I am looking for some advice. First some background. I put a substantial deposit down on a buff hunt in July after a long talk with the outfitter at a hunting show. He cashed my check and I followed up with copies of my passport and Form 4457 for rifles after a month or so (took a bit to get Forms signed by Customs) which he told me to so he could start gun permit application. Since then he has only responded to one email confirming my hunting dates but nothing else. I had discussed bring my wife and doing a few days on a game tour on the front end which the outfitter mentioned he would handle as well but he hasnt answered those emails either.

I don't have anything in writing at this point and only the email confirming the hunt. Found a thread on another hunting forum where someone else didnt hear from this same outfitter for a couple months too but sounded like it worked out in the end. My patience has run out waiting to hear from him. What should I do at this at this point?

Couple of questions. When you booked, did you sign a contract? It's normal to do so, especially with a first hunt with an outfitter. Sometimes I don't with folks I've hunted with a number of times.

Second question is what is your timing and where is your hunt? Depending on where this is, he could be in the field, either working on camps or actually hunting.

Don't know your outfitter and understand you being a bit nervous on a first hunt with them. One of the reasons I like hunting with the same folks and when I don't hear from them I just assume they are busy and will get to me in good time.

About all you can do is send them another email and ask for a response. IMO. Hope it works out.

Timeline?


He could be in the field.

Haven't heard from him since Mar 31 after I sent passport and 4457 info and asked to confirm hunt dates. He mentioned he was still visiting cliets at that time. Sent 4 emails in meantime and no replies

This is prime hunting season just getting started.

Have a bit more patience. Hmm, just saw it's been six weeks already. Time to do some checking.

George

quote:

Hmm, just saw it's been six weeks already. Time to do some checking.

Precisely.

We are living in a modern and technologically advanced era in which hampered communication is a thing of the past.

Mobile phones with Messenger, Whats App, etc. have become a popular method of keeping in touch, socially and also for business.

Zambia?

Hello,
sorry to hear about your problems. Quite a few outfitters have issues getting communication and hunting/outfitting work together well. No excuse, just stating the reality. That's why some are happy to use agents.

Have you tried finding out his phone numner (website, forums etc) and just giving him a call or send him a whatsapp?
Maybe he is just not an "email guy", but then you should be able to get a hold him otherwise.

Best Regards,
Dennis

There is no way anyone would stay out of touch for months, even in the African bush.

Unless there is something drastic has happened.

This is ridiculous.

I absolutely hate hearing excuses like: "The Outfitter is very busy", "He is out hunting" etc. These type of stupid excuses only work for a day or 2, at most, in my opinion a week. If there are in this type of business and have not interest in communicating, they can hire an office manager.

I would personally never hire an outfitter with this type of reputation. There are too many good ones who are happy to get back to you promptly.

Reread Fulvio's post!

What country? Outfitter name?

Lack of communication does not always mean bad faith.

Sometimes it is caused by a more relaxed sense of emergency, or long stays in the bush, and no one to back you up.

Email is not always reliable. Spam filters, etc., can thwart things.

I would call him.

WhatsApp. Simple as that.

quote:

What country? Outfitter name?

Yep. Tell us who it is and where.

No, do NOT publish who this clot is until you have contacted him one way or another.

Afterwards, feel free!

quote:

Originally posted by DLS:
WhatsApp. Simple as that.

You should have the PH's Phone number.

Send him a WhatsApp text. In it state that you sent a few e mails asking for some information.

The others ones that they will use is telegram and signal, however they steer you over to WhatsApp.

I know that the few Ph's I chat with they like to use WhatsApp... e mails they seldom look at.

I thought that most outfitters working in remote areas had an office or at least a secretary manning the phones/emails back in civilization…..

quote:

Originally posted by Ongwe:
No, do NOT publish who this clot is until you have contacted him one way or another.

Afterwards, feel free!

THIS,


And Give him the benefit of the doubt for now, if you did it now it would make things awkward later I would think. Yes it is frustrating and creates worry. But unless something has happened beyond his control he did cash your check and not communicating is not very professional in my opinion.

JP



Formerly JPaul

quote:

I know that the few Ph's I chat with they like to use WhatsApp... e mails they seldom look at.

Whoever uses Whats App also has access to email and the subject of the message can be glanced at without inconvenience.

The time lapse in question is inexcusable and does indeed raise doubts and/or red flags.

Salvation in this instance could come in the form of sickness or the possible loss/theft of the phone which however can be easily replaced
unless the operator is living in Russia or the Ukraine.

I can finally say this since Im retired, but thats the best reason to go thru a booking agent, it does not cost you a dime, the outfitter pays him a percentage of the total hunt. He has done all the backgound, probably hunted with the PH and knows him well, and all you have to do is go hunt..

I have seen these horror stories for years as have most safari companies and booking agents..A booking agent lives in the US and has a liability and if that doesn't work you can wring his neck and pay a fine!!

WhatsAp is an App that allows for international video phonecalls, free! So anywhere you can get a cell signal you should be able to receive a WhatsAp call.
Peter.

