I was thinking since the dollar has lost value to the Rand has this affected tipping at all?

Also in reading older posts here and elsewhere is there some rule of thumb that most people would agree on for tipping?

A few of ranges that I have seen listed are:


Tips for PH

Professional Hunter = $50 - $200 per day (or you may want to consider 5- 8% of your total safari bill

Or

5% for an average tip
6% for a better than average tip
7% for a very good tip
8% plus for a very generous tip

Tracker: from $5 to $10 per person/day to $100 - $200 for safari
Driver: from $5 to $10 per day to $100 - $200 for safari
Skinner: from $5 to $10 per person/day $100 - $200 for safari
Lodge/camp staff: $3 to $5 per person/day
Cook = $50 - $200 for safari
Maid = $20 -$40 for safari

I appreciate any opnions and advice.

Jim

quote:

Originally posted by Singleshot03:

Tracker: from $5 to $10 per person/day to $100 - $200 for safari
Driver: from $5 to $10 per day to $100 - $200 for safari
Skinner: from $5 to $10 per person/day $100 - $200 for safari
Lodge/camp staff: $3 to $5 per person/day
Cook = $50 - $200 for safari
Maid = $20 -$40 for safari

I believe these numbers are really quite high. Tipping the cook or driver $200? Maybe for a 2 month safari.

On a buffalo & plains game hunt, our ph asked for $100.00 per day for himself and $35.00 per day for the trackers. I don't remember what the tips for the rest of the camp staff were. I was somewhat suprised by this amount, but I did pay it just to be rid of the sob. There was a bit of a problem, how could I pay him what he actually deserved, pay the staff what they deserved (they were great), and make sure the money was properly distributed?

Wrenchmaster: Sort of surprises me that the PH would "ask" for a certain amount for a tip...I always thought a tip was given in the amount that the hunter felt was deserved. As for the trackers and game scouts, we have always given the tip to the individual so we know they received what we had intended to give. The campstaff was a different matter, we gave the tip total along with a list of each staff member and the tip amount each should receive to the cook for dispersal. Maybe there is a better way, but that has worked for me.

tipping is always an uncomfortable subject -

salaries are different in africa to here stateside and everyone that you come in contact with earns a liveable wage (for their situation)

i ALWAYS insist that my clients tip the staff directly to them (the staff) i recommend how much but always make it clear that the final amount is at the discretion of the client - that also goes for each guy on the truck , gives the client a chance to say thanks and shake hands and the staff know that the money is right into their hand and there can be no thought of their tips being "diluted"!

many camps have a great system where each member of staff is listed on a sheet - the clinet signs the bottom of the sheet and inserts the amount he is going to leave -

the staff gather and the client hands the whole amount and the list (thats been signed) to the most senior guy and they distribute it among themselves -

a good standard tip for a ph is one daily rate - if the guy has been willing , super helpfull and accommodating go up from there-

as far as trackers go each PH will have a different view on this - i like the rackers and skinners tipped separately from the camp staff-

tipping more for a bigger trophy sucks because it takes the same amount of effort to locate and effectively approach and kill a 40 inch buffalo as it does a 38 inch buffalo-

wrenchmaster - i have not heard of a PH telling how much he wants for himself , sounds like you didnt like him anyway - not a great recipe for return business but the approach works for him (you proved it )

as far as weather the economy has affected tipping - i dont think we have seen that -

two rules with tipping - tip the camp staff direct and the phs, skinners and everyone on the truck separately

hand each person his tip - if the ph is going to change the money for them etc etc thats between the PH and his staff and nothing to do with you -

A guy spends weeks sometimes months in the bush away from his family and friends. To make your Hunt something special. He puts up with some of the most self centered rude demanding people on the planet( not all but some) he in most case's is a total gentlemen and entertainer with hardly a min to his self living with total strangers for weeks at a time. How much would that be worth to you if your where the Ph not the client. As for me I can only say I will never have enough money to tip a Ph what he is worth. The ones I know are very special people even the one I have not hunted with yet.

quote:

A guy spends weeks sometimes months in the bush away from his family and friends. To make your Hunt something special. He puts up with some of the most self centered rude demanding people on the planet( not all but some) he in most case's is a total gentlemen and entertainer with hardly a min to his self living with total strangers for weeks at a time. How much would that be worth to you if your where the Ph not the client. As for me I can only say I will never have enough money to tip a Ph what he is worth. The ones I know are very special people even the one I have not hunted with yet.

right on - but this is not the same guy demanding a certain tip whose client pays him just to get him off his back - the guy you describe has the manners and decorum to accept graciously $200 as if it were $2000 !

