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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting I think it's overGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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I think the days of hunting Africa are just about over for the average and even upper middle class guy. With the economy headed the way it is and tax increases on the horizon it is all but inevitable. It will soon again be what it was 35 years ago...a sport only for the truly wealthy. I am truly thankful for the opportunity to have hunted the Dark Continent twice during the past decade which I think will turn out to have been the pinnacle. Somebody please tell me I'm wrong. ______________________ I'm not a great hunter...just a guy who loves to hunt. | ||
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Actually, I do expect that you're wrong. U.S. tax rates are unlikely to increase in the short to medium term -- the House of Representatives won't let it happen. Obama wants to eliminate the "Bush tax cuts" for just those making over $200K/year, but that won't happen either -- the argument for that doesn't hold any water at all, it's simply the kind of punitive move that leftists love, lacking any real benefit to anybody anywhere, but causing lots of harm to the economy. The higher probability is that the tax code will likely be restructured to eliminate some deductions and "loopholes" in exchange for lower rates. There's nothing but good in that. As for the health of the broad economy -- we're going through a rough patch for sure, but the way to prosperity is clear and not complex. The only real reason that the recession has hung on so long is that we have a Marxist in the White House and his ideology won't let him do what is necessary -- he still thinks that Marxism works and he will never believe anything else. He's not very bright but he did learn the Communist Manifesto by rote. Hopefully, the American electorate is brighter than the President and will have the good sense to send him the way of Jimmy Carter. If they do, we're only a few years away from full recovery -- if not, just add four to six years to that estimate. But, whenever it happens, America's recovery will ensure recovery of the world economy. When you get bored with life, start hunting dangerous game with a handgun. | |||
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Well said OHG. I think you are most likely correct. . | |||
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The American electorate is brighter than they voted last time. They are also faddish and driven to feel good. We have wars we are in where no person is supposed to die and when a handful do - on either side- a great moan erupts. Some how some way common sense must return along with international responsibility. When that happens the world economy will improve and maybe then I can go to the Dark Continent. | |||
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I HOPE stevie is wrong and I HOPE OHG and the rest of you are correct! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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stevie - 3 words: never give up. Even if you don't make it back, the day you stop dreaming is the day you stop living. | |||
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It know that things are bad everywhere, but it would help if the price of a safari would drop. In many places prices have gotten totally out of hand...Tanzania, Zambia, Botswana, etc $2,000 + for day rate?? Now add the rip-off Govt. fee's, air charter and it's become something for the wealthy only. Obviously we are still booking hunts at those prices so the demand is still there. What if we refused to pay such high prices??? I think that Tanzania would become much more "affordable" Just my 2cents | |||
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+1 on TZ | |||
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I am glad to have killed two very fine buffalo in Tanzania at the beginning of the last decade and at the prices they are charging now they can kiss my big white buttock right in the middle. I'm done with TZ. The Charter fee's being charged in TZ are criminal and the daily rates are STOOOPID!! These things have a way of correcting themselves however. I have hunted Africa six times in the last ten years and always think about going back but after my last fiasco the shine has worn off to the point where I "think" I enjoy my memories more than the thought of going again. I am even contemplating selling my DG rifles. My hunting goals are now pointed at some serious North American hunting in my home and neighboring states. It's high time I put a BIG mule deer on the wall and a BIG elk and I am sure to draw a bighorn tag any year now and my Shiras moose number is just about up too. I finally drew a mountain goat tag this year after 12 years of drawing. Until some things change on my end and on "their" end that is where my new focus is going to be. | |||
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I think you are wrong. There are safaris of all shapes and sizes. The biggest and the best have always been expensive and they have always been out of reach of the "average" guy. What is not out of reach of the average guy are the following: 1. Plains game hunts 2. Buffalo cow hunts 3. End of year buffalo hunts 4. Tuskless hunts 5. Cancellation and short notice hunts for buffalo, leopard, or bull elephant. I'd say an average guy who watches his money, plans carefully, can travel on short notice and gets a little lucky could manage to shoot three of the big four over ten to fifteen years. He might also make a couple of PG trips and accumulate 15 to 20 species of dangerous and common game. That's not bad for an average guy. Will J. Parks, III | |||
