I have travelled extensively with firearms. The hoops we have to jump through at present are manageable but that state of affairs may deteriorate.

A few of us here in Zimbabwe are thinking about being able to offer custom reloaded ammunition - or tje facility for one to reload for themselves - to a customer's specification, range facilities to try it out on, and perhaps in time even a limited selection of high-quality firearms so that all a hunter has to do is get off the plane.

So this is just a bit of preliminary market research. Do you think this is worth pursuing? You can reply here and also to barry.groulx@yahoo.com.

Great idea!

A thoroughly sorted out CZ 550 Magnum or Winchester Model 70 in .375 H&H, and cartridges loaded with Barnes TSX 300 grain bullets to standard velocities would meet the needs of 90% of hunters in Africa, whether they know it or not.

The factory Norma ammunition in .375 H&H with the 270 grain Barnes TSX has worked on buffalo just fine for a friend of mine, who takes a buffalo or two every year in the Selous. I only mention this because she has taken many more buffalo than I have, most them with a pretty ugly Remington model 700 push feed at that. It may be that this factory ammo would be cheaper for you than putting together all the components required to make it on the spot.

If a PH told me he had a quality scoped .375 H&H rifle perfectly regulated for a Barnes TSX bullet load in camp, I would probably say the heck with traveling with one of my rifles. Everybody has their favorite bullet, but I will bet that you will get the best consensus, if only one bullet could be chosen, with the Barnes TSX. You're not going to be able to offer every bullet out there, in any event.

There is another aspect, which is that the hunter's ammo doesn't always arrive, even when the rifle does. A real pain when your rifle is in an uncommon caliber, like 404 Jeffery, which is the latest darling, or even 416 Rigby which isn't always on local shelves. So yes, having some bullets which work on all the 416s, and a bunch of different cases (416 Rem, 416 Rigby, 416 Ruger and I don't know what else) could save a hunt for some. Since you won't be able to have everything, I would propose cases and bullets for the .375s, the 416s and 404s and .458s. Beyond that you're going to have a whole lot invested in inventory that may never get off the shelves. If the hunters know what you've got, they can make their rifle choices before they go.

But I don't think I would want to spend any time on a hunting vacation at the reloading bench and range. Africa is expensive to get to and hunting days are expensive too. But if a proper rifle with proper ammunition were waiting there for me, that would be attractive.

A big part of hunting for me is using my OWN gun and handloads. If things were too problematic to do that, I'd just stay in the U.S.A.

quote:

Originally posted by Grumulkin:
A big part of hunting for me is using my OWN gun and handloads. If things were too problematic to do that, I'd just stay in the U.S.A.

+1

Barry
the facilities at the cleveland gun club are top class with most of the guys reloading to bench rest standards
I get one of the elders to do my reloading for hunting and the attention to detail is second to non
All the best and hope it works out

I have hunted Zim once and not sure if I wlll make it back, but I think you have a good idea. I bought a 375 HH just for that trip and have since sold it. Had your service been available, I would have likely saved some money and you would have made some.
Good luck.

I think it is great idea. Taking my own rifles is comforting, but it is becoming a huge hassle. It would be nice if several countries in Africa had a business that offered the same service. It would be fun to simply get off of the plane, go to a shop and choose a rifle, make a substantial deposit, go hunting, return the rifle and settle up.

Having access to ammunition is surely helping and appreciated. However, without my own guns I doubt I would regularly go to Africa.

Barry,

I think you have a good idea but I also think as others have suggested that offering components for loading would get you far out in the weeds. I think the idea of having guns for rent that are already tweaked (trigger jobs, bedding etc) with good optics and an already developed load with a expanding and solid premium bullet would be an excellent idea. Camp guns are a crap shoot. Camp guns can look like rodents have been chewing on them with the scope stuck on one power setting and a yellow tint to the site picture. Camp guns are too often left in the corner and forgotten until someone wants to use them. If were going to offer this service I'd buy 375 H&H's and perhaps some 416 Rem chambered Mod 70's plus a couple of 30-06's loaded as suggested. I think people would be happy to have that option rather than dragging their own guns to Zim. Personally I think the hassle involved with bringing your own guns is worth it but it unquestionably can make your trip more complicated and can cause some real headaches.

Mark

Agree with Mark.

The idea sounds good on paper.

But the real challenge will be getting critical mass to make it viable in ONE SINGLE location.

How much do you want to earn from the venture and how many round of ammo and range fees do you need to sell to make that up?

Let us assume that the goal is to make $50k a year.

So you may charge $5 per round of ammo - say 50 rounds maximum per person.

So one person will spend $250. (you could double that for arguments sake)

You will need 200 hunter a year to spend that. That is just to cover costs.

You would need at least 500 hunters a year to make a reasonable profit. Then you have the 3 main locations - Bulawayo, Harare & Vic Falls.

Even if your tweak the costs and numbers above, I see the critical mass in one location as the big challenge.

Wish you all the best.

Actually, a lot of PHs provide both firearms and factory loaded ammunition. It is increasingly becoming a very good idea unfortunately...


The rub may be supplying non-factory loaded ammo.

If you are not a rifle nut, any decent factory gun, decent scope and factory ammo will make you happy.

The further up the road for rifle snob you are, the less accepting you will be.

Having facilities for a client to reload might be something some would pay for to use his own, but on a 21 day hunt, even the $50/day level gets in to the whole purchase area.

I think there is a very limited market for this. Having US factory premium ammo, you might be able to sell, but at the premium charged over there, probably a small market.

It would be good community relations but I doubt it will be a consistent money maker.

A source of factory ammo would be nice if ammo is lost or used up. However, I question reloads of others in my doubles--both as to accuracy and safety.
Cal

Any reputable outfitter SHOULD have decent quality camp rifles and factory ammo. What happens when the airlines lose your stuff for weeks? Cancel your hunt and go home? So, why would such a service be economically viable. If your outfitter has junk in his gun safe, you are hunting with the wrong outfitter...I quit taking firearms to Africa 6-7 DG Safaris ago. 2 elephants, 3 buffalo, 2 hippos, 2 crocs and a leopard never had a clue they were killed with camp guns. Rifle snobs won't use your service and the rest will mostly use camp guns/ammo.

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:
A source of factory ammo would be nice if ammo is lost or used up. However, I question reloads of others in my doubles--both as to accuracy and safety.
Cal

+1....................
Loads for one double rifle of the same chamberings rarely will regulate properly in another double.

Thank I will simply have to take on the setbacks brought on by the feds, and load my own, and shoot it in my own rifles!

...................................................................

Another idea for your consideration. As someone who hunts with bolt actions, because it is what I have. A chance to rent a regulated double with quality ammunition might be interesting. As the double guys say, the ammo must be regulated to the gun. This might make your business idea more attractive?

Awesome idea
I already came to conclusion, I hunt, guns are just another part of the whole trip and they don't have to be mine

A big thank you to everyone who passed along their thoughts; please watch this space!