Ivan,
You are correct I was describing a professional, ethical, committed, Ph. The ones who work for the client and are a pleasure to be around whether in the bush or in a pub

quote:

Originally posted by ddrhook:
A guy spends weeks sometimes months in the bush away from his family and friends. To make your Hunt something special. He puts up with some of the most self centered rude demanding people on the planet( not all but some) he in most case's is a total gentlemen and entertainer with hardly a min to his self living with total strangers for weeks at a time. How much would that be worth to you if your where the Ph not the client. As for me I can only say I will never have enough money to tip a Ph what he is worth. The ones I know are very special people even the one I have not hunted with yet.

I don't agree completely with your rationale for calculating end-of-hunt tips. I feel no obligation to compensate the PH and staff for the boorish behavior of previous clients. The gratuities I provide the staff and PH are directly related to the quality of service they individually provide me and my hunting party.

With all due respect to Ivan's suggestion of paying a single day's daily rate as the PH's gratuity, I would prefer to calculate the amount based on the number of safari days. I've been fortunate to have had some great PHs, and my tips to them have averaged 10% of the gross daily rate. A single day's daily rate would probably be exorbitant for a five-day hunt, whereas it would be insufficient on a 15- or 21-day safari (assuming good service, hunting effort, etc.).

Tips for the staff, too, are adjusted for the length of the hunt - typically a particular amount per hunting day as suggested by the PH. As Ivan recommends, we always provide staff tips directly to the individual, and try to remember to bring plenty of small envelopes to enclose the cash so that you don't find yourself handing them a wad of bills for all to see (and compare). With envelopes we can also write their names on the front and enclose a brief note of thanks inside. My wife also brings small gifts for the camp staff and their families, ranging from clothing and school supplies to inexpensive jewelry for the male staff to surprise their sweeties.

Kim,
I was not implying compensation on the actions of other clients. I was just stating that a lot of clients have know idea what a good ethical Ph has to do to earn his money.
In my opinion it takes a very special type of person to be a Ph was what I was trying to say.

quote:

With all due respect to Ivan's suggestion of paying a single day's daily rate as the PH's gratuity, I would prefer to calculate the amount based on the number of safari days. I've been fortunate to have had some great PHs, and my tips to them have averaged 10% of the gross daily rate. A single day's daily rate would probably be exorbitant for a five-day hunt, whereas it would be insufficient on a 15- or 21-day safari (assuming good service, hunting effort, etc.).

good point kim -


this is a highly variable and interesting subject with no wrong answers -

we all have funny stories - i hunted with an old german guy , in 5 hunting days we killed two very old buffalo , a huge leopard , a tuskless and a kudu (it was in chete)- he gave my tracker a penknife and i got a box of cheroots (no i dont smoke!)

a good friend of mine had a similar experience and was given a watch - after a 21 day full bag fully successful safari - it sat in his nightstand drawer for about 2 years the his broke and so he wanted to use it - he took it to get the battery replaced and found out it was a 10 000 watch !!!!!

long and the short of it is that a highly ethical and high integrity ph will appreciate whatever you give him , you probably wont give him the most he has ever had nor the least but the words you use and the heartfelt thanks will do the trick -

Could someone tell me what is reasonable or a good rule of thumb for drivers, skinners and camp staff in RSA?

some of the guys from the RSA jump in and help the new comer

It's a bit like asking how long is a piece of string. There are so many variables, no one can give much of an informed answer.

The quality of the area and camp and the experience and reputation of the PH and of course, your own situation all have a bearing on it.

My abvice would not to sweat it until you know where, when, what and with whom you'll be hunting.

Here is a suggested daily tipping list from a well known Zimbabwe operator.

TRACKERS

1st tracker $10
2nd tracker $10
3rd tracker $5

KITCHEN STAFF

Cooks $5
Helpers $3

SKINNERS

$3 EA.

