Anyone out there shoot a 264 Win Mag? What would you think of one as the lighter rifle with a 338/375 combo for plains game in Namibia? Jeff

Jeff,

I talked to a local hunter in Namibia who shoots his plains game with a 6.5X68, and he reported good results. The usual disclaimers apply, good shot placement and good bullets.

The areas I hunted there had plenty of visibility, and some long shooting.

jim

I'm not trying to be a smart ass or cause trouble. I don't want this post to come off as condesending. I just don't think there is a good understanding of what's going on during a typical plains game safari for the majority of guys.

The old days of "gun bearers" are long gone. I don't think you will be packing two guns each day. The best you can hope for in your success is to bring a rifle that you shoot well and within the range limitations you have. This two gun "light heavy" scenario is OK if you're going to hunt for a month and shoot everything from the longest ranges to the biggest DG.

For a simple plains game safari one rifle is plenty. Even if you intend to shoot animals from steenbok to Eland in size. Each day when you leave the lodge, truck, tent camp or whatever you will be packing one rifle. How do you know which to bring? What will pop up that day? No safari outfitter will tell you not to bring two guns or tell you not to pack two around with you. However the reality of a plains game hunt is that animals can be seen each day from point blank to 300 yards. You may see a 25 pound steenbok or a 2000 pound Eland with each step you take.

It's not likely you will have the special application gun in your hands at the time you see the game you want. I know this because I get this question nearly every day on Safari. It starts over morning coffee. ........ Which gun should I bring today? What will the conditions be like? what are we likely to see?

My answer same as yesterday, bring the one you shoot best, we could see anything from Steenbok to Eland.

By the third day I hear this, I guess I should have left my XYZ gun at home, I never know when to bring it! Then they say: I wonder why so many guys talk about bringing two guns? you can only ever use one of them.

I suppose a spare gun is nice if you feel that there will be a breakdown of some sort. Well can anybody tell me what the odds or frequency of this is? I know of a single failure of a gun in with over 150 clients now. It was a catastophic failure of the poorly casted reciever of a Browning A bolt. The trigger guard and trigger sheared off flush with the action when it was shot and recoiled over a metal rail.

However in all other cases guns seem to be quite reliable. I cannot see any reason other then lack of confidence in your gun to remain intact, to bring two rifles along. I'm getting to the point now with each year that passes where I don't even see the need to bring a spare scope. However that is still a good idea because scopes are quite a bit more fragile, and do get a good bumping while hunting. I only bring one rifle for hunting with a single scope. I have been for many years now too.

If I were hunting for plains game as a sportsman I would choose the gun I shoot best from point blank to 300 yards with a 30 caliber bullet or bigger. I see absolutely no need to drag a specialty rifle 1/2 way around the world just to keep it in the lodge for the whole trip.

But,...... that's just my opinion based on what I see every year!

[ 04-10-2003, 04:23: Message edited by: JJHACK ]

I agree with the previous post. If you are good with the .264 bring it. I've seen them do great work on big aoudad in West Texas, and they are tough animals.

I think most people are going to tell you to leave it at home and take everything with the .375.

I'm not a big bore shooter so I'd go the other way. I'd leave the big boy at home.

Ngrumba,
My Dad is fond of his .264 WM and has carried it as his second rifle on several safaris. It has worked well on game from springbok and impala to hartebeest and kudu. It's all about bullet selection and shot placement. I disagree with the previous posting primarily because I've carried just one gun on a safari once. I had a gun problem and ended up hunting with my buddy so we could share his .338. I'm no expert having only been on 7 safaris but that trip taught me a lesson. When you're 8000 miles from home, always have a back-up plan and rifle!

Hi, when I go in 2004, im just taking my .308win in synthetic Howa with stainless action and barrel.
AJ

I do not even go deer hunting with just one gun. I shoot nearly everything with my Sako 375, from red flanked duiker to Livingston eland. However I have seen some strange things happen to rifles so I always bring a back up even though I have never had to use it.

Mike

Gentlemen,

I have only seen one client bring a .264 Win Mag on safari, but it seemed to work just fine for game up to and including kudu and gemsbok. I think if a hunter picks his shots right and uses a quality bullet such as a 140 gr. or 160 gr. Nosler, X-bullet, etc...it will work just fine. In Namibia, shots can be long and the .264 reaches out there pretty well.

Joel Slate
Slate & Associates, LLC
www.slatesafaris.com

7mm Rem Mag Page www.slatesafaris.com/7mm.htm

JJHACK

I'm interested - do you have a rifle available for clients if they need it?

I have always taken only one rifle with me, but having examined some of the PHs rifles they can be pretty rough and not like a client normally uses. One PH scope with the reticle way out of "square" but he still shot very well with it.

I would not have liked to use a couple of them if mine never arrived or failed somehow.

So I perhaps I might take two next time. One as a backup.

PS Another question - I have also wondered if you take two rifles out with you in the bakkie, is the second firearm safe sitting perhaps in an unoccupied open vehicle all day?

Sometimes there can be a lot of other people wandering around in the bush.

[ 04-10-2003, 15:25: Message edited by: NitroX ]

Ngrumba,
One question, please ... do you already have a .264 Winchester Magnum? If so, I would opine that it will suffice. Stateside, there are those who'll swear by it, up to and including elk and just as many who consider it light but there's little doubt of its' being at least adequate and the same would apply to African plainsgame, IMHO. However, if you're presently considering the purchase of a .264 for this purpose, I would suggest a heavier caliber. As to the bringing of a single one rifle, half way around the world, I disagree.

