I'm having a .416 Rem made for my upcoming hunt in 2006. I don't care for muzzle brakes, but would be interested to know the thoughts of Forum members.

bwana dogo,

Welcome. This is not the correct forum for posts like this.

Would you like this moved to the 'African Hunting', 'Big Bores', or some other forum?

George

Agreed, try the big bore forum. That said there is no need for a brake on a 416 rem. I shoot mine from the bench with no ill effects. It is simply not that much gun to worry about. Start slow and never shoot more than you can take in one outing. If you begin to think about the shot it's time to quit for the day. In no time you'll be an old pro.

Good luck.

John

Howdy- Sorry I put this in the wrong area!Please move this to African Hunting. Thanks Bwana Dogo

Bwana,
when I moved from 30-06 to .416 I was afraid of the advertised kick and resulting flinching.
SO I had the rifle build with a Vais muzzle brake as well as a nice butt shock absorber.

Now I shoot the 416 without much trouble.
Dont know whether the brake does that much,but I keep it on.
One has to realize that " real men" dont need it,even scoff at it.
So you have to walk as an underclass citizen,but it shoots real nice

I have not hunted africa, but made the mistake of hunting pig in CA with a braked rifle. actually not a mistake, my primary failed the weekend before in double checking everything and the 06 with a brake was sadly the backup gun.

Problem lies in if you dn't kill it first shot, you'll be so damn deaf that you can't hear what the hell the PH will be saying to you. Not to mention if he is like the guide I had on the pig hunt he's going to be pissed about the noise himself.

Red

Karibu, bwana!

I have muzzle brakes on five hard-kicking rifles and use them quite often when shooting off the bench. That's when you really need them. And they do work, but they are LOUD!

So, all of mine are removable, and I never use them while hunting. In the field, I replace them with a barrel diameter threaded cap.

Hi Bwana:

I have three breaked DG rifles, I wouldn't be without them. Like Lex said I have a threaded end so I can put a cap on the end when I am hunting if I want. I usually just leave the break on anyway.

On my 458 Lott the break is always satying on that puppy... LOL

I also use the electronic muffs, thay actually INCREASE my hearing in the field and supress all of the rifle shot completely. My hearing was damaged in the military so any electronic help in the field is welcome.

Regards... Jim P.

Dago Red,
DO NOT PUT ON A MUZZLE BRAKE!
IMO if you need a muzzle brake, then it is to much rifle for you. They are disliked in Africa by almost everyone, some PH'S will not allow you to shoot with one. If you value your hearing and everyone else's you won't use one.CHEERS

There is nothing wrong with muzzle brakes, when used to work up loads, or zeroing a scope, or fileing in iron sights. The problem is with the guy sitting on the next bench, not as much the noise, because everybody uses hearing protection, but the muzzle blast shock wave henders the other persons' shooting. In the field, you don't notice recoil in any big way, so there is no need for a brake there. the threaded cap should be used in the field.

I have owned, and shot just about every butt kicking cartridge ever invented, and I have exactly two firearms with breaks fitted. One is a TC Contender super 14 heavy barrel, that was re-chambered to 411 JDJ, from 41 Rem Mag. The brake was added, mainly, to make the barrel long enough so it could be legally used with a rifle stock. It is perminently mounted and is now 16 1/4". The other is, believe it or not, and Mauser rifle chambered for 30-06, and has a 16" length of pull on the very over size stock. It must have been built for a very large person, who couldn't take recoil at all! I bought it for the action, so the braked barrel doesn't make any difference. I'd take the brake off for hunting, and use it on the bench, when on the range!

I had my .404 made up w/ a detachable brake. After getting the sights dialed in I started shooting it w/o the brake & it hasn't been on since. JM nickles worth.

The only rifle that I have with a brake is a .50 BMG.After seeing a guy at the gun club 8 benches down leer at me then load up and leave did I figure out how much of the blast is redirected.My .416 rem. was a bitch to shoot untill I figured out how to shoot it.Now I have no problem shooting it from the bench.

I regards to P.H.s not liking them.They see lots of guys who cant shoot,then they feel the need to lend a shoulder as a rifle rest.I would not want anyone shooting off my shoulder, little less with a big bore that has a brake.

If a brake helps you shoot better then by all means use one...Many of our hunters use them and they all shoot well with them...Some that don't flinch from recoil btw...

We would rather you shot well and make big noises...I used them early on and then took them off from time to time and they taught me to handle recoil..I don't need them anymore but I did at one time.

Thank you all for your input. Bwana Dogo

No muzzle breaks for me. I hate their looks, and I simply can't tolerate the noise they produce. I'd rather deal with the recoil straight-up. I do better with recoil than noise........