Mechanic $2
Helper $1
Gardener $1

To me the above is more than reasonable and I would probably give a litte more. For the PH I think about $50 per day for plains game and $100 per day for DG if you are very please and everything is about right.

Mark

I think for never-been-hunting-in-Africa-but-want-to-some-day this is a worry of us plebes. It may stain a trip if you hunted hard, collected good animals and at the end, when you left what you regarded as a reasonable tip, you find out that you essentially tipped them in a manner not commensurate with their performance thereby leveling a mild insult, albeit unintentional.

This question is most logically pondered in conversations such as these since (as inferred above) it would not necessarily be kosher to ask a PH what he expects to be tipped. Sure, you could ask him about his staff, but I think even the newest African hunter does not want to embarrass himself in any way. Going half-way across the world to hunt and shoot well is stressful enough, but, at the end of the hunt to have your PH think you are a cheapskate is another thing, especially when you think you may want to book with him the next year.

+1 for BaxterB plus it would be nice to know for a budget. Not that one will end up sticking to it but nice to plan.

I feel good about what said about PH tip but not sure still about rule of thumb for RSA skinners, driver, trackers....

I appreciate Mark's comments on tipping in Zimbabwe. In't there a bid difference in cost of living between RSA and Zimbabwe?

Jim

Single,

I think you'll find that the safari crews in RSA makes more than in Zim and their work day is easier. I've never felt I needed to tip more in RSA even with top end operators.

Mark

Ivan, I thank you for your take on this most of all. For the simple reason I am from Australia and the tipping thing is not apart of our life style. Not being a very wealth person and generaly have to save long and hard to enjoy a hunt overseas its increadibly diffuclt to go somewhere and have another hunter in camp hand over a large amount of money when I really see that the guys have only done what they have been paid for in the first place and then to look at me for the same reward?I am in no way against tipping for the guys when they have gone out of the way to get me my trophies but I have see a fellow hunter hand over 10K and think this sort of thing is just out of control and then it becomes unrealistic and becomes an expectation for nothing

The question that comes in to my mind the two times that I've been to South Africa has been to use US dollars or have some rand to tip the camp staff? I've heard different answers and I still don't know what is more appropriate

Some international hunters, especially those from some European countries, do not tip much, if at all. One fellow left his .375 H&H brass and "seven" unfired rounds. He was rather rotund and fitness was a word denied. At the airport when he left for his far northen climes,whale oil,dried fish and the like, he battled with his suitcase, sweat pouring off his whale like body. He pulled out a lot of sheets at the check in counter. It must have been for excess baggage as when I got back to the lodge, I found that a number of premium reds were gone.
A poor memory amongst many good ones.

John,
Rand would be my suggestion small denomination usa notes are sometimes hard to change

Tipping is sure a lot nicer for us Canadians now that the Loonie has the Greenback by the face!

That said, I think the best (meaning most appreciated) tip we gave was the handmade (by my father) knife we gave to the appy at our camp at Kachoe. Great young guy, Shayne, who stood on his head for us the whole time we were there, even taking my mother on his trips for supplies and to Mana Pools when she discovered that buffalo tracking was a little beyond her abilities. I don't think that I ever saw someone so happy to get a gift in my life.

When I was in RSA in 2008, I tipped my PH £20 / day as we got all my animals and I had a fantastic time. I also bought him a couple of bottles of brandy during my stay as he liked the odd drink and we had some fantastic evenings. The trackers/skinners - they were one in the same person at this place got £10 each as did the cleaners and cooks. I also got a severe chastising by the owner as I tipped the trackers 50 rand each after they dragged my Kudu on a sled out of some thick bushes and up a very steep embankment to the car. The owner was very upset as it meant that because I gave them an early tip they had gone into town and got drunk and were nowhere to be found the next day. I tipped the PH directly and had to give money for everyone else to the owner - as he divides their tips every 6 months otherwise he told us they'd be drunk when the next hunters arrive. I still to this day think the owner used the tip money for the rest of the staff to pay them instead of paying them himself as he was very insistant how much we had to give to each person.

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:
Here is a suggested daily tipping list from a well known Zimbabwe operator.

TRACKERS

1st tracker $10
2nd tracker $10
3rd tracker $5

KITCHEN STAFF

Cooks $5
Helpers $3

SKINNERS

$3 EA.

