I have no familiarity w. private jets at all -- other than they're usually small, terrifying, and I never want to be anywhere near one... However, given all the problems with getting guns to Africa, and how much the airlines seem to jack the business/first rates during hunting season -- would it really be that hard to try and arrange a charter?

Again, I have no idea how many hunters you'd need to get together to be able to hire a big enough plane to reach Africa.

I've always wanted to introduce some obscenely wealthy friend to the virtues of African hunting and then talk him into flying us over in a private jet. If I figure out how to make that one work, I'll let everyone know.

For a mere $7000.00 USD an hour I can arrange for you a B-777 charter to anywhere you'd like to fly.

Figure about 35 hours flight time round trip. Which works out to about $245,000 USD. For 150 guys that is roughly $1,600.33 bucks per hunter. But there would have to be add ons for crew sit times and obviously the airplane wouldn't be able to sit for 10+ days while the hunting took place so you may well have to pay for a double round trip @ $3,400.00 per hunter still cheap considering that you'd have the plane to yourselves and plenty of room to stretch out.

If you'd like I can put you in touch with the people who arrange these things and they can give you a more accurate figure.

Right now I'm more just happy to know it's feasible, if difficult... (Part of me thinks that a flying BBQ to Africa would just be too cool.)

Kinda like "the bus" (Aggie Thing) but on a larger scale.

surestrike,

Possible to do Aglifter's suggestion? Yes!
Difficult? Yes!
Feasible? Yes!
Desired? Most definitely!

How many hunters on a typical sardine-run, jam-packed [except for first class!] virtually no legroom SAA Airbus during the hunting season?

How many Hunting Outfitters in South Africa would just LOVE to offer their clients an opportunity to fly to South Africa in decent comfort, and with legroom to spare? Sure I, for one, will want Andrew McLaren Safaris to be in on such a deal.

How many members, readers or visitors to this forum fly to South Africa each year? Is it feasible to get 150, or more, hunters to all go to South Africa at the same time, and return two weeks later? I'm one, and I know quite a few others HO's who would easily accommodate 10 or so for two weeks of plains game hunting and wingshooting.

Trick would be to get SAA and Delta scared of competition?

Can it be done? I hope so!

In good hunting.

Andrew McLaren.

Hi, Aglifter. Thanks for your good idea. This is an idea which was attempted before by a PH in South Africa, Stephen Barber: Xomaqua@mweb.co.za

About 5 years ago he brought his idea to Safari-Club International to see how many other PHs from Africa would support it. The idea (Called "Safari-Flight") included a flight dedicated to hunters, discounts on hunting and special treatment on board and special treatment on landing. As I recall, the problem was not with the airlines or the financing, it was with the PHs. It seems that none of them would support it. Anyway, Stephen can give you all the first hand feedback. Maybe a different approach is all that is needed. Thanks for your interest. Bill

It can be done. In another life I used to arrange charters for civilian contractors into South Vietnam but that was long ago and I have no inclination to start that again. If anyone else would like to pursue this idea then I would recommend contacting air freight companies and tell them that you want to utilize their deadhead space rather than contracting for a solid block of time. Also if you utilize a large capacity aircraft it would too hard to sell all the seats/space and it would inundate a particular area with too many hunters and not enough PHs to handle the business at one particular time.

Good luck on this idea. I'd be interested in buying a seat if you can put it together.

Sounds feasable, particularly if you do multiple destinations.

For example, most direct flights from the U.S. East go first to Johannesburg, then transfer from there. If a charter flight were to stop first in Windhoek to deplane its Namibian hunters, then proceed on to Johannesburg, it would make a lot of sense in that the two hour shorter Transatlantic hop would mean virtually no likelihood of needing to divert to some place like Dakar for refuling and an aircraft with a slightly shorter maximum range could be utilized. From Johannesburg the plane could hop on to Botswanna or wherever, negating the need for hunters who are not stopping in South Africa to go through S.A. customs. Dropping hunters at three or four destinations would solve the problem of exceeding the capacity of any one area to absorb hunters during a given time frame.

Great, ya'll work out the details, and I'll go start figuring out what to stock the bar with, and how to put a gimbaled BBQ pit on a plane

How do airport fees apply to charters? Would it be better to try and arrange fly from one city, such as Houston, or try to go from multiple? (Seems like it would add a lot of time, booze, and fuel to go bouncing across the US on the way to Africa, but it would make it easier for everyone to travel w. their guns.

If a single city in the US is used, I think the easiest thing to do would be to send the ammo all to that one location, rather than worry about the 11kg issue, and, maybe, ship the guns as well.

The multiple locations in Africa does seem to make a great deal of sense -- just be sure to avoid Jo'burg if possible -- between Zambia, Botswana, Namibia, and some other place in S. Africa, it probably wouldn't be too hard.

I looked into this briefly last year. The idea is to have a weekly flight to WDH then on to JNB, pick up the returning hunters, and so on. Hunters would then have to spend multiples of one week on the ground. No big issue there. There would only be one "deadhead" flight per season, ie. the second one. I couldn't get a leasing company to even quote me on a plane. You need a long range jet to fly nonstop E Coast to WDH, there are only a couple of models capable of doing that leg. The other issue, that I didn't grapple with in detail, is there is a legal distinction between a private charter and a scheduled service using a leased plane. For the latter, both the departing country and the arrival country's airline authorities have to approve the flight. I figure neither Namibia or SA would approve such a thing, as it would take a chunk out of their passenger counts and since the airlines are state-run, the state isn't that stupid. If someone knows better, please let me know.

What caused me to lose interest was SAA's announcement that they would begin nonstop service E Coast to JNB, and Delta's announcement that they would be adding flights on the same route. That would (or should) put a ceiling on fares. Not sure what has transpired this season regarding fares. Last year economy to JNB was $1.5K to $2K depending on how smart a shopper you were.

If Namibia and RSA won't go for it, some of the smaller countries -- such as Zambia or Botswana might.

quote:

(Called "Safari-Flight")

Zimbabwe very urgently need forex. They would probably jump at a chance, even if most hunters would be from USA!

Chartering does not restrict passengers to baggage limitations other than those imposed by the chartering agent or sponsoring group (and, of course, weight/volume capacity of the chartered aircraft). This could be advantageous not only for those who want to bring the max number of guns and ammo allowable by the host country along with laptops, portable TV/DVD combos, surround sound stereos, and other things you just live without, but also for the hunter who scored on twenty trophies and wants to bring back the hide, horns, and skull, not to mention the 7-foot high giraffe wood carvings.

Aircraft can be chartered not only from specific charter companies but also from airlines that provide regular passenger service. Show them the money or tell them you are willing to put down a substantial deposit and they will listen. Who will be the contract responsible agent for such a hunters' group? No. Not me - I'm retired.

The amount of cash that can be generated from large groups of hunters into a host country would more than offset the lost of passenger revenue of individuals ticketed on government-owned airlines. The flights from Europe to RSA or Namibia are usually full and not all of them are hunters. Also, not every hunter will be coming from the USA (right now, the majority of the hunters going into Namibia are from Germany).

It would be helpful to contact hunting associations in Africa and ask for their recommendations/advice/blessings on bringing, all at one time, a large group of individual hunters, each with separate dreams. Some PH members of those associations may benefit from such an influx in that hunters that don't really know how to get what they really want can be distributed out to PHs who have some lag time between already booked hunts.

The hardest part of all this is getting 50 hunters and their time and money together. You bring the money and the airline will do the rest.

If someone can get this together I'll buy a seat.