AD

No muzzle break for me. I made the mistake of putting brakes on 2 of my guns. Hated them. Sold the guns. Decided I should not subject guides and hunting buddies to the noise abuse.

If I can't shoot it well without a brake, I'll get a smaller gun.

I have two rifles with muzzle brakes. I primarily use them on the bench to work up loads. The 338 lapua and 7mm STW can be punishing while shooting from the bench. The noise is not a factor as I use hearing protection. When in the field the muzzle brake is replaced with the solid steel collar and the recoil is not noticed when firing at game. I like them and it has made my sighting-in and load testing enjoyable!

I shoot several rifles with and several without muzzle brakes. All my rifles above .300 Winny have brakes, and those I shoot and never take them off. I like brakes on the larger stuff. If you don't wear hearing protection while shooting any rifle you are making a mistake and abusing you ears. From the bench I use plugs and muffs, in the field a hearing enhanced muff. My son and grandsons also shoot my big stuff with brakes. My benchs are private so I can shoot anything to my hearts content, which I do three days a week, weather permitting. I have shot my rifles from this country, to Alaska, Alberta, and Africa, and have never had any grips about the brakes. I hunt Colorado yearly for Elk on our own with a group of buddies that shoot Winchester Boss equipped .300 Winny's that will all shoot one holers, when the shooter does his part. Talk about looks all you want to, we want the bullet to go where we aim it and do it's job. I don't knock anyone for not using brakes, if you want to watch me shoot the big stuff with brakes you will appreciate why I use them when you look at my targets. Good shooting.

quote:

Originally posted by phurley5:
All my rifles above .300 Winny have brakes, and those I shoot and never take them off.

Talk about looks all you want to, we want the bullet to go where we aim it and do it's job. I don't knock anyone for not using brakes, if you want to watch me shoot the big stuff with brakes you will appreciate why I use them when you look at my targets. Good shooting.

You may shoot what ever you want, it's your money spent on the rifles you use! At the range others should have ear protection anyway. Other than dampening "FELT" recoil, brakes do absolutely nothing! If your rifle will shoot "one holers" with the Brake, or the useless BOSS, then it will shoot one holers with out them.

Your statement that all your rifles from 300 Win Mag have brakes, is puzzeling! Why on Earth would anyone need a brake on a little 300 Win Mag?

This isn't meant as a flame, It is just that I don't understand what your brakes have to do with your rifle's accuracy. I shoot rifles that would make a 300 winnie's recoil feel like a .22 lr,in comparrison, and I see absolutely no need/reason for a break! Puzzeling.............

A muzzle brake on a fine rifle is an abomination. About like putting a muffler on a race car so as not to disturb the little old ladies in the crowd.

MacD37 ----- You posted the quote but you did not read it. What I said was "all my rifles above a .300 Winny had brakes". ----- I have brakes on a .340 Wby, .338 Lapua, two .358 STA's, .416 Rem and .416 Rigby. They all will shoot a one hole groups when I do my part. In my opinion some of that accuracy is due to the brakes, whether it is recoil or weight on the barrel. I am simply saying this is how it works for me, your methods may be different, if they work for you, more power to you. Looks are in the eye of the beholder, and my brakes look very good when I put the bullet where I want it. Good shooting.

Phurley5, as I said I meant no disrespect, but was simply confused as to your claim that brakes somehow make a rifle more accurate. That was a marketing ploy brought about by the folks who brought out the BOSS, and it simply has no phisical effect on accuracy. It may let you shoot more comfortably, and I suppose that might make "YOU" shoot better, but not the rifle. That is all I was saying, and asking for your reasoning on! If your reasoning is they reduce felt recoil, then you are correct, they do! Regardless whether I read your post properly or not,the chamberings you listed above the 300WM don't need a brake either, but if you like them, have no problem with you useing them. In fact if you want a brake for your 300WM I have one on a 30-06 barrel that I will be happy to remove, and mail it to you free of charge, if you want it! Just send me a mailing address!

You are right, as well, about the way things look, being a personal thing, if not, all wives would have the same color hair, and all of us would drive the same make/model car. I have zero opinion on the way a brake looks, that is up to the owner, as is his right to use them, or to believe the maker's claims. I do have a right, as well, to take exception to claims for them that have not been proven to be the case, and in fact have been proven otherwise.

I have absolutely no objection to you useing your brakes, as long as they don't damage MY ears, and I doubt yours will ever be fired on one of my hunts, so it certainly has no effect on me, one way, or the other.

Mac,
I think it is a proven fact that a brake in some cases can change the viberation pattern of a barrel upon firing and that could or could not make it more accurate as it can go either way...I have had some rifles that shot better groups with a brake and some that did better without them, and I am sure it was not me, as I don't flinch, ever, never just don't .....albiet I don't care for excessive recoil...