I agree 100% with using WhatsApp. I correspond regularly with my Namibian PH of Sebra Hunting Safaris. He updates me on current hunting conditions and even tells me when he has active Leopard baits being hit. I land in WDH two months from today and have full confidence that I’ll have another great hunt- my sixth with Sebra.

Six weeks is a long time especially if your hunt is in July. Have you started on gun permits. He could be dead or really sick in the hospital. At least tell us what country. If he has been in business for more than five years someone on this site knows the guy. You can PM me his name and I can check on him for you.

I have no idea why some wish not to know who it is.

Posting who it is might help that someone here might know something about his current state.

If he is in a situation where he is unable to respond to communications for months, he can have a good excuse, though I doubt it.

In this current situation, communication is of the utmost importance.

This type of business practice gives everyone in the industry a bad reputation. What hunting show? You can contact the show administration. They most likely have records of his banking info where he paid for his booth.

Here are some links you can check. Contact PHASA or ZPGA depending on which country. They can at least tell you if he is a legit Outfitter.

https://phasa.co.za/

Zim
https://zpga.org/


Years ago there was a South African that gave donation hunts to SCI and DU. He set up at local chapter events and had a smoking hot blond with her boobs hanging out that passed out literature. Turns out it was a scam and he took the deposits. We made good on two of his false hunts that were auctioned at DU chapters. It cost us but luckily my business partner in RSA helped us out. Always do your homework.

Any word on the terrible predicament that our member Mr West was in. If that PH has not contacted him by now that is totally unacceptable. Hope he got it resolved.

JP


Formerly JPaul

Just a suggestion. Create a fake e-mail account in a fake name. E-mail him regarding booking a safari. If he takes the bait and responds you'll know he's purposefully ignoring you.

An even simpler and inconspicuous approach would be to ask a friend in a different city or better, in a different country, to inquire about a hunt.

On a different note, he might even be lurking on the site reading all these comments.

Does the last name begin with a K by any chance? If so he may be in jail. Don't laugh, it happened to me.

All we need is "I am trying to contact XYZ because I have booked a hunt with him and lost contact. can anyone help"

Making this a mystery is not going to help anyone, least of all the two parties involved.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
All we need is "I am trying to contact XYZ because I have booked a hunt with him and lost contact. can anyone help"

Making this a mystery is not going to help anyone, least of all the two parties involved.

That Saeed, is a excellent legitimate approach with no negativity attached. just a simple question looking for assistance.

JP


Formerly JPaul

Had a major hunt booked with a pretty high profile sheep outfitter out of Ft. Nelson BC. He went silent about 4 weeks before our arrival. When we arrived nothing was ready for our hunt, the guides were new and had never hunted the area. Turned out to be one of the most disorganized and disappointing major hunts we have ever experienced. Found out to late the outfitter had a major alcohol problem and been put in jail and who knows where else prior to our arrival. The other disappointing part is the high profile booking agent we used to book the trip was well aware of his problems. Upon confronting the outfitter he became violent. Ever put in that situation again we would be calling daily to find out what the hell is going on.
4WD

The OP posted asking for advice, posted same day a bit more info and now 6 days later no response to several posters all looking to provide some insight and help. Communication is a two way thing, jeez!!!!

Had a fishing charter captain not show up to his boat the morning we were supposed to go out. Eventually, I called the police asking if they had him in jail. They laughed, “No, not this time we don’t. Might call the hospitals.”

Never found him.

Almost 2 months have elapsed since the thread was started and nothing more heard from the original poster on the final outcome of a hunt that is either imminent or should have been concluded in July.

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:
Almost 2 months have elapsed since the thread was started and nothing more heard from the original poster on the final outcome of a hunt that is either imminent or should have been concluded in July.

With the Internet, one can never be sure.

We have a client who is unkown, complaining about an outfit that he is keeping secret.

And no follow up.

Why ask for help when you are unwilling to provide all the relevant details?

maybe the outfitter / ph read the thread contacted the op and got a great hunt lol who knows: you helped him without knowing ...

quote:

Originally posted by medved:
maybe the outfitter / ph read the thread contacted the op and got a great hunt lol who knows: you helped him without knowing ...

It would have been correct therefore for the OP to put the matter to rest by announcing that everything turned out for the better.

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:

quote:

Originally posted by medved:
maybe the outfitter / ph read the thread contacted the op and got a great hunt lol who knows: you helped him without knowing ...

It would have been correct therefore for the OP to put the matter to rest by announcing
that everything turned out for the better.

Kind of rude after asking for help

quote:

Originally posted by samir:

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:

quote:

Originally posted by medved:
maybe the outfitter / ph read the thread contacted the op and got a great hunt lol who knows: you helped him without knowing ...

It would have been correct therefore for the OP to put the matter to rest by announcing
that everything turned out for the better.

Kind of rude after asking for help

May be he got the same ailmet as the one he is supposed to be hunting with!