratch together to make it happen.

quote:

Originally posted by wihntr:
I have two kids, both boys. They have been out hunting with me since they were big enough to step over a stick. The older of the two has been hunting with a gun for these last two seasons. I plan to take them to Africa, probably Namibia, for a plainsgame hunt for a HS graduation present. I certainly see the point of not doing that and making them "earn" the hunt as I had to. On the other hand, life can be a lot shorter than you plan it to be. My guys look at me with these huge puppy dog eyes when I leave on a far-away hunting trip. If I had the financial wherewithal to take them with me, it would be real hard for me to tell them, "No, you haven't quite earned it yet."

Interesting topic, but I will definitely take each of my sons as soon as I can get the scratch together to make it happen.

I agree, life often is too short. That is why I feel so conflicted about this whole issue.

If they are looking at you with those "huge puppy dog eyes" it is safe to say that the desire is there.



Bill
I feel like I have watched your sons grow up through your hunt reports over the years. I think the way your trips are much more than just "hunts" really adds to the experience for everyone involved. It reminds me of the teenagers who I have met on the flight home who where doing church work in Africa. Their parents may have pushed them to go, but it is always clear that they grew from the experience and really enjoyed it.


Jason

As my years increase I can't help but think back to when my three sons were young. Was there ever a father who said "I wish I had spent less time with my children"? Yet, we can't instill the same passion for Africa in our children as we have - in that sense they really do have to "earn it". Spend time with them - absulutely; take them on safari - if you can afford it; but always instill in them the dream to go. What they do with that dream is theirs, and theirs alone. In the end, each of us dreams alone.

quote:

Originally posted by JudgeG:
While I like Capstick, he is a bit sensational. I suggest that you try HUNTER by J.A. Hunter. Since Hunter recounts his youth and was only a bit older than your nephew, it may well be of added interest to the young man. HUNTER was the first book I read about Africa and at the age of 12, I knew that safari was in my future.

My daughters asked me to take them to Africa this past summer. I had no idea how they'd like it so I did some touristy stuff, some hunting stuff and some visiting friends stuff.

I knew that I'd done the right thing when I looked at my respective daughters' dorm room and apartment this fall after our safari.

The hunter had pictures of dead animals everywhere and the non-hunter had pictures of Victoria Falls and African sunsets.

Both pay attention to the Zimbabwe political system, both went to the P.H.'s website to find their pictures (before I even told them they were "up"), both are planing on coming home from college when the P.H. visits in late January.

I got lucky, I guess, because, I think they wanted to go (and asked to do so) initially because they wanted to know why their father always looked towards the southeast sky, hoping that the Southern Cross would magically appear. They didn't really prepare for the trip as I'd have liked them to, but they got hooked.... Both have even hinted that when the time for marriage comes, they'd like a small wedding and save the money for a honeymoon to Victoria Falls.

My kind of ladies!



Hunter daughter with camp meat impala that she first saw, stalked and shot while we all watched from several hundred yards away on the safari car. It was cool! I think she was happy doing it herself... nice smile, huh?


This sunset picture is poster-sized over the mantle in my non-hunting daughter's appartment.

The J.A. Hunter book sounds like a good idea. I might just do that. He enjoys hunting rather its deer, squirrel or whatever. All you have to do is mention the word shoot something and he is ready. Doesn't matter if its rifle, pistol, shotgun .22 whatever.