Anyone having trouble getting their deposits back on a cancellation?

Is this supposed to be a trick question?

Unless it's clearly stated otherwise, I assume a deposit belongs to the outfitter. When he takes your/my booking (with the agreed deposit) both parties have made commitments. You have a commitment for the agreed hunt and the outfitter stops efforts to sell the space. As time runs out, I suspect the chance of selling to backfill following a cancellation gets increasingly slim.

Most of those late breaking great deals we sometimes see probably result from late cancellations. I doubt that simply keeping the deposit benifits the outfitter nearly as much as selling the agreed hunt...

Regards,

Not a trick question at all.

Scenario - you make a deposit 2 years in advance. You have a 180 day 100% refund clause in your agreement with the agent. You can cancel for any reason. You cancel 181 days before the hunt - contract says you get 100% refund.

Question - is anyone out there having trouble getting deposits back?

A deposit is a bond. You put up your money to secure something. The PH/Outfitter/Guide ties up that date/slot to you. IMHO should you back out, then as a matter of honor you should consider it a done deal. I've recently committed to some hunts but due to illness in the family I couldn't go. Nonetheless I felt compelled to write a check and pay for what I committed to.

I'm not into excuses.

Man Up! My word is worth more than some bucks.

It is actually NOT complicated at all, these are some basic rule of the thumb points that will/should prevent any issues arising

Basically in the contract between hunter and outfitter/agent/PH/landowner or whomever, it normally has a deposit component.

IE: 40% deposit NOT REFUNDIBLE if the hunt is cancelled say 6 months or less from the agreed commencement date.

If the hunt is cancelled say 6 months or more from the commencement date the deposit LESS 10% is returned

The hunter must/should at his own discression take out ALL APPROPRIATE insurance cover for medical accident and/or trip cancellation.

If the above rules are followed there are VERY SELDOM any grounds from either party for complaint.

Remember an oufitter holds a hunt date in good faith upon receipt of the deposit and then cant allocate that date to others and has to turn away all future enquiries for that date, so there is a legal and moral responsibility on the hunter to cover his own backside if he falls ill or has any other unforseen circumstances.

Cheers, Peter

What Peter said!

We will try and sell a safari again, but in the event this does not happen then we are already committed to the concessionaire or landowner in most circumstances.
Most every time the outfitter will do his best to help his client though.

We don't get many cancellations and when we do, we try to help as much as we can, but do also have the safari contract with full stipulated cancellation policy spelled out to fall back on.

quote:

Originally posted by Vinny:
you make a deposit 2 years in advance. You have a 180 day 100% refund clause in your agreement with the agent. You can cancel for any reason. You cancel 181 days before the hunt - contract says you get 100% refund.

This is pretty clear. Most deposits are non-refundable. If the contract says it is refundable, then it is.

No one has answered Vinny's question yet..., but posters have sharpened the issue:

Has anyone cancelled within the terms of his contract and failed to receive his deposit back?

Regards

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Carney:
No one has answered Vinny's question yet..., but posters have sharpened the issue:

Has anyone cancelled within the terms of his contract and failed to receive his deposit back?

Regards

Yeah, funny how everyone is ignoring the question.

RIF

Course, it could be because no-one has had that problem........

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
We don't get many cancellations and when we do, we try to help as much as we can, but do also have the safari contract with full stipulated cancellation policy spelled out to fall back on.

I had a contract with Steve once. When the trip had to be cancelled, he gave me a choice of applying my deposit to another type hunt or a 100% refund as provided for in that particular contract (the cancellation was not on my part, but the gov't).

I know Steve well and thought the world of him. I was correct in my assessment. Without complaint or b.s., Steve promptly complied with our contract and refunded the money (a substancial amount). A fiscally sound and honest operator is nice!

I had the same results with Ron Oliver last year. He, too, followed his contract to the letter.

I'd use either gentlemen again.

Steve, I have one question, how would the hunter ever know if the hunt was re sold? As to the question on the board from what was posted it is a done deal the deposit is due the hunter. I personally don't know fo a hunt I would book that far out with out a 100% refund if cancelled 60 mo prior to the hunt and no retainage on the part of the outfitter. I would also never book a hunt where the total of the hunt is due prior to my being finished with the hunt.

DOJ,

It's really up to the safari company concerned to tell you if it's resold. Pick the right company in the first place and they'll treat you ethically. In the same way that they'll give you the refund, they'll also tell you it's resold.