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Another way for the average guy to get to Africa is to purchase an auction hunt at SCI or DSC. We've all seen what those 10 day PG hunts sell for . . . pennies. I made my first two trips (at 23 and 25 years of age BTW) on those types of hunts. Will J. Parks, III | |||
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It appears to me that hunters are a lot more up-beat and optimistic than the average bear. Never give up, gentlemen. I'm proud to be a member of the clan. | |||
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I must disagree. It's a conspiracy among the Leninists, the Neo-Conservatives and the old school Ku Klux Klan aimed squarely at us right-thinking centrists. Kidding aside, it's bad - as bad as it's been in our lifetimes. But I do believe that we must have patience, as this, too, will pass. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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No other choice than patience for me Mike! I'm only 42 and am figuring on another 30 years of employment, 40 years of life and maybe 35 to 38 years of hunting. | |||
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Saeed - maybe we need a investing forum - share some rational investing ideas - maybe we get a good stock or bond or investment lead (note not tip but a lead to do more work/research) to allow us to make money to go hunting I am pretty sure other members of this site must have pretty board and diverse industry experience and knowledge RGR (ruger) and CAB (cabelas) have been great stocks - i tend not to invest in hunting/firearms stuff as i may get emotionally attached. Just my 2 cents | |||
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Whatever happens to global economies, the pinnacle of hunting in Africa was a long, long time before the last decade. | |||
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For some it may not be too late but for me it is over. At 77 years of age and mediocre health I will not be returning to Africa for that final hunt. I was luck enough after my wife died to make 8 trips and take a lot of game. I managed this because i worked well past retirement and was able to start drawing Soc Sec while working with no great penalty.I was also fortunate enough to have a small 401k/retirement plan I was able to draw while still working (due to a company sell out). Then i was hit by the tech bubble burst which pretty well stopped my investment income as I was heavily invested in tech stocks. Have been trying since to save up for another trip but now the market is just barely keeping close to but not quite even as applies to my income. Have had no social security increases and don't ever expect another and since I can't really increase my presence in the stock market I have no real anticipation of any more funds being available for another hunt no matter how small. I am deaf in my left ear and wear a hearing aid. The aid is reaching it's end of life (average 3-5 years) and replacement will not be the $900 I paid for this one but $1200 for the same aid. Gasoline prices go up and last month I reached the ultimate position where there was a rise in the Pima County sewer rates and I now pay more for disposing of my waste water than I do for purchasing that water. I am diabetic and all my drug prices including insulin have gone up. No matter what the changes in government are I see little reason to be optimistic that my financial situation will do anything but deterioate in the future. I feel no matter what happens there will have to be significent changes in entitlement programs that will directly affect me (and millions of others who I am sure are in similar straits). I hope I am wrong but fear I am not so for me the African hunting is truley at an end. SCI Life Member NRA Patron Life Member DRSS | |||
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I agree 100% with you Will, There are plenty of great hunts to do at a good savings, just got to do your homework. Thanks! Brian Clark Blue Skies Hunting Adventures www.blueskieshunting.com Email at: info@blueskieshunting.com African Cape Trophy Safaris www.africancapesafaris.com Email at: brian@africancapesafaris.com 1-402-689-2024 | |||
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There are lots of little ways to dave as well. For me I put every bill and buy everything I can with my TD Visa card. It gives me 2% back in travel costs. After a couple years it pays for the flights at least. I pay the card off every month so I do not owe interest and it helps me in the long run. | |||
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That's what I do with my CIBC Aeroplan card....Except Air Canada doesn't fly to Africa. Everywhere else but Africa. Too bad, as I have 120 000 points! 375 Ruger- The NEW KING of the .375's!! | |||
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With TD's plan you get a certain point per what you spend like the others but the best part is that I can buy any flight,hotel,car rental or other travel purchase even on sale prices and then just call them up and they take off the money from my credit card. I can use any airline or hotel or whatever I want and they will take the amount of money earned towards it and take it off the bill. My dad collected tons of air miles with his business and that plan sucked as he was only allowed to fly with certain airlines and certain flights and had all kinds of layovers and such. With TD Aeroplan you don't have to worry about the head aches and the crap. | |||
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I hope it aint over i havent gone yet. Ill be booking my first african hunt at this years DSC show. After reading this site, watching saeds videos and reading any african book i can get my hands on, i lay awake and night excited for the first trip. | |||