NitroX, yes I have a set of rifles for anyone who needs it. A 30/06 and a 375HH. Both have been shot extensively by clients. The 375HH last year was used for all the game shot by Canuck, one bullet per animal. It's a deadly tack driver of a rifle, with a 2.5-8 leupold. The other which is a 30/06 has a brand new SS Pac-nor barrel this year with a 3.5-10 Leupold scope. It will easily connect all the holes on a target at 100 yards. Those who have used my rifles have never complained and often stated they wish theirs were as good.

As far as leaving your sparerifle in the bakkie or truck it's never gonna be a problem with us. The place is to big and nobody is wandering around that we don't know about. It's a very exclusive area which is only used by our staff and our hunters.

It's not unusual in camp to have 5-6 hunters with a total of ten to twelve rifles. That's a heck of a selection of guns for plains game! I could understand hunting buffalo and plains game on the same trip. Then guys would likely bring a couple guns but only if they were hunting buffalo exclusive for the first part of the trip. If it were a combined hunt for all game at the same time then only a gun big enough for buffalo would make sense.

As I said it's easy to bring two guns, nobody is saying you should not. No outfitter, PH, or Booking agent will say "NO" to two guns. Even the governments will allow it. However for a simple plains game hunt I have been beginning to wonder if it's really that important.

When you read through the thousands of posts here that are so deliberate and detailed about gun choices and design, PF VS CRF and calibers, bullets and all the hoopla surrounding the best most perfect guns, scopes and bullets. It's a paradox to me that the same people think their wondergun which deserves all the argumentitive debate is somehow not going to hold up for ten days of hunting in Africa. That they actually need two guns incase the one they shoot 10 times or so during the trip will break. Why is that same gun so perfect and dependable in writing but not worth the risk in the bush? The 3000.00(plus) bucks for the custom big game rifle with the finest optics is not good enough to justify your trust?

I have hunted there a long time and I have brought two rifles for myself many times. It's only been over the last 4-5 years I have been wondering about that idea. Is it really vital to have two guns? No it's perfectly acceptable to have one rifle and hunt in Africa. You don't need to buy a backup or second gun to make a plains game hunt. Use the money wisely on additional trophy fees, a better scope, field glasses, or something that will make your wife happy!

That's it! I just dumped my spare keys in the fruit bowl, cancelled my collision insurance and took the spare tire out of my truck. Afterall .... I'm just brimming with confidence!

Here's my two cents: If you have a .264 Win Mag, you have confidence in it and you shoot it well, then take it. It's probably not the "ideal" rifle for the bigger stuff, but it will do.

I agree 100% with JJHack on the light/heavy rifle for plainsgame. If you carry both rifles in the truck, the tracker will invariably try to hand you the wrong rifle when you set out on a stalk. This may happen when you're in a rush because your PH has just spotted a huge kudu and he's about to move off. No time to argue or have to pantomime with the tracker about which gun you want. You would be better off taking one rifle with one bullet weight and type that you have developed confidence in from shooting extensively from field positions.

NitroX raises a good point about leaving a rifle in the vehicle unattended. It is probably fine on private land, but I would not leave a rifle behind in a government safari area where poachers may be present. Same goes even more for communal or Campfire areas in Zimbabwe, where there are villages in the hunting area.

If you decide to take one rifle and are torn between the light or heavy, take the heavy. The .375 is fine for everything from klipspringer to eland.

I think a perfect two gun battery for a southern Africa plainsgame hunt is a rifle and .12 ga shotgun. Take some 8's for doves and sandgrouse and 4's or 6's for guinea fowl.

JJHack

Thanks for the reply. I did assume you would have a decent rifle(s) for a client to borrow.

I was thinking more of Zimbabwe for the rifle in the landcruiser. Every property I have been to has had poachers in them, illegal gold prospectors, villagers wandering through the properties.

My first trip the PH left his .44 revolver on the dashbooard all day without anyone being miles nearby. My second trip the PH had a driver who generally stayed with the vehicle - which was great as sometimes he met us and saved a walk.

I do also think some people stress way too much about the nitty gritty details.

PS

Ngrumba,

I think a .264 Win Mag would make a great long range plains game calibre if the right bullets are used and if used well. The point blank range of that round is one of the best. (I don't have a 264 but the slower 6.5x55mm)

See Mike375's thread about using a .257 Wby Mag.

[ 04-10-2003, 19:54: Message edited by: NitroX ]

A .264 on a plainsgame Safari is fine...I see little need for a 375 for plainsgame, although it will work...I think the big bores are better suited for dangerous game, and some feel they need a big bore because it's Africa, not so!....I would suggest a 140 or 160 gr. "premium bullet" at no more than 2800 FPS.

I see little problem with taking two guns on Safari, I always do..It is about fun and games, and your paying for the hunt, do what you want.
There is always someone to carry an extra gun around our camps and they don't mind at all...

I have no experience with the 264, but based on it's reputation I believe that it would be fine for plains game. On the 2 versus 1 rifle debate; I took a 375 and 30-06 on my first hunt and a 375 only on my second. In the future I plan on taking a 375 only. If I take a second gun it will be a shotgun. I understand that sh*t happens, but it is rather unlikley that your gun would break. It the event that it does I have no problem using my PH's gun. On a 2X1 hunt I see no reason to take two guns, you and your buddy can share a rifle if one breaks.
If you are hunting elephant, or buffalo, and feel that you need a heavy gun, ie. 470NE or bigger, then you probably should bring a lighter rifle for plains game. If your are going to use a 375 for your heavy gun, then I would stick with it for everything.

Bottomline is, I could care less who brings along one rifle, his entire collection or eleven Iroquois warclubs, so long as it's his decision. Doing without benefit of a backup rifle is not the sort of thing one reccommends be done but, rather, rests within the realm of the individuals rationale. After all, it is he, and he alone, who must live with the outcome.