A good company should at least provide you with a contract that stipulates the cancellation policy. These might help:

http://www.shakariconnection.com/hunt-contract.html

http://www.shakariconnection.c...ellation-policy.html

http://www.shakariconnection.c...ellation-policy.html

What, then, is the role of the agent in all of this? The agent receives the check, the agent handles the contract, the agent transfers money, the agent is the go-between but what is the agent's role in sorting something like this out?

Well, the contract may well be with the agent. In that case the money is due from him, if the agent just lined the hunt up with an outfitter and the contarcat is with the outfitter, then the outfitter owes the refund. Looks pretty clean cut to me. Terms of cancellation should be spelled out. I with one of the others, I won't contract where no cancellation is possible and definately agree with him on the prepayment of the total price. If I did sign up for a no cancellation hunt, then I would think the only option is trip insurance that may or may not pay off. Just my thoughts and I don't ask you to agree.

Trip insurance is always a good idea whether you have a safari contract or not. For example, even with a good contract and cancellation policy in place, if you have to cancel your safari at very short notice (let's say just a few days) due to illness etc, you're not going to get a refund simply because licences, permits, salaries etc have all been paid and the outfitter won't be able to re-sell the trip at just a couple of days notice....... so then the policy kicks in and you get your money back.

We don's use agents, so I can't really comment much on what use they are......... from my limited experience, they're mostly about as much use as a one legged man at an arse kicking party!

Sorry, I was joking and before I get attacked by every agent on the forum, I should say that if you can get a good, experienced agent that knows his business properly, they can be useful....... there are however an awful lot of them out there who are nothing more than instant experts who are nothing more than a liability.

Be carefull with "trip insurance". I had that for my last trip, 2008, and it turned out to be useless to me after filing a claim. It was thru a reputable company that does specialize in travel/trip insurance and not just for hunting safaris. In the end because I didn't follow one of the insuring companies requirements that was NOT spelled out in the details I received from them after purchasing said insurance, I ended up getting a "nice" rejection letter after filing a cancelled trip claim (used their required forms and added a lenthy explanation letter also).

All is not lost tho as the safari outfitter in SA (who does post on this board), has agreed in emails and principal so far to carry my paid deposit forward for a hunt in 2010.

I also had as part of that trip a hunt planned into Zim and that was cancelled at the "safari outfitters recommednation" due to potential safety issues on their concessions in ZIM and was promised a refund because of that. While it took several months and was spread over two refund payments, I did get most (95%) of that deposit money back, mostly minus some banking electronic xfer fees (as if sending/receiving stuff by computer/wire xfer should have really cost me that much, but hey in the end I feel pretty good that I got that money back.

All in the cost of doing business in African hunting, now if I can just get my raw trophies back from last Mays Namibia hunt, but that too I'm sure will still happen.

bisonhunter1, isn't it funny when you are sending funds to the outfitters in Africa you stand the trans fees and when they are sending you money back you still have to stand the fees. If the hunt was cancelled on their suggestion I would think you should get a full refund plus and appropriate amount of interest as they had the use of the funds for a period of time, in fact that should be the case with any hunt deposit. They say they need the deposit for covering expenses of the hunt that are incured prior to the hunt. Does anyone understand the term "working capital", I know in my firm we incure many costs prior to providing the service and I would never have the balls to ask a client to front me funds for my costs incured prior to the engagement.

yeah, gotta love them banking xfer fees, and i agree with you, but hey, I'm glad I got back what I did in the end. at least this way i can look forward to the next trip (tho the economy and my daughters impending marriage sure are't helping either, lol)

quote:

IE: 40% deposit NOT REFUNDIBLE if the hunt is cancelled say 6 months or less from the agreed commencement date.
If the hunt is cancelled say 6 months or more from the commencement date the deposit LESS 10% is returned

I've found the rules above honest.

I had only one experience, it happened with a friend of mine whose father was clearly going to pass some time before the safari (2x1) start. He, obviously, remained in Italy near his dad and I hunted 1x1 on a 1x2 package. My friend had to delay his trip not for one but for two years (broken hand 20 days before the departure) The problem has been solved easily, I paid for my part of a 2x1 hunt, he did not loose a penny and I was on safari again.

At the end I paid my first safari like a 2x1 instead for 1x1 as I was.

An agreement, a very good agreement is always possible to manage.