I think Phurley is correct based on some of my experiences with different rifles..and I know for sure that in the real world a heck of a lot of folks will flinch with a 300 Whatchamacallit or even a 30-06....

My take is if anyone can shoot better with a muzzle brake then use one, they have become accepted devises..I have used them in the past and they served me well in making it possible for me to shoot any rifle with developing a flinch and as a result of using them I no longer use nor need them...

As for someone else hunting with someone that has them, then it's up to them to place theirself out of harms way...God gave you finger to stick in your ears, not to eat with, you don't need them for eating just look at your dog! I hunt with a lot of clients that use them, Saeed has one on one of his rifles, I simply stick my ear plugs in when he shoots or my fingers..

It is just not the big deal to me that some make it, because I know any big bore rifle is over the top in noise and they ALL will get your hearing...What? What? did you say something....

MacD37 ----- Thanks for your answer, and don't worry about me hurting your ears, unless you come shoot on my private benchs, which you would be welcome if you so choose. ----- Let me explain my statement about accuracy and brakes. I shoot 3000 plus rounds per year through my rifles and many, many other rifles of my buddies who don't want to spend the time shooting that I do. Most of these guys are Elk-Deer hunting buddies or just local shooters. They all comment on the acccuracy of my rifles and notice the brakes on the larger chamberings I shoot. Several of them have seen what the Boss equiped barrels can do and have gone to them. There are those who still knock the Boss, but if you or anyone else will shoot them enough to find your sweet spot, they actually do work and work well. The key is to shoot the rifle enough to find that spot, then you are good to go. ----- Back to my brakes. I have two .358 STA's, each a custom with a brake. They are one hole drillers when I do my part. With both rifles, if the brake gets loose only a fraction of a turn, they will not put most bullets on a 8 X 11 sheet of paper, and that from a one hole group with the tight brake. Other rifles of mine with brakes see a little difference with loose brakes, but not that much. ----- My theory, for what it is worth. Each barrel has it's own characteristics, put a weight on the end of that barrel and that weight whether it is a Boss or Brake and that weight has a stabilizing affect on the barrel. Better harmonics, if you will, we all know the harmonics of that barrel tells the tail on accuracy. Shoot that barrel enough to tell what that affect is and you have an accuract rifle. Providing the barrel has no problems otherwise. ----- Do you have to have a brake or boss to have an accurate rifle, certainly not. I have an old Model 70 Winchester in .300 Winny that will drill one holers all day when I do my part, and it will do it for my son and grandson also. All I am saying is that from my shooting experiences, those rifles with a brake or boss can be made to shoot very accurately when you shoot it enough to determine it's characteristics. Once again, this is just my opinion from lots of shooting with lots of rifles, the good, bad and ugly. Good shooting.

BD,

It's much better to be the shooter than a bystander when a muzzle-braked rifle goes off.

George

George,
Why is that? Do you not have ear protection, if not I will send you some. Noise is not second hand smoke it will not hurt an observer with ear plugs or fingers.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
Mac,
I think it is a proven fact that a brake in some cases can change the viberation pattern of a barrel upon firing and that could or could not make it more accurate as it can go either way
I think Phurley is correct based on some of my experiences with different rifles..and I know for sure that in the real world a heck of a lot of folks will flinch with a 300 Whatchamacallit or even a 30-06....

My take is if anyone can shoot better with a muzzle brake then use one, ...

RAY that is exactly what I said in my post! If it makes YOU shoot better,use them, but if the rifle needs brake to change the hormonics of the barrel, then the rifle either has a twiffy barrel, or is not properly bedded. When you get down to the nut cuttin, brakes do one thing, reduce the FELT RECOIL, PERIOD!

Ray,

When there is DG around, my ears are unplugged, the better to hear the "chuff" of the beastie, and my fingers are on my rifle, not in my ears!

George

I think you should try the gun without a muzzle brake and if the recoil is too much for you to feel comfortable with, put one on. That is what they are for. I think the main problem that some people have with muzzle brakes is it makes them feel less "macho". Just my humble opinion.

I think most benefits offered from a brake can be equalled by a well designed stock. A good stock with a good recoil pad (pach. 990 for example) would probably surpass the comfort offered from a brake.

Having said that, the only large bore braked guns I have shot were 12 ga slug guns. Most others were 338, either RUM or WM, down to '06 size.