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If you save up your money, you will get to Africa. An old concept, but one that works. There will always be market forces at work and always an outfitter or PH prepared to undercut the guy next door. | |||
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How many times must I endure the sniveling of people who want but will not sacrifice? I don't know you but I will bet real money that either: 1. You made decisions in your past that make hunting in Africa more difficult BUT not impossible. Or 2. You don't really WANT to hunt Africa because you will not give up what you must give up to do it. I'm sorry but this character flaw really pisses me off. | |||
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Absolutely true that..^^^^ If you want it bad enough you'll find a way. In my case I have become a bit burned out on the whole procedure. The toil and extra work to put the money and time together is becoming greater than the joy of the hunt for me. | |||
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SG OLDS I assume that was addressed to me. You're wrong on both counts. I've hunted Africa and made the sacrifices you mentioned. I continue to make financial sacrifices to hunt and fish all the time. I agree that Africa is still affordable today and if prices stay at relatively the same levels, I intend to return. My lament was meant to be about hunting Africa in the future in general. If the worldwide economy continues on its current path for any significant length of time, I think it's over for the average guy. By average I mean the guy who has to work and save for years to come up with the $10K to $20K to pull it off. When fewer hunters make the journey, I think operators will either shutter their doors or be forced to raise prices significantly. I hope I'm wrong. ______________________ I'm not a great hunter...just a guy who loves to hunt. | |||
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***Bite my ass you arrogant bastard!*** I can well afford Africa I've been there more than a dozen times yet I agree that charter flights, Gov't fees and insane day rates have drive DG safaris well past a point most working stiffs can swing..of course they never were cheap. | |||
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+1, 2th doc! Not only the falling economy but take a guy like me, who is in advanced age,ill health and on a retirement and social security income! The African hunting was fairly easy while I was working, and younger so had time to replace what little money I had saved and from investments I had. Now it is hard even for the working stiff to come up with $15K all in for a damn Cape buffalo hunt, then add texidermy on top of that and a failing economy depleteing his savings, it is hard for even a young guy, and almost imposible for a guy like me who refuses to leave my wife destitute, when I will likely die before her, so I can shoot buffalo! Get a gripe fellows there comes a time when gritting your teeth and letting the chips fall where they may comes to an end! When I first started hunting Africa, Alaska, and Canada the airfare was FREE for me because I worked for the world's largest airline at that time, and My pay imcome was far higher than today. I had pleanty of time to replace what I spent as well. Not now! So I guess what I'm saying is don't paint everyone with the same brush you are painted with, as the economy is a far more serious thing to some of us than others! In my case I have to enjoy the hunts the guys who still aford them in the hunt reports here and other places! .......................................  ....Mac >>>===(x)===> MacD37, ...and DUGABOY1 DRSS Charter member "If I die today, I've had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"~ME 1982 Hands of Old Elmer Keith  | |||
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Stevie, I couldn't disagree with you more. Safari has always been expensive. You figure out what you want to do and make a plan to get there. Very few of us can just write a check and go but with a little planning safari is possible for a great many people. If you look at safari as something additional to everything else your doing it's going to be tough unless your wealthy. You need to make the safari a priority and work toward the goal of booking what you want. It might take a couple of years or even more to get your funds together but there is nothing to equal the safari experience. I do get some financial considerations on safaris but I still can't go every year. It takes some sacrifices. For instance I just last October bought my first new vehicle since '94. I don't own a boat, motorcycle or 4 wheeler. Other than a few NA hunts with operators I represent in the US my hunting is focused on safari. Without this focus I couldn't go to Africa at all. Make a plan!!!! Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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No matter how good or bad a situation is, you can be assured it will change. I suspect it will be around in some form or another, certainly different tomorrow than it was yesterday. For those who want it. They will find a way. | |||
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Most people seem to disagree with my thoughts and that is a good thing. I want to be wrong on this one. I hope my 1 week old son (born on my 40th birthday) will have the same opportunity I had (and maybe will continue to have)to enjoy the greatest hunting destination on earth. ______________________ I'm not a great hunter...just a guy who loves to hunt. | |||
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Stevie if the economy continues in it's present direction and you have some cash and you don't mind hunting in hot weather, I think you will see some super deals come ;up this year.  If you own a gun and you are not a member of the NRA and other pro 2nd amendment organizations then YOU are part of the problem. | |||
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