Mechanic $2
Helper $1
Gardener $1

To me the above is more than reasonable and I would probably give a litte more. For the PH I think about $50 per day for plains game and $100 per day for DG if you are very please and everything is about right.

Mark

Mark, this is ok, and probably about right...until you find out that there were 3 cooks and each had 4 helpers. Oh, and the Night Guard, and his assistants (2), and the anti-poaching units (15), and the guy that goes to market, ad nauseum. Sure all these people help make your experience better, but at some point you begin to think you're just getting taken for a ride.

I really wish gratuities (at LEAST for the people doing the work that is part and parcel to the camp operations) would just be rolled into the daily rates. The entire deal, with SO many people involved and so many opportunities to feel slighted or taken advantage of, has put a bad ending on EVERY hunt I've been on in Africa.

quote:

I really wish gratuities (at LEAST for the people doing the work that is part and parcel to the camp operations) would just be rolled into the daily rates. The entire deal, with SO many people involved and so many opportunities to feel slighted or taken advantage of, has put a bad ending on EVERY hunt I've been on in Africa.

AMEN!!! Bro.

quote:

Originally posted by TrademarkTexan:...with SO many people involved and so many opportunities to feel slighted or taken advantage of, has put a bad ending on EVERY hunt I've been on in Africa.

This is a good point, as with 20-25 people in camp, the odds are real flipping good that somebody is going to feel jipped. Might have nothing to do with your tip, but the pecking order and "camp politics". The ones that feel slighted will let you know with a glare! I try to tip the camp staff and associated graciously, but working it all out at the end of a safari is a hassle, and often I leave with mental baggage about who didn't get enough and so forth. Last trip I brought a packet of $5’s and $10's and $20's but I still had a hard time coming up with the recommended amount for each staff member on the presented list.

Note that tipping is often very formal and the process taken quite seriously. When in Cameroon, the PH would setup a desk outside and each worker would wait in line (in order of "rank") to get paid, and express any grievances. This was the same procedure for tipping, noting that although I was tipping as usual, everybody was unusually giddy, after which I was told that typically the European clients were a bit more frugal and that "they like American hunters and want to know when you are coming back".

Reg the trackers, I consider them to be an integral part of the hunt, especially when on elephant or other tracked game. I enjoy their company and watching them work, and tip them accordingly…while not setting the bar too high for the guy coming in behind me. $200-$300 per tracker (more for lead guy) for an ele hunt has been my experience.

I have had PH’s say that while tipping the workers directly eliminates much of the suspicion, it can be problematic if tips are too high as their expectations are immediately increased. And in some countries where they have to exchange the USD’s for local currently, they tend to get taken to the cleaners (especially after a few hits of the local mash!). One PH told me of a wealthy European who tipped the tracker very generously…the tracker was lost for a week, eventually found in a Namibian prison after having gotten pissed and stabbing a man. We want to believe that all our money goes to their family(s) and children…but this is most certainly not always the case! They choose to spend their money where they want, just like we do.

One note concerning the PH’s…if your PH’s name is on the sign out front, it does not mean that you don’t tip him. Chances are very good that he counts on tips just as he did when he was working for the man!

On one trip I asked the PH to write down the names of the staff so that my wife and I could figure out the tips. He came back with a short stack of plain white envelopes with the staff members names written on the envelopes along with their job. We divvied out the tip money and put it in the envelopes. The staff were then assembled and given their envelope. Made a lot of sense. Very orderly.

quote:

I have had PH’s say that while tipping the workers directly eliminates much of the suspicion, it can be problematic if tips are too high as their expectations are immediately increased.

You are absolutely correct. These guys are labor for the companies. Too high is as problematic as too low.

We don't live there so how are we to know. Again...a good case for making it a part of the daily rate.

One more thought.

I am in the service industry just like a PH. I earn my living with my hands and my brain.

I have corrected problems on horses that have gone on to win 100's of thousands of dollars. Most do pay their bills (and I do say "most")...BUT...even if a horse went on to retire to stud and earn the ranch or trainer a good living for years to come thanks to me...I have yet to have one mail me a check and say heres a tip for your good work. I just get the price I quote to do the work and it is all I expect.