i wanted to ask if there was anyone who would be willing to bring a weapon out to Zim on a hunt in the next year and leave it as a "tip" The weapon in question would be a 458. Before anyone says it cant be done, it can as i have had a friend do it twice now with no problems. I would obvioulsy pay in full for the weapon via a friend in the US who would liase with you and let you know how it is all done. If you thinking of coming on Safari to Zim and want a brand new large calibre rifle to hunt with that you will not have the hastle of taking home then PM me.

Would be so kind as to enlighten us on how it is done?

While I'll be in Zimbabwe in 60 days, what I'd do (and what I've done) concerning the export of firearms to Africa certainly will not be discussed on a public forum.... even though I had the correct export documents last time (or at least, think I did. )

The lion walk at Vic Falls is quite fun. I've done it. However, a woman got eaten a bit this month. Paying your nickel and taking your chances is fun and can have it's rewards, but I might rather have a lion bite me than sleep in Chikurubi .

Mugagbe's Hotels

no one in Zim including the police has any problem with licensing weapons from the US, infact they are very happy to do it as it is there little way of saying two fingers up too the world so no worries with me spending time in Chikurubi and yes a lady was munched on a bit by a lion on a walk in vic falls... if only the people who own lion encounter would just be honest about where those lions go when they are too big to walk with...canned lion anyone??

It can be done. Just take one rifle over in an inexpensive case and leave the rifle and case there. Nobody will know when you leave on the plane that you arrived with a rifle.

Its no problem as I've done it both ways. However the problem might be on the USA side..

From what I've been able to figure out, the problem is not on the Zim side, but is on the US side. Basically, you have to get an export permit from ATF to do this. It can be done, but it's a hassle.

Sure a US citizen could easily just leave the gun in Zim, but they would be in violation of US laws and could get in trouble with US authorities. I'm sure the chances of being caught are low, but personally I wouldn't take the risk.

Unless you have an export license it cannot be done legally but once. Unless the law has been changed in recent years. You can get a single exception to export a firearm. It is quite a hassle and requires forms from the state department and defense department. I did this in Dec of 1999 for shipment of rifles to two PH friends in Zimbabwe.I took numerous forms and letters to both the State Department and the Department of Defense. I also had to get a letter from the Ambassador from Zimbabwe which was graciously provided after a phone call to him personally in D.C. This is a one time exception license and that means lifetime. Have no idea if it is still possible but it was in 1999 and was the ONLY legal way for a private citizen to export a firearm. Believe me I exhausted all avenues at the time and made quite a few phone calls to the DoD and State Dept. After all that one PH got his rifle but by the time all the paper work was completed and the second shipped Zimbabwe had put a moratorium on new licenses there and the customs dept of Zimbabwe sold the rifle at auction . Nice custom 458 Lott too. Incidentally ATF was not involved at all.

quote:

Originally posted by BigBoreCore:
It can be done. Just take one rifle over in an inexpensive case and leave the rifle and case there. Nobody will know when you leave on the plane that you arrived with a rifle.

I would be careful with that statement. They log in your name and firearms in Zim and are suppose to check them on exit. They were confused in Bulawayo last week when I left because I flew in to Vic Falls. I even had to sign a register upon exit.

So Mike, what's the word on your hunt? (Sorry for the hijack.)

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
So Mike, what's the word on your hunt? (Sorry for the hijack.)

I will hold the thread hostage for a moment.

A complete report will be written soon. I need the "new" to wear off Russell's report since he writes so well. I do not want my feeble attempt to hold the reader spellbound to seem too lackluster.

Great buff and this is the very short version of my wife explaining the leopard hunt:

We had a couple of leopards feeding and built a blind in the morning. After lunch and a nap we had to sit in the blind for over two hours before....

I was told by my PH in Zim that I certainly could leave a rifle as a tip, but to give them advance notice and they would have the appropriate documentation waiting. The problem is not in the US, they don't know what you took to Africa, the problem is exiting Zim with documents saying you entered with x amount of firearms, complete with serial numbers. There is supposed to be paperwork that will clear that hurdle. I would never just leave a rifle. It needs to be coordinated by your man in Zim.
That is my understanding, but have never done it.

What the heck happens if you are in a boat in AFRICA in
Hippo/Croc waters and the darn rifle slips from your hands
falls in the drink!?!?!?

quote:

A complete report will be written soon. I need the "new" to wear off Russell's report since he writes so well. I do not want my feeble attempt to hold the reader spellbound to seem too lackluster.

Hah! I guess I am going to have to buy you dinner in Dallas next year for that bit of advertising! Remember, if you and Buffee hang with me instead of going it alone your car won't get towed!

BTW, I've seen Mike's pix... lovely old buff and a dandy representative of ol' spots!

It's like anything else in the US. If you don't get caught is it legal. I was speaking for doing something completely legal. What is being discussed here is doing something completely illegal under US law.It's like shooting game out of season,if you don't get caught so what.

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
I was told by my PH in Zim that I certainly could leave a rifle as a tip, but to give them advance notice and they would have the appropriate documentation waiting. The problem is not in the US, they don't know what you took to Africa, the problem is exiting Zim with documents saying you entered with x amount of firearms, complete with serial numbers. There is supposed to be paperwork that will clear that hurdle. I would never just leave a rifle. It needs to be coordinated by your man in Zim.
That is my understanding, but have never done it.

This is exactly correct and all paperwork will be organised on the Zim side by me.

quote:

What is being discussed here is doing something completely illegal under US law

Precisely!

Why the U.S. government should even care if a .458 got to someone who needs it for his job, I have no clue, but I found this (which may apply):

Zim Export Ban

Zimbabwe Exemption for Firearms Returning to U.S.

Disclaimers:
a. I doubt that anyone would ever know what left the U.S. or even give a flip.
b. I would expect that not a thing would occur to someone who took a rifle to Zimbabwe and left it, following all Zim regulations.
c. I have no idea as to whether or not the regulations still apply.
d. I hope the rifle finds it way to Zimbabwe.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

What is being discussed here is doing something completely illegal under US law

Precisely!

Ok well thanks for all the input on this. I am not trying to get someone looked up on my behalf. I was not aware that it was such a big deal. I understand that the law has to apply for all weapons, even a single shot rifle that is needed for someone to do there job. I could understand if i was asking someone to bring over a container of AR15's!!!!!!!!!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
...The problem is not in the US, they don't know what you took to Africa........

IIRC, all US citizens departing the US are required to declare the firearms and ammunition they are taking (exporting) on a custom's form (Form 4457???) and the same form should be presented, on your return to the US, if asked by a customs officer. You don't want to have to explain why you left with 3 guns and only brought 2 back!

The Form 4457 is only a proof of ownership document not a license or export permit. It is used when returning to the US to avoid import duty when reentering. it is common to have more than one firearm listed on a form that is not present on any particular trip since the form is reusable and there are few problems.

ODAY450 is correct. US citizens do not present the 4457 to anybody upon departure, nor do we declare amounts of ammuntion, only that we have ammuntion in the appropriate case in our luggage. No hassle. The airlines check to see if the firearms are unloaded and you sign the receipt that says they are unloaded. You can actually leave the US without a form 4457. I have done so to Canada. Upon re-entry the customs guys give you a ration of shit, but so what. You present your 4457 upon re-entry to the US simply to prove ownership and avoid duty or import violations. I never have more than one gun on a 4457, so I have one (laminated)for each in the firearm case and a color copy stuck back in luggage just in case. BTW, the primary reason I carry a 4457 is to satisfy RSA and Zim permiting regs.