George,
You are such a wimp, I have hunted dangerous game for years with my fingers in my ears! but only when hunting "chuffs"

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
George,
You are such a wimp, I have hunted dangerous game for years with my fingers in my ears! but only when hunting "chuffs"

quote:

Originally posted by phurley5:
MacD37 ----- Thanks for your answer, and don't worry about me hurting your ears, unless you come shoot on my private benchs, which you would be welcome if you so choose.<<SNIP

SNIP>>All I am saying is that from my shooting experiences, those rifles with a brake or boss can be made to shoot very accurately when you shoot it enough to determine it's characteristics. Once again, this is just my opinion from lots of shooting with lots of rifles, the good, bad and ugly. Good shooting.

Phurley5, I would love to shoot on your range, and, like you, I shoot quite a lot, though not as much as I used to. I have about 75 rifles, and all are, at least, MOA shooters, except the double rifles, and all are hunting rifles except one bull barrel bench rifle chambered for 22-250, and none have brakes, or BOSS systems of any kind.

The .30 barrel I mentioned had the brake on it when I bought the rifle for it's action, and stock. This break has a treaded muzzle,with a sleeve inside that can be turned either way to dirrect the shock wave, and also treads onto the muzzle of course, and as I mentioned, I will send it too you if you want it! I agree that most think the brake or BOSS does make the rifle more accurate, and it may, but IMO, it is simply it makes shooting more comfotable, and in turn makes the SHOOTER shoot better.

It all boils down to the fact that BRAKES are generally dispised in most hunting camps, and are a thing I simply do not have any use for! Others may use them, this IS a free country,after all, that gives shooters free choice!

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
George,
You are such a wimp, I have hunted dangerous game for years with my fingers in my ears! but only when hunting "chuffs"

Well, with Walter around to back you up, you'd better reconsider. He thinks a Blaser R93 is a proper firearm.

George

If it is going to be a closet big bore and not have a PH around, probably doesn't matter.

But if hunting DG, it is a disservice to the PH and the helper bees using a brake. If the PH has to come into action, I doubt he can stick his fingers in his ears and aim his rifle at the same time.

Besides that the PH might be some old dude, like Ray, and the blast from the brake will blow his toupee away into the bush, never to be seen again.

Will,

Ray removes his toupee while hunting; that's why he wear's that silly baseball cap , instead of a classy chapeau like mine.

George

MacD37 ----- WOW, 75 rifles, and I thought I had several with two full safes. Sounds like you are a shooter after my heart. If you ever get close to me in western Kentucky, look me up and you would always be welcome to my little shooting range, it is primitive but efficient and very private on my son's farm. ----- I have a shooting buddy who builds rifles for himself, he is the best checkerer, if that is a word, I have ever seen who is not a gunsmith. We shoot three days a week unless we have a project and maybe more if that is the case. We get all our buddies rifles ready for Deer and Elk, and whatever they will be hunting, plus shoot all our own. We shoot all types and sizes, the largest a .577 T Rex for a normal rifle or a 50 BMG that belongs to a nephew. ----- When the guys here at AR start talking about the brakes and that if you can't handle the recoil, shoot something smaller, that is not the reason I shoot brakes on the larger chamberings. I shoot all shapes and sizes of chamberings anyway, with and without the brakes. I shoot the brakes on my own rifles because of comfort of shooting on the bench and my "theory of percieved accuracy". I always double up on ear protection regardless of what I am shooting, braked or unbraked, and get yearly hearing tests to make sure I do no damage. I also shoot a considerable amount of skeet where ear protection is a given. Bottom line, I shoot brakes because of what they do for me, it is that simple. Good shooting.

quote:

Originally posted by phurley5:
MacD37 ----- I always double up on ear protection regardless of what I am shooting, braked or unbraked, and get yearly hearing tests to make sure I do no damage. Good shooting.

...............HUH??????? HOWS AT?

phurley5, I'm going on 69 yrs old, and I lost most of my hearing at age 17 while sitting in the anti aircraft turret of an m-16 half track with four 50 cal long barreled machineguns with 500 round ammo cans on each, fireing for hours at a time, and the army never heard of hearing protection. Top that off with puting in 31 years working under jet airplanes, and shooting for sport for 64 years, and I hear absolutely nothing above a growl. Of course that is sometimes usefull!

bwana dogo,

I was in your same place a couple of months ago, waiting for my .416 rem to be built and wondering if I could handle the recoil. When the rifle finally arrived I took it out and fired 8 rounds offhand to see how the rifle fed and to check out recoil. I was surprised at how much more the .416 kicked when compared to my .300 RUM, which I shoot well. The 3rd and 4th shot from each group really hurt. I needed to do something about the recoil because I was afraid that I would develope a flinch. I talked with my gunsmith about a break, but before going that route bought a Past Mag Plus recoil shield (the kind that straps to your shoulder) to see if that would help. The difference was night and day. On my next trip to shoot, the .416 was downright pleasant. Pleasant enough for me to shoot 25 rounds with no ill effects. So for me the answer is no break.

Doug