My son and I leave Sunday for Africa. We are taking two guns and they are on my form 4457. I understand that I am limited to around 11 lbs of ammo. I have two questions
Can he take ammo in his check luggage even though he is officially not taking a weapon?

The second question is how close are they monitering the 11 lb? I was thinking about throwing in a couple of boxes of shotgun shells for maybe a little bird hunting. As well as some extra 375's.

I would not put any ammo in his checked baggage as he is not traveling with a rifle, according to your Form 4457. If they checked his bags and asked about the ammo and why no Form 4457 showing a rifle traveling with him, it might get sticky for you. I would also be careful about going over on the 11 lb limit, as a couple of boxes of shotgun shells and some extra .375 ammo would be distinctly obvious in extra weight, assuming that you are taking close to 11 lbs of ammo for the two rifles.

You are going out of an airport that I have never flown out of with guns and ammo. You are very likely going to be checked for the ammo weight. The truth is you can both take 5 Kilos, the problem will come when you register your guns in what ever country you are going to. If you do not have a shot gun with you they are likely to take your shells. If you are going to Namibia shotshells are not expensive in Windhoek. Five kilos is more than enough ammo for even a cull hunt. I take between 40 and 60 rounds per rifle even for a cull hunt. I have never used more than 30.

Pack the ammo in a lockable case in your luggage. Some airlines want it in your gun case and others want it in your checked luggage. When I tell them it's in a locked case in my checked luggage they have always said "great".

I have had my ammo weighed more coming home than going........Tom

Great point about shotgun ammo and no gun that matches it. Any form that you fill out in the African countries requires you to list your specific ammo and the number of rounds, which should match your rifle and/or shotgun. Years ago I and some other hunters were told by Louis Bekker at Afton House, not to bring any ammo of any sort into Africa without having the corresponding rifle or shotgun that matched it and the information on your African gun permit. He said that PH's were asking their clients quite often to bring extra ammo over for them, when in fact it was not legal to do so. Your ammo and the proper amount should match the rifles and/or shotguns listed on your African gun permits.

I have taken guns with only my name on the 4457 several times with the intent of my sons using them. In all instances, I have placed and declared ammo in both my luggage and my sons. On my Safari in 06, I placed and declared ammo in both my luggage and my wife's with only my name on the 4457s. Absolutely no problem whatsoever.

No one who checks the 4457's (Government officials) care about the 5 kilo per bag ammo limit or where it is located. No one who cares about the ammo limit of 5 kilos per bag (airline companies) care about the 4457s.

You do want to make sure however that any ammo you bring into a country matches the guns you are carrying.

Too many problems trying to carry ammo and shotshells without the corresponding rifles or shotguns. It is a risk not worth taking. Forget it.

Also, do you plan to shoot a dozen elephants or one? 11lbs of ammo is 80 - 100 rounds for sure.

In July, I shot 27 animals (incl elephant, leopard, croc, buff, hippo) and only shot about 40 times.

Just take what you need.

Thanks guys, Forget the birds. Will go home a repack.

Hartley

About three weeks ago I flew out of Houston on Lufthansa to Frankfurt, and then on Air Namibia to the Caprivi.

Lufthansa weighed my ammo on their luggage scale. How accurate can that scale really be???? I was carrying fifty 416 Rigby rounds and sixty 338 Win Mag rounds. I was over weight by 0.1 pounds. They made me remove ONE 416 Rigby round!!!

Prior to my internal flight from Windhoek Eros to Katima (Caprivi), Air Namibia made me unlock my ammo box. Then they counted each round, and checked the caliber stamp on each round. They were very nice about everything. In fact they told me I was over weight on my checked luggage, but they didn't seem care. They didn't make me cut weight, and they didn't charge me anything.

All in all, everything with my luggage went really well. All my luggage arrived on time with nothing missing. So I guess giving up ONE 416 Rigby round was worth it.

quote:

Originally posted by h kittle:
Forget the birds.

Hartley

Not necessarily. If you've made arrangements to borrow a shotgun, I suspect you can easily buy shells before your hunt or perhpas from the outfitter. There's some good bird hunting to be had in Africa, don't limit yourself!

If you are coming to South Africa, or anywhere else for that matter, please note there are definite seasons for birds.

And in South Africa, a lot of idiots are offering bird hunting right through the year, and competely @#@#$%#^$&%$&%^$%# up the bird population

Apologies for sounding off, but I am getting a real crick in my neck from this.

Desert Ram is quite correct: There are some very good bird hunting available in South Africa, and other southern African countries.

Kwan touches upon a subject that is also very dear to me: Idiots illegally offering bird hunting in closed [breeding] seasons. Sure, they may be good, or even very good, at guiding clients on PG, or even DG, hunting, but they know zilch about how to present a decent wingshooting hunt!

h kittle and anyone else planning to hunt in South Africa,

Right now [October 2011] the "gamebird" season is CLOSED in all provinces of South Africa. However some game birds, and in particular Egyptian Goose and Rock Pigeon IS OPEN in some areas - where they are considered as a serious agricultural pest. Here numbers reduction rather than protection is required. Naturally the high bird numbers here provide some very good shooting!

I don't know with which HO, or even in which country you are hunting, but feel free to PM me if you need specific advice about what can be had anywhere in South Africa in late October 2011. If you stick to a 12 gauge shotgun there is almost no need to bring your own ammo: In South African gunshops in general we do not have a wide choice of charge weights or sizes or manufacturers, but suitable 12 Ga ammo can be found - and it is quite cheap. If you insist on bringing a 20 Ga your ammo selection will be even more limited, and very severely restricted for a 16 Ga! Your SAPS issued temporary import permit for the shotgun allows you to buy up to 200 rounds in the calibre of your gun from any gunshop!

In good hunting.


Andrew McLaren